The Great 2G Data Call / Swindle - READ!

themaestro210 · 12-06-2010, 12:42

Hi All,

I would like your assistance with something. All it's going to take is a call to you network provider after a quick test with your phone.

The Problem:
Do you miss calls even if the phone has full signal and may even be in your hand? If the answer is yes and you are on any network other than Vodafone, then you are experiencing my frustration. It's due to the networks not prioritising voice calls over data calls when there is an active 2G/GPRS connection. This is not related to the handset at all, it's network-side.

The Test:
1. Turn your phone to GSM mode. With my HTC Desire, it's in Settings > Wireless & Network > Mobile Network > Network Mode. > GSM. iPhone it's Settings > General > Networks, Disable 3G (or something like that)
2. Start a data connection
3. Use an app that is data intensive e.g. Google Maps and keep scrolling to download data
4. Use another phone to call your phone
5. Post your results here

If I am right, due to a lack of Dual Transfer Mode capability, your phone will bounce the call to voicemail.

The Solution
The only solution is for you to call your network and complain. YOU PAY FOR THE SERVICE SO THEY SHOULD PROVIDE IT.

My network is Orange and they say they have looked into it but it is not economical to fix. It's been the same since I had a Nokia N95 but smart phones these days are so much more data intensive so the problem is greater.

Many people think missed calls are because of poor network coverage, you might find that this is the true problem.

Don't delay, call today and threaten to leave.

Thanks for your time.

BT@home · 12-06-2010, 12:52

What do you want them to do? 3g has voice and data capability, 2g doesn't.

Not sure what your attempting to prove ... And definitely don't understand how you want them to fix it.....who are you going to leave to join?

lovedoctor1978 · 12-06-2010, 12:52

Im on 3 and just found out that happens. Im surprised at 3 about that to be honest.

themaestro210 · 12-06-2010, 13:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by BT@home

What do you want them to do? 3g has voice and data capability, 2g doesn't.

Not sure what your attempting to prove ... And definitely don't understand how you want them to fix it.....who are you going to leave to join?

Sorry, my post may have not been clear. From my research it's all networks except vodafone. They have, I am told, implemented a fix that allows voice calls to be prioritised whilst 2g data is active.

I am not looking for simultaneous 2G & voice calls. I just want the networks to fix this if there is a solution available.

As a side note, according to this http://www.mobileisgood.com/WhatIsGPRS.php GPRS class C does allow dual voice and data.

psionic · 12-06-2010, 13:45

I was under the impression that the 2g implementation most networks use does not support simultaneous voice & data. It's always been the case AFAIK. In most cases only a 3g signal will allow this.

prking · 12-06-2010, 14:08

I can confirm that O2 allow this providing your phone supports it.
I'm able to browse on my Nokia 6303c. When someone rings me, the call comes through and the data connection resumes after the call.

psionic · 12-06-2010, 14:39

So where is the "Swindle"? - Is this a angle to get out of a contract or get a discount or what?

themaestro210 · 12-06-2010, 14:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by prking

I can confirm that O2 allow this providing your phone supports it.
I'm able to browse on my Nokia 6303c. When someone rings me, the call comes through and the data connection resumes after the call.

Hey, thanks for that. Just checking though, that phone is EDGE compatible so is it definitely on GPRS when downloading?

I think the networks and manufactures should advise when you buy a phone if this is going to occur.

themaestro210 · 12-06-2010, 15:47

Have to say I am surprised at some of the reactions to this post.

With all the hype over iphones, smart phones etc. and the smart phone packages on some networks, there is an active drive towards getting people online on-the-move. That's great but if it's at the cost of the basic function of a phone (to make and receive calls) isn't that something that we consumers should be made aware ?

prking · 12-06-2010, 15:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by themaestro210

Hey, thanks for that. Just checking though, that phone is EDGE compatible so is it definitely on GPRS when downloading?

I think the networks and manufactures should advise when you buy a phone if this is going to occur.

I get calls when I've got an icon, in the status bar, of a G inside a box, which indicates an active GPRS connection.

Some years ago, it definitely didn't work. I would imagine the new network they are installing would support it.

plymouthbloke1974 · 12-06-2010, 16:04

There are 2 modes on 2G (GSM). One allows data to be suspended whilst a call comes in. The other pushes voice traffic to voicemail (or a diverted number if programmed) whilst leaving the data connection active.

Most operators changed it to the latter a few years back when upgrading their infrastructure. And it's not going to change, I'm afraid. Just make sure that if your phone is in a 2G area that you disable push email (unless you have a Blackberry).

