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Old 03-01-2011, 14:28
Libretio
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Not 100% sure but I'm guessing that all the 2.35:1 movies this Xmas are receiving their terrestrial premier or at least their terrestrial HD premier so all the films the channels have left to show that they've owned for a while are likely to carry on in the wrong ratio.
Yep, it'll be pot luck as to which films are screened at the correct ratio, at least for the time being. Or, worse still, this Christmas may have been a blip and we'll have nothing but cropped presentations again for the forseeable future!

The big test will be RAIDERS OF THE LOST ARK on Wednesday, the first smack-in-the-middle-of-evening-primetime slot for a 2.35:1 film. If it's OAR, then it's likely (but only 'likely') that the Beeb has turned a corner. So far, everything else screened in the correct ratio has been afternoon or early evening, on the outer edges of primetime.

The reason they gave for screening a 4:3 print of ROTLA on BBC 1 the last time was that they were contractually forbidden from showing a 16:9 version of the film. They could either show 4:3 or the full letterboxed 2.35:1 version. At the time, they felt the primetime audience wasn't ready for letterboxing, so they went with the worst possible alternative.

This time around may be different. We live in hope...
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Old 03-01-2011, 15:24
DVDfever
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The big test will be RAIDERS OF THE LOST ARK on Wednesday, the first smack-in-the-middle-of-evening-primetime slot for a 2.35:1 film.
Hehe, I said pretty much the same thing in msg 336, but great minds think alike.

If it's OAR, then it's likely (but only 'likely') that the Beeb has turned a corner. So far, everything else screened in the correct ratio has been afternoon or early evening, on the outer edges of primetime.
Indeed.

The reason they gave for screening a 4:3 print of ROTLA on BBC 1 the last time was that they were contractually forbidden from showing a 16:9 version of the film. They could either show 4:3 or the full letterboxed 2.35:1 version. At the time, they felt the primetime audience wasn't ready for letterboxing, so they went with the worst possible alternative.

This time around may be different. We live in hope...
Never knew it was a contractual thing. Where did you hear that? I thought they were just being morons, as they often were with films until recently.
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Old 03-01-2011, 15:35
Kevin1960
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Radio Times online says that Raiders is "widescreen".

http://www.radiotimes.com/ListingsSe...s_fullpage.jsp

Temple of Doom is on at the same time next week. I wonder if Indy 4 will be on again two weeks after that.
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Old 03-01-2011, 15:44
pad_ehh
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I must be missing something here; apart from one of the Hannibal films and Happy Feet, what else has been shown on ITV1 in 2:35.1?
Mrs Doubtfire was in 2.35:1 the other week.

Basically, any Universal or Warner Bros. films they have the rights to are cropped to 16:9, probably due to existing contracts as ITV probably requested cropped versions. Other studios, to which they only recently have bought the rights to show films from have been in 2.35:1. Hence why Mrs Doubtfire (20th Century Fox) and Happy Feet (Village Roadshow) were in the OAR. When the contracts for the movies come up for renewal, I'm sure all channels concerned will be requesting OAR HD copies.
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Old 03-01-2011, 16:28
DVDfever
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I've put together an article about films being shown properly on TV. I've only just finished it, and was going to announce it from tomorrow, hence why it has tomorrow's date on it, but any opinions let me know.

http://dvdfever.co.uk/why235.shtml
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Old 03-01-2011, 20:03
Libretio
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Never knew it was a contractual thing. Where did you hear that? I thought they were just being morons, as they often were with films until recently.
It was during a discussion on the Points of View site, when one of the moderators had to explain - repeatedly! - why a 4:3 version of Raiders had been screened on BBC1. Readers expressed a lot of (justifiable) outrage, but the moderator never really answered the question as to why a 16:9 version was withheld by the rights holder. It didn't make a lot of sense, to be honest, but that was the only explanation they were able to provide.
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Old 03-01-2011, 20:53
grahamcrowden
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Radio Times online says that Raiders is "widescreen".

http://www.radiotimes.com/ListingsSe...s_fullpage.jsp

Temple of Doom is on at the same time next week
When the Indy films were aired on BBC HD it rather conveniently meant that the only film that suffers from lots of censor cuts - Temple of Doom was missed out due to some scheduling clash so TOD remains unseen in HD on the BBC.

