• TV
  • MOVIES
  • MUSIC
  • SHOWBIZ
  • SOAPS
  • GAMING
  • TECH
  • FORUMS
  • Follow
    • Follow
    • facebook
    • twitter
    • google+
    • instagram
    • youtube
Hearst Corporation
  • TV
  • MOVIES
  • MUSIC
  • SHOWBIZ
  • SOAPS
  • GAMING
  • TECH
  • FORUMS
Forums
  • Register
  • Login
  • Forums
  • TV
  • Doctor Who
I think I've found a pattern to the cracks
<<
<
1 of 2
>>
>
trevf
30-05-2010
No, not a pattern to it's shape, but a pattern to when it appears.

Reading this post got me thinking about it.

I will spoiler out bits that give away story points.

IIRC we have seen the crack in:

1 - The Eleventh Hour -
Spoiler
Amy's wall

2 - The Beast Below -
Spoiler
On the side of the Space Whale / Ship at the end of the Episode

3 - Victory of the Daleks -
Spoiler
Behind the Tardis when it leaves the War Rooms

4 - Time of Angels + Flesh and Stone -
Spoiler
The control room on the Byzantium and the back wall of the forest

5 - Cold Blood -
Spoiler
As they are leaving the cave


Now what I have noticed...

1 -
Spoiler
The crack is already in the wall, but at this time it's more of a hole through space and time than a gateway to nothingness (as Prisoner Zero escapes through it). However could it have become something more when the Doctor 'sonic'd' it?
As lots of people have already pointed out, whilst Amelia is waiting in the garden we hear the Tardis but do not see it (a visit from a later Doctor?). The Doctor then returns 12 years late and gets caught by Amy. The next thing we know the cloister bell is ringing in the Tardis (this only happens at major events).
Could the Cracks in space and time be caused by two Tardises (or should that be Tardi?) appearing at the same time?


2 -
Spoiler
No second Tardis, or was there?
When Amy is in the voting room she sees a video message from herself, but she had no time to record this message during the episode... So this must be a future Amy coming back to leave herself a warning - Future Amy suggests Future Tardis.

3 -
Spoiler
I can't think of a second Tardis in this episode or any future events that happened in it (although if any one else can please add it). The only thing I can suggest here is the same as in the post above, that the Eleventh Doctor was crossing the Ninth Doctor's timeline... So that would be two Tardi again.

4 -
Spoiler
It seems very likely that a future Doctor came to Amy in the forest to tell her to remember something he told her when she was 7... Future Doctor - Second Tardis.

5 -
Spoiler
Again I can't think of a future Tardis in this episode (feel free to add) but we do have current Amy and Rory seeing a future Amy and Rory (although not up close), and we now have an engagement ring on board the Tardis that should never have existed, and I suppose a piece of a second Tardis.


Spoiler
So could the two things that should never have met, and caused the crack be two separate instances of the same Tardis?
Could the old Tardis (Tenth Doctor's) have been destroyed during 'The Eleventh Hour@ by a future Tardis - Causing a Paradox, hence the Cloister bell ringing?
Will the Pandorica be a device to repair the Paradox?
If this is correct and the Paradox is repaired then could the last part of this series be the Doctor coming back for seven year old Amelia and starting their journey all over, but this time on the correct timeline?

Other hints towards this are:
Amelia is a great name, sounds like it's from a Fairy Story, and Riversong saying that we are all just fairy tales - are these hinting that this entire series is just a Fairy Story that only the Doctor will remember?
A duck pond that has never had any ducks would be a pond... Is a duck pond with no ducks possible or is it a paradox (of types)?


Or have I overdosed on BBQ's and just need some quiet time until I get better?
littlebird22
30-05-2010
Did the crack not also appear on the Tardis keyhole at the end of Vampires of Venice?
trevf
30-05-2010
Originally Posted by littlebird22:
“Did the crack not also appear on the Tardis keyhole at the end of Vampires of Venice?”

Ok there's another one. Anything wibbly wobbley timey wimey in VoV?
allen_who
30-05-2010
Last nights twist with the Doc retrieving a scorched piece of the Tardis from the crack in time seems to imply (to me) that the crack itself is caused by the Tardis being destroyed. Maybe the crack is in fact what happens when a Tardis is obliterated?

Anyone else got some thoughts about this?
MrChicken
30-05-2010
Originally Posted by allen_who:
“Last nights twist with the Doc retrieving a scorched piece of the Tardis from the crack in time seems to imply (to me) that the crack itself is caused by the Tardis being destroyed. Maybe the crack is in fact what happens when a Tardis is obliterated?

Anyone else got some thoughts about this?”