BT@home · 12-06-2010, 16:13

[quote=themaestro210;40883512]Have to say I am surprised at some of the reactions to this post./QUOTE]
I'm normally on 3g so it's not a problem. I certainly wouldn't expect sales assistant to tell me about it. I just think your being totally unrealistic to expect telecoms companies to invest in making changes like this when they are doing all they can to create better 3g networks instead.

moox · 12-06-2010, 16:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by themaestro210

Have to say I am surprised at some of the reactions to this post.

With all the hype over iphones, smart phones etc. and the smart phone packages on some networks, there is an active drive towards getting people online on-the-move. That's great but if it's at the cost of the basic function of a phone (to make and receive calls) isn't that something that we consumers should be made aware ?

There is also an active drive towards getting people onto 3G, with the expansion of 3G coverage as part of that. It doesn't seem like something worth spending a lot of money or time on.

bigtunes · 12-06-2010, 16:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by BT@home

Quote:

Originally Posted by themaestro210

Have to say I am surprised at some of the reactions to this post.

I'm normally on 3g so it's not a problem. I certainly wouldn't expect sales assistant to tell me about it. I just think your being totally unrealistic to expect telecoms companies to invest in making changes like this when they are doing all they can to create better 3g networks instead.

Same here, I've had to force my phone onto 2g to test this, and tbh I think that's the first time I've seen the symbol for 2g. I'm generally on HSDPA most of the time so it's not an issue for me.

themaestro210 · 13-06-2010, 00:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigtunes

Same here, I've had to force my phone onto 2g to test this, and tbh I think that's the first time I've seen the symbol for 2g. I'm generally on HSDPA most of the time so it's not an issue for me.

Surprised again! I don't know where you live but even living in the capital, working off the busiest shopping centre in Europe, I still often get a G instead of a 3G or H. Of course I understand that 3G or Wimax eventually is the goal BUT does that mean that networks should ignore people that have no or limited access to this service?

If all companies thought like that, the brakes would not be fixed on Nissans because the next model will have the problem sorted!!

Look at the ofcom 3G maps http://www.ofcom.org.uk/radiocomms/i...g/maps/3gmaps/

Lots of people do not have 3G. It's their (or your maybe - am guessing you're a network guy) responsibility to ensure people get the service they pay for.

DXRulz · 13-06-2010, 00:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by plymouthbloke1974

There are 2 modes on 2G (GSM). One allows data to be suspended whilst a call comes in. The other pushes voice traffic to voicemail (or a diverted number if programmed) whilst leaving the data connection active.

Most operators changed it to the latter a few years back when upgrading their infrastructure. And it's not going to change, I'm afraid. Just make sure that if your phone is in a 2G area that you disable push email (unless you have a Blackberry).

Could this be why i got 8 text messages in one go on my Blackberry Curve 8520 on Orange yesterday morning?

themaestro210 · 13-06-2010, 00:47

Could be, tested it on Blackberry Curve Orange = Voicemail.

Call them. Complain.

They have a great network, I have a great tarrif and premiere customer services but if I can receive calls because I am receiving email, what's the point?

TheBigM · 13-06-2010, 08:58

How many people can be bothered to use data on 2G phones anyway. Save browsing mobile websites, everything else either won't work or would be painfully slow. iPhone 2G is also the only 2G phone I know of that can render sites at a satisfactory speed.

Also you really should be getting 3G speeds in London maestro. Perhaps you need to change networks to one that is best where you work/live. I find in London, 3 is often very good in places that others aren't.

themaestro210 · 13-06-2010, 09:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheBigM

How many people can be bothered to use data on 2G phones anyway. Save browsing mobile websites, everything else either won't work or would be painfully slow. iPhone 2G is also the only 2G phone I know of that can render sites at a satisfactory speed.

Also you really should be getting 3G speeds in London maestro. Perhaps you need to change networks to one that is best where you work/live. I find in London, 3 is often very good in places that others aren't.

Guys, am not suggesting I have nothing better to do than sit around waiting for web pages to load on 2G. All I am saying is that not many can guarantee a 100% 3G signal all of the time. It's in the times when 3G drops out that this problem occurs. If that happens to be when a call comes through and data is downloading, that's not good.

bigtunes · 13-06-2010, 10:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by themaestro210

Surprised again! I don't know where you live but even living in the capital, working off the busiest shopping centre in Europe, I still often get a G instead of a 3G or H. Of course I understand that 3G or Wimax eventually is the goal BUT does that mean that networks should ignore people that have no or limited access to this service?