It will be interesting to see if the new HD version is the UK cut version or an uncut one where the BBC make their own minor edits as many of the cuts made for the original PG would not apply today.
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Old 03-01-2011, 21:13
DVDfever
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It was during a discussion on the Points of View site, when one of the moderators had to explain - repeatedly! - why a 4:3 version of Raiders had been screened on BBC1. Readers expressed a lot of (justifiable) outrage, but the moderator never really answered the question as to why a 16:9 version was withheld by the rights holder. It didn't make a lot of sense, to be honest, but that was the only explanation they were able to provide.
Hmm... I'd take that with a pinch of salt, then. More likely is that they didn't want to pay for a 16:9 print, especially given that a 2.35:1 one makes it redundant, but I'm glad they got a roasting for showing the 4:3 one.
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Old 03-01-2011, 21:16
DVDfever
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When the Indy films were aired on BBC HD it rather conveniently meant that the only film that suffers from lots of censor cuts - Temple of Doom was missed out due to some scheduling clash so TOD remains unseen in HD on the BBC.

It will be interesting to see if the new HD version is the UK cut version or an uncut one where the BBC make their own minor edits as many of the cuts made for the original PG would not apply today.
Paramount would have to get it re-rated to include back anything that was cut in the first place, so when a Blu-ray Trilogy eventually comes out, I can see myself going for the US version.
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Old 03-01-2011, 22:20
koantemplation
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ITV1 and ITV1 HD still showing 'The Matrix Revolutions' in 16:9.
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Old 03-01-2011, 22:24
DVDfever
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ITV1 and ITV1 HD still showing 'The Matrix Revolutions' in 16:9.
Five also showing Van Damme's Until Death in 16:9, cropped from 2.35:1.
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Old 03-01-2011, 23:40
grahamcrowden
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Paramount would have to get it re-rated to include back anything that was cut in the first place, so when a Blu-ray Trilogy eventually comes out, I can see myself going for the US version.
Whether Paramount get it reclassified will have no bearing on what the BBC show.
Films are often shown with bits that have been cut out for the commercial release.

Temple of Doom was cut for a PG and the BBC could easily show a 12 at 810pm which is likely what an uncut TOD would be today.

The BBFC made lots of cuts to TOD and I suspect that most cuts will be reinserted on the new BBC screening .
Probably the heart being pulled out will be missing but not much else .
I doubt that there is a widescreen uncut HD version of the UK cut available anyway.
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Old 03-01-2011, 23:41
grahamcrowden
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ITV1 and ITV1 HD still showing 'The Matrix Revolutions' in 16:9.
As posted earlier in the thread , films that have already been shown before will continue to be cropped until the channel acquires a new copy by renewing the contract.

Getting another copy supplied would involve extra cost.
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Old 03-01-2011, 23:51
Libretio
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Whether Paramount get it reclassified will have no bearing on what the BBC show.
Films are often shown with bits that have been cut out for the commercial release.

Temple of Doom was cut for a PG and the BBC could easily show a 12 at 810pm which is likely what an uncut TOD would be today.

The BBFC made lots of cuts to TOD and I suspect that most cuts will be reinserted on the new BBC screening .
Probably the heart being pulled out will be missing but not much else .
I doubt that there is a widescreen uncut HD version of the UK cut available anyway.
The Beeb used to show their own versions of whatever films they happened to own, but have since knuckled down and will only screen video versions approved by the BBFC. This has resulted in silly things like DRAGON: THE BRUCE LEE STORY being shown uncut the first time, then censored for most other transmissions, after the Beeb had made the tacit decision to go with BBFC-approved prints. In the case of Dragon, the missing material (the dreaded nunchakus) would, of course, be reinstated if the film was submitted today, but I don't recall if the most recent broadcast was uncut or not.
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Old 03-01-2011, 23:53
Libretio
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For anyone interested, here's a list of films on Freeview TV for the rest of the week (4 - 7 January) which were screened theatrically at 2.35:1:


• 3:10 TO YUMA (Five USA)

• ANASTASIA (Film4)

• CASINO ROYALE (ITV 2)

• DIE ANOTHER DAY (ITV 2)
• DIRTY HARRY (ITV 4)
• DOMESTIC DISTURBANCE (Film4)
• THE DUKES OF HAZZARD (ITV 2)

• GIRL WITH A PEARL EARRING (BBC 4)
• GOSFORD PARK (More4)

• THE IRON GIANT (Film4)

• JUMPER (Film4)

• KISS THEM FOR ME (Film4)
• THE KOVAK BOX (BBC 1)

• LASSIE (C4)
• THE LONGEST DAY (C4)

• MARS ATTACKS! (ITV 4)
• THE MATRIX REVOLUTIONS (ITV 1)

• NED KELLY (ITV 4)

• PHONE BOOTH (Film4)
• PLANET OF THE APES (Film4)

• RAIDERS OF THE LOST ARK (BBC 1)
• RAT RACE (Film4)
• RUNAWAY BRIDE (Film4)

• SECRET WINDOW (Fiver)
• THE SEVEN YEAR ITCH (C4)
• SPEED 2: CRUISE CONTROL (Film4)
• SWAT (Channel 5)
• SWIMFAN (E4)

• TOMORROW NEVER DIES (ITV 2)
• TRANSPORTER 2 (E4)

• WALL•E (BBC 3)
• THE WORLD IS NOT ENOUGH (ITV 2)

• THE X FILES: I WANT TO BELIEVE (C4)

You can expect most - though not all - of the films screened across C4 and its subsidiaries to get it right (though anomalies still occur, such as RAT RACE constantly cropped on Film4 but framed correctly at 2.35:1 on E4 or C4), but everything else is touch and go. Keep an eye out, and report back if any of these are screened OAR.

Oh, and THE BOUNTY HUNTER (Film4) may well be screened at the original 1.85:1 ratio (or near as dammit), but it was originally in 3-D. Sadly, the current TV set-up means you probably won't be getting that extra dimension on this particular broadcast...
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Old 04-01-2011, 09:54
pad_ehh
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Well, you can expect anything shown on ITV 1/2/3/4 to be cropped as they are all repeats and have been cropped on all previous broadcasts, so I doubt they have acquired new copies.
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Old 04-01-2011, 15:43
mattyb
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Whether Paramount get it reclassified will have no bearing on what the BBC show.
Films are often shown with bits that have been cut out for the commercial release.

Temple of Doom was cut for a PG and the BBC could easily show a 12 at 810pm which is likely what an uncut TOD would be today.

The BBFC made lots of cuts to TOD and I suspect that most cuts will be reinserted on the new BBC screening .
Probably the heart being pulled out will be missing but not much else .
I doubt that there is a widescreen uncut HD version of the UK cut available anyway.
It would be good to see the uncut version of TOD in the UK.
I bought the boxset on region 1 when it was re-released a few years back.

I do remember reading online or I think it might have been Empire Magazine that the BBFC offered Paramount TOD a 15 rating and they refused it.

I would suspect when they resubmit them for blueray, they'll finally release TOD uncut as most blueray discs seem to be the US versions anyway. The Lethal Weapon series is good example as these are now available uncut for the first time as their the US versions.

The Beeb used to show their own versions of whatever films they happened to own, but have since knuckled down and will only screen video versions approved by the BBFC. This has resulted in silly things like DRAGON: THE BRUCE LEE STORY being shown uncut the first time, then censored for most other transmissions, after the Beeb had made the tacit decision to go with BBFC-approved prints. In the case of Dragon, the missing material (the dreaded nunchakus) would, of course, be reinstated if the film was submitted today, but I don't recall if the most recent broadcast was uncut or not.
Last time I saw 'Dragon' on TV it was uncut but I think that was Sky. But its now available uncut in the UK, so I can't understand why it would be shown cut on TV unless it is the cinema version they're still showing for contract reason.
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Old 04-01-2011, 18:57
Libretio
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Last time I saw 'Dragon' on TV it was uncut but I think that was Sky. But its now available uncut in the UK, so I can't understand why it would be shown cut on TV unless it is the cinema version they're still showing for contract reason.
I coulda sworn this hadn't been resubmitted to the BBFC for an uncut release, but it has - all the way back in January 2000! Of course, it should never have been cut in the first place, but that was the 'magic' of James Ferman's ghastly regime...