I still have a horrible feeling that we've not seen the last of the DreamLord. I hope I'm wrong - it could be way too much of a cop out.
Abomination
30-05-2010
Originally Posted by allen_who:
“Last nights twist with the Doc retrieving a scorched piece of the Tardis from the crack in time seems to imply (to me) that the crack itself is caused by the Tardis being destroyed. Maybe the crack is in fact what happens when a Tardis is obliterated?

Anyone else got some thoughts about this?”

A TARDIS is destroyed and all the events it visited are being rewritten as a result of it not existing- this would be an interesting possibility. But it still leaves the question as to what causes the destruction of the TARDIS in the first place, as I do not really think it involves the Ten-Eleven regeneration- it just doesn't feel like Moffat would base an entire series arc over the final plot thread that was RTD's (although I know Moffat had an input on this I think)
Ibdolent
30-05-2010
Just a theory of mine, but what if the Tardis is 'splintered' throughout time itself? That might explain the references between The City Of Death's 'crack in time' and ths series that I've been reading on other forums.

If that is the case, how did the Tardis get splintered? Answers on a postcard...
icemetallica8
30-05-2010
Originally Posted by trevf:
“No, not a pattern to it's shape, but a pattern to when it appears.

Reading this post got me thinking about it.

I will spoiler out bits that give away story points.

IIRC we have seen the crack in:

1 - The Eleventh Hour -
Spoiler
Amy's wall

2 - The Beast Below -
Spoiler
On the side of the Space Whale / Ship at the end of the Episode

3 - Victory of the Daleks -
Spoiler
Behind the Tardis when it leaves the War Rooms

4 - Time of Angels + Flesh and Stone -
Spoiler
The control room on the Byzantium and the back wall of the forest

5 - Cold Blood -
Spoiler
As they are leaving the cave


Now what I have noticed...

1 -
Spoiler
The crack is already in the wall, but at this time it's more of a hole through space and time than a gateway to nothingness (as Prisoner Zero escapes through it). However could it have become something more when the Doctor 'sonic'd' it?
As lots of people have already pointed out, whilst Amelia is waiting in the garden we hear the Tardis but do not see it (a visit from a later Doctor?). The Doctor then returns 12 years late and gets caught by Amy. The next thing we know the cloister bell is ringing in the Tardis (this only happens at major events).
Could the Cracks in space and time be caused by two Tardises (or should that be Tardi?) appearing at the same time?


2 -
Spoiler
No second Tardis, or was there?
When Amy is in the voting room she sees a video message from herself, but she had no time to record this message during the episode... So this must be a future Amy coming back to leave herself a warning - Future Amy suggests Future Tardis.

3 -
Spoiler
I can't think of a second Tardis in this episode or any future events that happened in it (although if any one else can please add it). The only thing I can suggest here is the same as in the post above, that the Eleventh Doctor was crossing the Ninth Doctor's timeline... So that would be two Tardi again.

4 -
Spoiler
It seems very likely that a future Doctor came to Amy in the forest to tell her to remember something he told her when she was 7... Future Doctor - Second Tardis.

5 -
Spoiler
Again I can't think of a future Tardis in this episode (feel free to add) but we do have current Amy and Rory seeing a future Amy and Rory (although not up close), and we now have an engagement ring on board the Tardis that should never have existed, and I suppose a piece of a second Tardis.


Spoiler
So could the two things that should never have met, and caused the crack be two separate instances of the same Tardis?
Could the old Tardis (Tenth Doctor's) have been destroyed during 'The Eleventh Hour@ by a future Tardis - Causing a Paradox, hence the Cloister bell ringing?
Will the Pandorica be a device to repair the Paradox?
If this is correct and the Paradox is repaired then could the last part of this series be the Doctor coming back for seven year old Amelia and starting their journey all over, but this time on the correct timeline?

Other hints towards this are:
Amelia is a great name, sounds like it's from a Fairy Story, and Riversong saying that we are all just fairy tales - are these hinting that this entire series is just a Fairy Story that only the Doctor will remember?
A duck pond that has never had any ducks would be a pond... Is a duck pond with no ducks possible or is it a paradox (of types)?


Or have I overdosed on BBQ's and just need some quiet time until I get better?”

On point 2

Spoiler
Amy recorded a message between when she clicked forget and when she actually forgot.
No.6
30-05-2010
Originally Posted by Abomination:
“A TARDIS is destroyed and all the events it visited are being rewritten as a result of it not existing- this would be an interesting possibility. But it still leaves the question as to what causes the destruction of the TARDIS in the first place, as I do not really think it involves the Ten-Eleven regeneration- it just doesn't feel like Moffat would base an entire series arc over the final plot thread that was RTD's (although I know Moffat had an input on this I think) ”