If all companies thought like that, the brakes would not be fixed on Nissans because the next model will have the problem sorted!!

Look at the ofcom 3G maps http://www.ofcom.org.uk/radiocomms/i...g/maps/3gmaps/

Lots of people do not have 3G. It's their (or your maybe - am guessing you're a network guy) responsibility to ensure people get the service they pay for.

Wrong, I work for a utilities company! I live on the town centre of my town on the Surrey/Hampshire border and work on the outskirts of London.

The maps you've linked to are 18 months old and it clearly states that they are based on predictions and not actual coverage so they don't really give a true picture of coverage do they?

The Nissan analogy is pretty daft really, I'd say this is more like trying to force the broadcaster to spend money updating analogue equipment, instead of focusing on the digital roll out.

skimminstones · 13-06-2010, 10:30

Blimey someone got out of bed the wrong side. This has always happened. Its really not worth the indignation and CAPITAL LETTERS in the title really is it.. There must be other things going on in the world today you can be angry over.

themaestro210 · 13-06-2010, 11:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by skimminstones

Blimey someone got out of bed the wrong side. This has always happened. Its really not worth the indignation and CAPITAL LETTERS in the title really is it.. There must be other things going on in the world today you can be angry over.

Debate does not equal anger and I have no interested in flaming and/or upsetting anyone. Caps seem contentious.

Some of the replies have actually changed my perspective a little. The last analogy about the digital switchover was a good one.

I think maybe I'll just have to wait until 3G networks are standard before I get back into the smart phone business.

I will say though, that just because something has always been, doesn't mean it should forever be.

12-06-2010, 12:42	#1
themaestro210 Forum Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 10	The Great 2G Data Call / Swindle - READ! Hi All, I would like your assistance with something. All it's going to take is a call to you network provider after a quick test with your phone. The Problem: Do you miss calls even if the phone has full signal and may even be in your hand? If the answer is yes and you are on any network other than Vodafone, then you are experiencing my frustration. It's due to the networks not prioritising voice calls over data calls when there is an active 2G/GPRS connection. This is not related to the handset at all, it's network-side. The Test: 1. Turn your phone to GSM mode. With my HTC Desire, it's in Settings > Wireless & Network > Mobile Network > Network Mode. > GSM. iPhone it's Settings > General > Networks, Disable 3G (or something like that) 2. Start a data connection 3. Use an app that is data intensive e.g. Google Maps and keep scrolling to download data 4. Use another phone to call your phone 5. Post your results here If I am right, due to a lack of Dual Transfer Mode capability, your phone will bounce the call to voicemail. The Solution The only solution is for you to call your network and complain. YOU PAY FOR THE SERVICE SO THEY SHOULD PROVIDE IT. My network is Orange and they say they have looked into it but it is not economical to fix. It's been the same since I had a Nokia N95 but smart phones these days are so much more data intensive so the problem is greater. Many people think missed calls are because of poor network coverage, you might find that this is the true problem. Don't delay, call today and threaten to leave. Thanks for your time.

12-06-2010, 12:52	#2
BT@home Forum Member Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 1,911	What do you want them to do? 3g has voice and data capability, 2g doesn't. Not sure what your attempting to prove ... And definitely don't understand how you want them to fix it.....who are you going to leave to join?

12-06-2010, 12:52	#3
lovedoctor1978 Forum Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Huddersfield Posts: 1,876	Im on 3 and just found out that happens. Im surprised at 3 about that to be honest.

12-06-2010, 13:02	#4
themaestro210 Forum Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 10	Quote: Originally Posted by BT@home What do you want them to do? 3g has voice and data capability, 2g doesn't. Not sure what your attempting to prove ... And definitely don't understand how you want them to fix it.....who are you going to leave to join? Sorry, my post may have not been clear. From my research it's all networks except vodafone. They have, I am told, implemented a fix that allows voice calls to be prioritised whilst 2g data is active. I am not looking for simultaneous 2G & voice calls. I just want the networks to fix this if there is a solution available. As a side note, according to this http://www.mobileisgood.com/WhatIsGPRS.php GPRS class C does allow dual voice and data.

12-06-2010, 13:45	#5
psionic Forum Member Join Date: May 2002 Location: Crystal Palace TX Posts: 19,702	I was under the impression that the 2g implementation most networks use does not support simultaneous voice & data. It's always been the case AFAIK. In most cases only a 3g signal will allow this.