'Bout time the film was released on Blu-ray, too.
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Old 04-01-2011, 21:18
Dar W
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I enjoy reading this thread as my girlfriend rolls her eyes as i refuse to watch a film on the telly unless its in its original ratio.
I'm looking forward to see if i'll be watching Raiders Of The Lost Ark or not as even tho i've not got BBC HD,it was shown around easter 2008 on BBC3 in the 2:35 ratio and i bought TOD from a Dutch seller to get the uncut version but i reckon it'll still be the cut version next week
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Old 04-01-2011, 21:47
DarthFader
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What aspect ratio was Star Wars done in? I understand it was wider even then 2:35:1? If that is the case has it been shown on TV in that OAR? Are many films shown even on Sky like that? I seem to remember The Opposite of Sex being some really weird aspect ratio but it was a while back, can't seem to see it mentioned on wiki.
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Old 04-01-2011, 23:23
DVDfever
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What aspect ratio was Star Wars done in? I understand it was wider even then 2:35:1? If that is the case has it been shown on TV in that OAR? Are many films shown even on Sky like that? I seem to remember The Opposite of Sex being some really weird aspect ratio but it was a while back, can't seem to see it mentioned on wiki.
According to IMDB, Star Wars was 2.20:1 for 70mm prints and 2.35:1 elsewhere.

BTW, I just saw Girl with a Pearl Earring now on BBC4 in 2.35:1 (and no logo). It's nearly finished, but it's repeated on Saturday at 11.50pm.
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Old 04-01-2011, 23:23
DVDfever
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I enjoy reading this thread as my girlfriend rolls her eyes as i refuse to watch a film on the telly unless its in its original ratio.
Dump her!
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Old 05-01-2011, 15:53
Libretio
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What aspect ratio was Star Wars done in? I understand it was wider even then 2:35:1? If that is the case has it been shown on TV in that OAR? Are many films shown even on Sky like that? I seem to remember The Opposite of Sex being some really weird aspect ratio but it was a while back, can't seem to see it mentioned on wiki.
As DVDfever mentioned, STAR WARS was shot in anamorphic 35mm at 2.35:1 and released that way to most cinemas, though a number of prints were blown-up to 70mm at 2.20:1.

Not sure about THE OPPOSITE OF SEX, since that was 1.85:1, though you might be referring to THE OPPOSITE SEX (1956), which I believe was 2.55:1. A few early CinemaScope films from the 1950's were shot in this ratio, but it only lasted a year or two before the ratio was standardized at 2.35:1 (2.39:1 projection from 1971 onwards, but we won't quibble about that).

BATTLE OF THE BULGE and THE GREATEST STORY EVER TOLD have been screened by Channel 4 at their original 2.76:1 ratio, the widest ratio for commercial movies ever devised, though very few movies were shot that way. The vast majority of 'scope' films are 2.35:1.

By the way, though the announcer claimed it was being shown in HD on the relevant channel, THE KOVAK BOX was still cropped to 1.78:1 on BBC 1 last night. Did anyone catch some (or all) of the HD version?
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Old 05-01-2011, 19:46
pad_ehh
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Sleeping Beauty is 2.55:1 and Disney Cinemagic have shown it in the full OAR. They are usually spot on with OAR's, execpt for some productions that they felt necessary to crop, such as The Aristocats which was made in the late 70's but appears to only be available in 4:3 so Cinemagic (and indeed the DVD and BluRay too) crop that to a 1.78:1 image losing some information. Strange.
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Old 05-01-2011, 20:26
davidweller
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Raiders being shown in 2.35:1 on both BBC1 and BBC1HD.
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