Think we are still expecting the new BMW Mini-Daleks to appear in the last 2 episodes...or are we?
allen_who
30-05-2010
Originally Posted by Abomination:
“A TARDIS is destroyed and all the events it visited are being rewritten as a result of it not existing- this would be an interesting possibility. But it still leaves the question as to what causes the destruction of the TARDIS in the first place, as I do not really think it involves the Ten-Eleven regeneration- it just doesn't feel like Moffat would base an entire series arc over the final plot thread that was RTD's (although I know Moffat had an input on this I think) ”

Maybe it's worse than that? Maybe if a Tardis is destroyed it not only wipes people from existence but also maybe the whole universe - taking everything right back to the 'Big Bang'. What could cause it? well my money is on Omega. I also see that they have
Spoiler
roman guards at Stonehenge with Arthur Darvil playing one of them
in the season finale, so it's going to be fun finding out what happens
No.6
30-05-2010
Originally Posted by allen_who:
“Maybe it's worse than that? Maybe if a Tardis is destroyed it not only wipes people from existence but also maybe the whole universe - taking everything right back to the 'Big Bang'. What could cause it? well my money is on Omega. I also see that they have
Spoiler
roman guards at Stonehenge with Arthur Darvil playing one of them
in the season finale, so it's going to be fun finding out what happens ”

Spoiler
Big Bang I assume is the noise the Tardis makes when it blows up! Perhaps causing the end of the universe instead of its birth, a reverse big bang!
sleepydove
30-05-2010
The future Doctor stuff all feels very Harry Potter from the Prisoner of Azkaban when they have to go back in time to fix things.
DazerUK
30-05-2010
At this point in time we don't know whether the TARDIS caused the explosion or was itself caught up in the blast from something else exploding.
JohnFlawbod
30-05-2010
Originally Posted by DazerUK:
“At this point in time we don't know whether the TARDIS caused the explosion or was itself caught up in the blast from something else exploding.”

Or indeed someone,
Spoiler
if older Amy and younger Amy meet and touch - two points in time and space that should never have met?


Conjecture but spoilered for those who worry about things
Gazoaks76
30-05-2010
Originally Posted by icemetallica8:
“On point 2

Spoiler
Amy recorded a message between when she clicked forget and when she actually forgot.
”

Ive been thinking there is much more to that than we have seen.
discodolly25
30-05-2010
Originally Posted by icemetallica8:
“On point 2

Spoiler
Amy recorded a message between when she clicked forget and when she actually forgot.
”

i dont remember her doing that :S i'll have to watch it again to make sure cos i thought the doc came in at that point!

If i'm wrong i'll apologise but just gonna watch it again to find out!
discodolly25
30-05-2010
http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode...e_Beast_Below/

ok i've watched the clip of Amy in the Voting Booth (it starts around 15:30 on the link above) and it doesnt show her recording any message! after seeing the truth, she hits the Forget Button straight away with no time to record anything! You can see that she's confused when she wipes away her tears

one thing odd about it though, if she did record it in the future, why does she still have her nightclothes on? unless future her thought she wouldnt believe herself if she didnt have the same clothes on, or SM didnt want us noticing it wasnt that times Amy but a future version?

My Head Hurts!! well i suppose we'll find out eventually!!
robdx
30-05-2010
Another theory could be that the force of the 10/11 regeneration, or whatever caused the explosions inside the TARDIS........
Spoiler
Actually pushed the TARDIS outside space and time into "the land of fiction" as seen in The Mind Robber
DazerUK
30-05-2010
Originally Posted by discodolly25:
“http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode...e_Beast_Below/

ok i've watched the clip of Amy in the Voting Booth (it starts around 15:30 on the link above) and it doesnt show her recording any message! after seeing the truth, she hits the Forget Button straight away with no time to record anything! You can see that she's confused when she wipes away her tears

one thing odd about it though, if she did record it in the future, why does she still have her nightclothes on? unless future her thought she wouldnt believe herself if she didnt have the same clothes on, or SM didnt want us noticing it wasnt that times Amy but a future version?

My Head Hurts!! well i suppose we'll find out eventually!!”

In that scene we see things from Amy's point of view. We don't see her record the message as she forgets she has done it, we jump from her viewing the recording to having pressed the forget button.
discodolly25
30-05-2010
Originally Posted by DazerUK:
“In that scene we see things from Amy's point of view. We don't see her record the message as she forgets she has done it, we jump from her viewing the recording to having pressed the forget button.”

well i suppose we wont find out til the end lol
GwrxVurfer
30-05-2010
Originally Posted by allen_who:
“Last nights twist with the Doc retrieving a scorched piece of the Tardis from the crack in time seems to imply (to me) that the crack itself is caused by the Tardis being destroyed. Maybe the crack is in fact what happens when a Tardis is obliterated?

Anyone else got some thoughts about this?”

I'm not too sure on that one.