12-06-2010, 14:08	#6
prking Forum Member Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Weston-super-Mare Posts: 9,167	I can confirm that O2 allow this providing your phone supports it. I'm able to browse on my Nokia 6303c. When someone rings me, the call comes through and the data connection resumes after the call.

12-06-2010, 14:39	#7
psionic Forum Member Join Date: May 2002 Location: Crystal Palace TX Posts: 19,702	So where is the "Swindle"? - Is this a angle to get out of a contract or get a discount or what?

12-06-2010, 14:47	#8
themaestro210 Forum Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 10	Quote: Originally Posted by prking I can confirm that O2 allow this providing your phone supports it. I'm able to browse on my Nokia 6303c. When someone rings me, the call comes through and the data connection resumes after the call. Hey, thanks for that. Just checking though, that phone is EDGE compatible so is it definitely on GPRS when downloading? I think the networks and manufactures should advise when you buy a phone if this is going to occur.

12-06-2010, 15:47	#9
themaestro210 Forum Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 10	Have to say I am surprised at some of the reactions to this post. With all the hype over iphones, smart phones etc. and the smart phone packages on some networks, there is an active drive towards getting people online on-the-move. That's great but if it's at the cost of the basic function of a phone (to make and receive calls) isn't that something that we consumers should be made aware ?

12-06-2010, 15:55	#10
prking Forum Member Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Weston-super-Mare Posts: 9,167	Quote: Originally Posted by themaestro210 Hey, thanks for that. Just checking though, that phone is EDGE compatible so is it definitely on GPRS when downloading? I think the networks and manufactures should advise when you buy a phone if this is going to occur. I get calls when I've got an icon, in the status bar, of a G inside a box, which indicates an active GPRS connection. Some years ago, it definitely didn't work. I would imagine the new network they are installing would support it.

12-06-2010, 16:04	#11
plymouthbloke1974 Forum Member Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Destination: Hard Brexit Posts: 6,368	There are 2 modes on 2G (GSM). One allows data to be suspended whilst a call comes in. The other pushes voice traffic to voicemail (or a diverted number if programmed) whilst leaving the data connection active. Most operators changed it to the latter a few years back when upgrading their infrastructure. And it's not going to change, I'm afraid. Just make sure that if your phone is in a 2G area that you disable push email (unless you have a Blackberry).

12-06-2010, 16:13	#12
BT@home Forum Member Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 1,911	[quote=themaestro210;40883512]Have to say I am surprised at some of the reactions to this post./QUOTE] I'm normally on 3g so it's not a problem. I certainly wouldn't expect sales assistant to tell me about it. I just think your being totally unrealistic to expect telecoms companies to invest in making changes like this when they are doing all they can to create better 3g networks instead.

12-06-2010, 16:17	#13
moox Forum Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 14,645	Quote: Originally Posted by themaestro210 Have to say I am surprised at some of the reactions to this post. With all the hype over iphones, smart phones etc. and the smart phone packages on some networks, there is an active drive towards getting people online on-the-move. That's great but if it's at the cost of the basic function of a phone (to make and receive calls) isn't that something that we consumers should be made aware ? There is also an active drive towards getting people onto 3G, with the expansion of 3G coverage as part of that. It doesn't seem like something worth spending a lot of money or time on.

12-06-2010, 16:30	#14
bigtunes Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: on the internet Posts: 818	Quote: Originally Posted by BT@home Quote: Originally Posted by themaestro210 Have to say I am surprised at some of the reactions to this post. I'm normally on 3g so it's not a problem. I certainly wouldn't expect sales assistant to tell me about it. I just think your being totally unrealistic to expect telecoms companies to invest in making changes like this when they are doing all they can to create better 3g networks instead. Same here, I've had to force my phone onto 2g to test this, and tbh I think that's the first time I've seen the symbol for 2g. I'm generally on HSDPA most of the time so it's not an issue for me.

13-06-2010, 00:35	#15
themaestro210 Forum Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 10	Quote: Originally Posted by bigtunes Same here, I've had to force my phone onto 2g to test this, and tbh I think that's the first time I've seen the symbol for 2g. I'm generally on HSDPA most of the time so it's not an issue for me. Surprised again! I don't know where you live but even living in the capital, working off the busiest shopping centre in Europe, I still often get a G instead of a 3G or H. Of course I understand that 3G or Wimax eventually is the goal BUT does that mean that networks should ignore people that have no or limited access to this service? If all companies thought like that, the brakes would not be fixed on Nissans because the next model will have the problem sorted!! Look at the ofcom 3G maps http://www.ofcom.org.uk/radiocomms/i...g/maps/3gmaps/ Lots of people do not have 3G. It's their (or your maybe - am guessing you're a network guy) responsibility to ensure people get the service they pay for.

