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Old 04-06-2010, 17:09
lost-boy
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I don't really post things a lot, but I always read people talking about albums, songs and artists flopping.

I was wondering what signifies to everyone that something is a flop.
Is it how well it does in the charts, number of sales or if you particularly don't like it or not.

To me it's whether I like it or not, numbers of sales and chart positions do not influence whether I buy an album or not. Most of the best artists around don't even register on the uk top 40 etc.
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Old 04-06-2010, 17:15
Krypton_Kal
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This word is really really annoying me of late, its everywhere!! It's just a tool for haters to use against something.

What makes me laugh is that people use it so out of context. For example, most trolls are saying that the new Prince of Persia film flopped because it was 3rd in the US box office. However, they seem to forget that the film has been No.1 in a number of international markets.

In the music world, apparently, if a song dosn't get into the UK Top 10 singles chart, then its a huge flop, the artist should be dropped from their record label, hung and burnt to ashes.
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Old 04-06-2010, 17:18
lost-boy
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Yes, exactly! To me the only way a song would 'flop', for me, is i didnt like it, regardless of what it charts at.
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Old 04-06-2010, 17:23
jde-tv
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a song is a flop when it doesnt make as much money/reach the place in the chart it should of done! The new sugababes album was a flop, it didnt get into the top 10 and sold under 20.000 copies = flop, had this is been a new band it would of been fairly good!

Like the person says above, prince of persia hasnt flopped, it just hasnt done as well as disney expected... but still not bad
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Old 04-06-2010, 17:25
lost-boy
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a song is a flop when it doesnt make as much money/reach the place in the chart it should of done!
Who decides what place it should of reached?
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Old 04-06-2010, 17:26
franster
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I think people confuse 'flopping' with 'underperforming.'
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Old 04-06-2010, 17:28
kutox
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It's all relative. Depends on the expectation.
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Old 04-06-2010, 17:31
Carmen Queasy
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A commercial flop is one which doesn't sell well.

A critical flop is one which gets no praise from critics and fans alike.

Then again, there are some acts who have a small, loyal fan base so commercial success is not important. They probably make more money from touring and such.

However, it's all relative. Let's say Lady Gaga's next album sells 300,000 copies worldwide. For her, that would be considered a flop. The same amount for an act such as Peaches would probably be considered to have done well.
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Old 04-06-2010, 17:32
shelleyj89
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The word flop is annoying me lately. With the whole Christina thing, people are saying Bionic has flopped when it's not even been released yet!

Another one for me is Kelly Clarkson and her single Already Gone. It didn't reach top ten, so people say it flopped, yet in America I believe it's sold over a million copies, which is hardly a flop to me.
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Old 04-06-2010, 17:42
Neighbours_Fan
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I see flopping as an album not selling well or not charting in the top 40. I don't bother with singles because most artists have had flop singles I'm sure.
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Old 04-06-2010, 18:23
MJ_lives
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Charting high then dropping out of the charts incredibly quickly can also count as a flop on my books.
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Old 04-06-2010, 18:43
LoveBug.
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It's all relative. Depends on the expectation.
Totally agree with this
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Old 04-06-2010, 18:45
Biko
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the word 'flop' is mostly used by people on this board who only listen to chart music and think that the amount of records you sell constitutes how good you are as an artist.

Lets say If Lady Gaga for instance (the biggest pop star on the planet commercially) sells half of what she sells now with her next album then everyone would consider it a flop regardless of what the music is like.

Most people who think outside the box would look at their favourite artists and think ok they make consistantly amazing music, have a good fanbase and sell out good venues.. That to them is success even if they sell a 10th of what artists like Gaga, Rihanna etc do
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Old 04-06-2010, 18:48
Anika Hanson
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The word flop is annoying me lately. With the whole Christina thing, people are saying Bionic has flopped when it's not even been released yet!

Another one for me is Kelly Clarkson and her single Already Gone. It didn't reach top ten, so people say it flopped, yet in America I believe it's sold over a million copies, which is hardly a flop to me.

I hope it does well just to shut people up. But I agree give the album a chance before you write it off.
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Old 04-06-2010, 19:44
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A flop is something that compleely boomed. Sales are more important than chart positions, it's one thing to enter the charts high but longlevity in the charts is a different matter. Mini Viva's latest effort, although it was good was a flop, chartig at around 124 . A flop is something that dosen't really sell anything. Flop's in comparsion for the record company is a different matter, say a single was very low budget but went in the charts at like 37 and satyed in the top 40 for a couple of weeks and the top 75 also, comercially it didn't do amazing but the sales its racked up would have made up enough money for the record company to call it a hit as they made a profit.
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Old 04-06-2010, 20:08
Kyle123
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I guess it depends on the artists. People have different expectations for different artists.
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Old 04-06-2010, 20:54
Coen
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Personally I'd only consider an artist to have "flopped" if they do so badly that they abandon any thoughts of continuing a career in the music business, split the band or whatever up and get a job as an accountant or something instead. Which, err, has happened with a few artists I've liked.

If they don't do this and do well enough to be able to justify continuing to make records so that I can buy them, then thats "success" in my book!
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Old 04-06-2010, 21:09
TomDaOne
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a song is a flop when it doesnt make as much money/reach the place in the chart it should of done! The new sugababes album was a flop, it didnt get into the top 10 and sold under 20.000 copies = flop, had this is been a new band it would of been fairly good!