During the Time War, I'm guessing that the Dalek's must have destroyed at least a handful of Tardises/Tardi, and we didn't see any cracks in time - Apart from this one, and it implies that this crack is specifically the Doctors' Tardis.

I'm not sure how continuity would allow one Tardis blowing up to make a crack in the universe, but allow thousands to get destroyed without doing anything.

I think that the ring Rory left will be of some importance. Shouldn't it have vanished along with Rory?
HandsomeBB
30-05-2010
Originally Posted by discodolly25:
“http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode...e_Beast_Below/

ok i've watched the clip of Amy in the Voting Booth (it starts around 15:30 on the link above) and it doesnt show her recording any message!

one thing odd about it though, if she did record it in the future, why does she still have her nightclothes on? unless future her thought she wouldnt believe herself if she didnt have the same clothes on, or SM didnt want us noticing it wasnt that times Amy but a future version?

My Head Hurts!! well i suppose we'll find out eventually!!”

A paradox is when there are two ducks on the pond.

I've always wondered whether there are two Tardis's out of phase creating two different time-lines, but not had any evidence until you mentioned Amy is still in her night clothes meaning it could signify a second Amy's (& Doctor's) first trip.

What drew me to the idea was finding loads of teasing clues about Series 5 in TEoT pt 2 when the Doc visits his previous companions.
Rose mentions to her mum that Jimbo's axle broke 5 minutes after he said he'd give them a lift.

What if the Tardis 'axle' broke after the Doc said he'd be back in 5 minutes. It still wasn't stabilised or when he returned for her the night before her wedding. The Tardis split in two with two Docs & Amys ?

One possible extra visual clue, The Doc tells Amy its a Type 40 Tardis for no reason at all and then at the end of TBB we see a very prominently placed speed limit 20 sign as it dematerialises.

Billy Shipton on his Blink death bed mentions he was told going to find himself would cause an explosion destroying 2/3rds of the universe. Is Amy trying to find her other self going to do this ?
TheNewMartha
30-05-2010
Originally Posted by discodolly25:
“http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode...e_Beast_Below/

ok i've watched the clip of Amy in the Voting Booth (it starts around 15:30 on the link above) and it doesnt show her recording any message! after seeing the truth, she hits the Forget Button straight away with no time to record anything! You can see that she's confused when she wipes away her tears

one thing odd about it though, if she did record it in the future, why does she still have her nightclothes on? unless future her thought she wouldnt believe herself if she didnt have the same clothes on, or SM didnt want us noticing it wasnt that times Amy but a future version?

My Head Hurts!! well i suppose we'll find out eventually!!”

i think that when she hits the forget button she forgets the video she has seen which shows the truth about the spaceship, then records the video to herself - so when she hits the forget vutton she forgets recording the video with her crying in it. the reason we dont see her recording the video is so that we dont get to see the video explaining the ship and therefore ruin the ending... (i think thats right)
Dave-H
30-05-2010
Originally Posted by GwrxVurfer:
“I think that the ring Rory left will be of some importance. Shouldn't it have vanished along with Rory?”

The ring wouldn't cease to exist just because Rory has ceased to exist. It existed before he ever saw or touched it. It wouldn't have got into the TARDIS without his intervention though. I suspect that it didn't vanish because somehow being in the TARDIS preserved it.
Mind you, we've only actually seen the box since Rory went, not the ring itself!
Corwin
30-05-2010
Originally Posted by discodolly25:
“http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode...e_Beast_Below/

ok i've watched the clip of Amy in the Voting Booth (it starts around 15:30 on the link above) and it doesnt show her recording any message! after seeing the truth, she hits the Forget Button straight away with no time to record anything! You can see that she's confused when she wipes away her tears

one thing odd about it though, if she did record it in the future, why does she still have her nightclothes on? unless future her thought she wouldnt believe herself if she didnt have the same clothes on, or SM didnt want us noticing it wasnt that times Amy but a future version?

My Head Hurts!! well i suppose we'll find out eventually!!”

The Doctor tells Amy she has had 20 minutes of her memory erased.

We saw at most 5 minutes of her in the Voting Booth so there is 15 minutes we did not see in which she recorded the message.

That was the whole point of the RECORD button for people to see the Video, then record a message to themselves to say forgetting the Video was for the best before they hit the FORGET button.
<<
<
1 of 2
>>
>
VIEW DESKTOP SITE TOP

JOIN US HERE

  • Facebook
  • Twitter

Hearst Corporation

Hearst Corporation

DIGITAL SPY, PART OF THE HEARST UK ENTERTAINMENT NETWORK

© 2015 Hearst Magazines UK is the trading name of the National Magazine Company Ltd, 72 Broadwick Street, London, W1F 9EP. Registered in England 112955. All rights reserved.

  • Terms & Conditions
  • Privacy Policy
  • Cookie Policy
  • Complaints
  • Site Map