13-06-2010, 00:44	#16
DXRulz Forum Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Oswestry, Shropshire Posts: 4,196	Quote: Originally Posted by plymouthbloke1974 There are 2 modes on 2G (GSM). One allows data to be suspended whilst a call comes in. The other pushes voice traffic to voicemail (or a diverted number if programmed) whilst leaving the data connection active. Most operators changed it to the latter a few years back when upgrading their infrastructure. And it's not going to change, I'm afraid. Just make sure that if your phone is in a 2G area that you disable push email (unless you have a Blackberry). Could this be why i got 8 text messages in one go on my Blackberry Curve 8520 on Orange yesterday morning?

13-06-2010, 00:47	#17
themaestro210 Forum Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 10	Could be, tested it on Blackberry Curve Orange = Voicemail. Call them. Complain. They have a great network, I have a great tarrif and premiere customer services but if I can receive calls because I am receiving email, what's the point?

13-06-2010, 08:58	#18
TheBigM Forum Member Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: moon Posts: 12,983	How many people can be bothered to use data on 2G phones anyway. Save browsing mobile websites, everything else either won't work or would be painfully slow. iPhone 2G is also the only 2G phone I know of that can render sites at a satisfactory speed. Also you really should be getting 3G speeds in London maestro. Perhaps you need to change networks to one that is best where you work/live. I find in London, 3 is often very good in places that others aren't.

13-06-2010, 09:07	#19
themaestro210 Forum Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 10	Quote: Originally Posted by TheBigM How many people can be bothered to use data on 2G phones anyway. Save browsing mobile websites, everything else either won't work or would be painfully slow. iPhone 2G is also the only 2G phone I know of that can render sites at a satisfactory speed. Also you really should be getting 3G speeds in London maestro. Perhaps you need to change networks to one that is best where you work/live. I find in London, 3 is often very good in places that others aren't. Guys, am not suggesting I have nothing better to do than sit around waiting for web pages to load on 2G. All I am saying is that not many can guarantee a 100% 3G signal all of the time. It's in the times when 3G drops out that this problem occurs. If that happens to be when a call comes through and data is downloading, that's not good.

13-06-2010, 10:20	#20
bigtunes Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: on the internet Posts: 818	Quote: Originally Posted by themaestro210 Surprised again! I don't know where you live but even living in the capital, working off the busiest shopping centre in Europe, I still often get a G instead of a 3G or H. Of course I understand that 3G or Wimax eventually is the goal BUT does that mean that networks should ignore people that have no or limited access to this service? If all companies thought like that, the brakes would not be fixed on Nissans because the next model will have the problem sorted!! Look at the ofcom 3G maps http://www.ofcom.org.uk/radiocomms/i...g/maps/3gmaps/ Lots of people do not have 3G. It's their (or your maybe - am guessing you're a network guy) responsibility to ensure people get the service they pay for. Wrong, I work for a utilities company! I live on the town centre of my town on the Surrey/Hampshire border and work on the outskirts of London. The maps you've linked to are 18 months old and it clearly states that they are based on predictions and not actual coverage so they don't really give a true picture of coverage do they? The Nissan analogy is pretty daft really, I'd say this is more like trying to force the broadcaster to spend money updating analogue equipment, instead of focusing on the digital roll out.

13-06-2010, 10:30	#21
skimminstones Inactive Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 8,186	Blimey someone got out of bed the wrong side. This has always happened. Its really not worth the indignation and CAPITAL LETTERS in the title really is it.. There must be other things going on in the world today you can be angry over.

DS Forums

The Great 2G Data Call / Swindle - READ!

13-06-2010, 11:10	#22
themaestro210 Forum Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 10	Quote: Originally Posted by skimminstones Blimey someone got out of bed the wrong side. This has always happened. Its really not worth the indignation and CAPITAL LETTERS in the title really is it.. There must be other things going on in the world today you can be angry over. Debate does not equal anger and I have no interested in flaming and/or upsetting anyone. Caps seem contentious. Some of the replies have actually changed my perspective a little. The last analogy about the digital switchover was a good one. I think maybe I'll just have to wait until 3G networks are standard before I get back into the smart phone business. I will say though, that just because something has always been, doesn't mean it should forever be.