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  • TV Shows: UK
Sherlock - New BBC Drama
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Trsvis_Bickle
18-01-2012
Originally Posted by maw1:
“Why did he return the corporal's salute when he was not wearing a hat, then?”

Yes, I noticed that as well but to be fair, that was poor research and direction, not bad acting on Freeman's part.

If you're going to be really pedantic, why did the guard at the gate have a Heckler & Koch UMP whereas all the other guards had the standard L85 rifle? Also, at the end of the last episode of the first series, Watson's Sig Sauer P226 pistol is incorrectly described as a Browning Hi-power.

All minor points and really not worth bothering about
gingerjack
18-01-2012
I spot what appears to be a doctor at the scene, he is taking Sherlocks neck pulse, and the two suits help remove the body , with the one paramedic , who are they ?
DFI
18-01-2012
How did Watson know to go to the hospital? SH texted Moriarty to come and play on the rooftop of St Barts but was particular about shielding the exchange from Watson.

Then Watson gets a call saying Mrs Hudson's been shot (who made that call BTW?) and disappears.

Next time we see him, he's pulling up in a cab outside the hospital. How did he know to go there?
ballerinaemily
18-01-2012
Originally Posted by DFI:
“Next time we see him, he's pulling up in a cab outside the hospital. How did he know to go there?”

Because that's where he had left Sherlock? After the 'rubber ball' scene in the lab.
Granny McSmith
18-01-2012
Originally Posted by maw1:
“Why did he return the corporal's salute when he was not wearing a hat, then?”

Dunno. Maybe the writer, director and MF didn't know he wasn't supposed to? or didn't care?

Bit like the judge having a gavel.

There are as many different sorts of ex-military men as there are ex-anything else.

I was married to one, btw, so i met quite a few in my time.
amy1234
18-01-2012
Originally Posted by gingerjack:
“I agree , also as Watson, he didn't have that ex army officer , straight back,stiff upper lip.... been in the war's look.....he had that been in the office ......Tim look .....”

I think in the first series he very much came across as ex-army; he had post traumatic stress, the psycosomatic limp, and behaved like he'd just come out of the army. This series there wasn't much of that which makes sense as presumably he would have been out of the army for over a year and well settled into his civilian life. Regardless I think his acting was brilliant, it's not the meatiest of parts- the 'ordinary sidekick' but the understated way he responded to Sherlock's 'death', the way he coveyed the shock, devastation and loneliness was beautifully done and really made an impact. Benedict I thought was fab too, he's got more to work with as Sherlock is a rather extravagent character but he could come across as an unlikeable smarty pants in the wrong hands. This series his little flickers of desire towards Irene and the slow realisation that he cared about his friends was lovely. You could see his heartbreak at hurting them and to some degree he made a big sacrifice for them. They both seem to be able to convey so many nuances; sometimes without saying a word which for me is brilliant acting.
Eater Sundae
18-01-2012
Originally Posted by gingerjack:
“I respect your opinion , I thought Andrew Scotts performance was fantastic,”

All that was missing was a cat to stroke and a "Mwaa-haa-haa"
ericaf
18-01-2012
Its Martin Freeman I have a problem with. It is the same performance in everything he does. Expect Tim in the Hobbit too. He got a lot of praise from critics because the writers wrote him some tender moments to tug at the heart strings but there wasnt a tear in sight. At least Cumberbatch can shed a tear when called for.
scotch
18-01-2012
Love this programme.

I also love Una Stubbs as Mrs Hudson, a nice underrated role.
Smokeychan1
18-01-2012
Originally Posted by ericaf:
“Its Martin Freeman I have a problem with. It is the same performance in everything he does. Expect Tim in the Hobbit too. He got a lot of praise from critics because the writers wrote him some tender moments to tug at the heart strings but there wasnt a tear in sight. At least Cumberbatch can shed a tear when called for.”