Like the person says above, prince of persia hasnt flopped, it just hasnt done as well as disney expected... but still not bad
The two points I have highlighted seem an obvious contradiction.
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Old 04-06-2010, 21:10
TomDaOne
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the word 'flop' is mostly used by people on this board who only listen to chart music and think that the amount of records you sell constitutes how good you are as an artist.

Lets say If Lady Gaga for instance (the biggest pop star on the planet commercially) sells half of what she sells now with her next album then everyone would consider it a flop regardless of what the music is like.

Most people who think outside the box would look at their favourite artists and think ok they make consistantly amazing music, have a good fanbase and sell out good venues.. That to them is success even if they sell a 10th of what artists like Gaga, Rihanna etc do
A good point well made I think.
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Old 04-06-2010, 22:03
Krypton_Kal
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Personally I'd only consider an artist to have "flopped" if they do so badly that they abandon any thoughts of continuing a career in the music business, split the band or whatever up and get a job as an accountant or something instead. Which, err, has happened with a few artists I've liked.

If they don't do this and do well enough to be able to justify continuing to make records so that I can buy them, then thats "success" in my book!
Yes, that's what I class a flop as... someone who does so bad, they end up quiting, or at least not continuing.

A single not getting to No.1 isnt a flop like some seem to think.
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Old 05-06-2010, 01:36
MJ_lives
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I can't believe people said that Under Pressure by Jedward was a flop

If that's a flop then everyone who is a singer is totally f**ked!
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Old 05-06-2010, 13:23
TheElf
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I think the word flop gets way over used. Far too often it is used as a buzz-word for an act people don't like.

There is life outside the Top 40, there is specified genre charts, independent charts still linked with the official chart company, airplay charts, store charts & not to mention the "overall" Top 100 is published for free now (I think you still have to pay for the Top 200 though?).

So as many have pointed out - it all depends on the act and their market.

It would be fantastic if people could just enjoy their favorite music without turning it into a massive talent show.

The music industry is vast and full of life, definitely room for everybody. Embrace it.


I can't believe people said that Under Pressure by Jedward was a flop

If that's a flop then everyone who is a singer is totally f**ked!
That really annoyed me actually. If anything it done better than expected. Clearly well enough for another major label to pick them instantly after the Sony debacle.
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Old 05-06-2010, 14:01
Red+Blooded
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I can't believe people said that Under Pressure by Jedward was a flop

If that's a flop then everyone who is a singer is totally f**ked!
And Lady GaGa - Love Game, i don't think a top 20 placement (19), 8 weeks in the top 40 and nearly 20 weeks in the top 100, plus sales of about 150,000 is ahardly a flop.
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Old 05-06-2010, 14:12
spkx
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kutox is spot on - it's all relative. A flop for one artist could be considered a huge hit for another.

If I released a single on iTunes and it just got into the top 40, I'd say that was an amazingly big achievement. Mainly because I can't sing nor play any instruments, but also because no one knows who I am or have a clue about the song.

However if someone like JLS or Cheryl Cole released a track and it just got into the top 40 that could be said to be a flop because they have huge profiles, hundreds of thousands spent on promotion, big TV performances, etc.

It's a case of comparing what goes into a track with what comes out.

In regards to Jedward, I'd say that was a pretty poor single. Flop may be a little too harsh but certainly underperforming. It doesn't mean other singers are "****ed" though. The key is Jedward were on one of the biggest watched TV shows for however many weeks, they got plenty of hype, the whole country (more or less) knew about them, they had quite a bit of airplay and a primetime performance at the NTAs. For the single to only shift just over 100k (I think?) in its full top 40 run was shit with all that. It doesn't mean that all other artists who only sold 100k are flops, it just depends what went into the track in terms of promotion, airplay, etc. and the context.

And obviously this post is referring to commerical/chart flops.
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Old 06-06-2010, 02:25
honeythewitch
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kutox is spot on - it's all relative. A flop for one artist could be considered a huge hit for another.

If I released a single on iTunes and it just got into the top 40, I'd say that was an amazingly big achievement. Mainly because I can't sing nor play any instruments, but also because no one knows who I am or have a clue about the song.

However if someone like JLS or Cheryl Cole released a track and it just got into the top 40 that could be said to be a flop because they have huge profiles, hundreds of thousands spent on promotion, big TV performances, etc.

It's a case of comparing what goes into a track with what comes out.

In regards to Jedward, I'd say that was a pretty poor single. Flop may be a little too harsh but certainly underperforming. It doesn't mean other singers are "****ed" though. The key is Jedward were on one of the biggest watched TV shows for however many weeks, they got plenty of hype, the whole country (more or less) knew about them, they had quite a bit of airplay and a primetime performance at the NTAs. For the single to only shift just over 100k (I think?) in its full top 40 run was shit with all that. It doesn't mean that all other artists who only sold 100k are flops, it just depends what went into the track in terms of promotion, airplay, etc. and the context.

And obviously this post is referring to commerical/chart flops.
I thought the John and Edward single did very well indeed. It was number one in their home country for some time.
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