I kind of agree. Martin seems in his comfort zone when pulling those (Tim) faces but in scenes that require more intensity, I find his acting mediocre rather than understated and am surprised at the plaudits from other FMs (not to mention last year's BAFTA panel). I almost laughed when his voice caught in his throat when talking about Sherlock's death with his therapist...it was so contrived and hammy.

But my biggest problem with the casting is a physical one. Poor Martin shows every day and more of his 40 years, whilst Benedict - despite being only 5 years younger - could pass as a school prefect in certain light. And their height difference distracts me. We don't have to wait for THE Hobbit, Martin already looks the part in Sherlock. Is he really that short?

Fortunately for me, Benedict and Mark are absolutely riveting to watch and without the former, this series would be a bit of a lame duck.
doom&gloom
18-01-2012
Martin is very likeable and that is a big plus point and he makes a good sidekick but he doesn't have much range which showed when he was in a leading role in The Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy, we'll have to see how he does in The Hobbit but if I were a Tolkien fan I'd be worried.
gingerjack
18-01-2012
Originally Posted by ericaf:
“Its Martin Freeman I have a problem with. It is the same performance in everything he does. Expect Tim in the Hobbit too. He got a lot of praise from critics because the writers wrote him some tender moments to tug at the heart strings but there wasnt a tear in sight. At least Cumberbatch can shed a tear when called for.”

He is the master of the same performance

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p_3eizxJq5o
striing
18-01-2012
Originally Posted by ballerinaemily:
“Because that's where he had left Sherlock? After the 'rubber ball' scene in the lab.”

The rubber ball scene...
brangdon
18-01-2012
Originally Posted by eggshell:
“Moriarty pretending to have the key to everything ---because he was bored. (And to make this conceit work the writers had to have Holmes and even his smarter brother believe every word of this piffle)”

Presumably they believed it because they knew there was, indeed, such a key (in their world). That Moriarty had it was made plausible by the fact that he had in fact cracked open the three high-security locations.

Quote:
“Then we have the ultimate pretention of Moriarty killing himself because there were no more challenges in the world”

And also to make his plan work. Once Holmes had sussed Moriarty had a way to call off the assassins, he was stuffed.

Quote:
“Also the incredibly convoluted plot by Moriarty relied on him getting acquitted and on Holmes killing himself. Boil it down again and the essence of him achieving this is to threaten everybody involveds nearest and dearest.”

I quite like that Moriarty ended up seeming much less impressive than we'd thought. It makes him more plausible.

Quote:
“Despite no evidence in defence and Moriarty being caught red-handed -- he's acquitted no questions asked -- really?”

That's the nature of the jury system.

Quote:
“He makes up his story about a sonic screw-driver and Sherlocks smarter brother decides he'll get this info by spilling his guts about Sherlock-- really ?”

Everyone has a weakness. Moriarty found Mycroft's.

Quote:
“Holmes is convinced that a simple binary code tapped out by Moriarty is the key -- sort of impossible except in Dr Who.”

Why impossible?

Quote:
“Best one though is them congratulating themselves on the alias that Moriarty is using that is a play on Reichenbach , the case that Holmes solved ONLY 3 months before. So effectively Moriarty was psychic if he used that as his stage name years before.”

He didn't. He faked the actor's history.

Originally Posted by Virgil Tracy:
“but someone would have to give them the order to kill or not kill since they weren't all at the scene and moriarty's dead . surely they'd be waiting fo such an order from moriarty .”

They were ordered to kill unless they were told otherwise. However, it's true there must have been an observer at the scene who could tell them to stop.

That observer is what makes faking death necessary, and also makes it harder. For example, the fall had to look real from at least two points of view, that of Watson and the observer - and Holmes could only control Watson.

Originally Posted by Trsvis_Bickle:
“The problem I have with the HOUND drug hypothesis is that it's too much of a cop-out for the writers.[...]”

Another problem is that it's hard to see how Holmes could have dosed the observer as well as Watson. If Holmes knew where the observer was and could knobble them, why not just force them to send a false "he's dead" message?

Quote:
“c) the ruse does not depend on the involvement of dozens of complicit eye witnesses”

I agree with much of what else you say. However, arranging for a number of complicit witnesses is part of Holmes' modus operandi in the book. In the TV series, he has his network of street urchins ready to do his bidding. I don't doubt that the bicycle rider who rode Watson down, and the crowd that prevented Watson from examining the body too closely, were in on it. That's only about 6 people, not dozens.
dancingdemelza
18-01-2012
Steven Moffat says fans missed a big clue - something Sherlock did that was out of character.

The only things I noticed that was out of character was Sherlock admitting that he'd got it wrong/failed How that would help in solving his apparent death, I don't know. The other was he asked for help (from Molly).

I'm joining the opinion that Moriarty wore a Sherlock mask when kidnapping the children. Molly provided a cadaver. Sherlock put the mask on the cadaver and pushed it off the roof. In the meantime Mycroft had arranged for Watson to be in an accident that caused him to be in a daze so he couldn't concentrate on the body and only thought it was Sherlock. Mycroft's men took the cadaver away on a stretcher.
dancingdemelza
18-01-2012
deleted duplicate post
Last edited by dancingdemelza : 18-01-2012 at 20:22
G926
18-01-2012
The big clue I think was the ball as many other people have mentioned.
The medical staff on the scene quickly would have been from St.Barts and may have been set up by Molly.
Them crowding around the body would only allow Watson to get to the one arm where he checked for a pulse.
And that's where the ball comes in. Apparently if you put a ball in your armpit it presses on a main artery cutting off blood-flow to the arm, hence no pulse.
IzzieStar
18-01-2012
Just had a thought re. something that Sherlock did out of character. He rang John and I don't think we've ever seen him ring somebody before - he prefers to text.

Very probably wrong though because I have no idea how that would tie in!
Sniffle774
18-01-2012
Originally Posted by Abriel:
“SM even says in that article that he lies, the meanie”

Originally Posted by Quizmike:
“He might be lying ”

So he lies about lieing which means he tells the thruth then ? So when he said he was lieing he was lieing becuase he tells the thruth but then...hang on..oh 'eck .
Stockingfiller
18-01-2012
Originally Posted by striing:
“The rubber ball scene... ”

There's an old song called 'Rubber Ball'. " Like a rubber ball, I'll come bouncing back to you- hoo- whoo". Am not surprised that they didn't use it in the episode. It's relentlessly jaunty.
dancingdemelza
18-01-2012
deleted triplicate post!
Last edited by dancingdemelza : 18-01-2012 at 20:23
chelleb
18-01-2012
oh my I am becoming obsessed !! Have just watched it again for a third time and have noticed 2 things. When Sherlock "Kidnaps" Watson after they both get arrested, just at the point that Sherlock says "he's my hostage" look at the wall at the back of them. There's a lovely bit of graffiti that says IOU and is surrounded by Angels wings. and the other is that when Molly was telling him that he reminded her of her Dad, being sad when he though no one could see him.. He stutters. Its like she has read him and knows something he thinks he has hidden. Whether this means something I don't know but he is normally very cool with Molly. Also when he is on the roof talking to John I'm sure he is crying. and finally are the 2 assassins that are not killed both men? 2 males got killed after they saved Sherlock, but when Mycrofft warned John about the 4 assassins moving into Baker St the first one he showed him was a woman, what happened to her?
Lowri
18-01-2012
Originally Posted by IzzieStar:
“Just had a thought re. something that Sherlock did out of character. He rang John and I don't think we've ever seen him ring somebody before - he prefers to text.

Very probably wrong though because I have no idea how that would tie in!”

Nice spot! I would say it was also out of character for Sherlock to admit that he had friends and show real emotion regarding their safety.
sw2963
18-01-2012
Best drama buzz since Ashes to Ashes
OnaOakey
18-01-2012
I can't help but wonder if the big out of character aspect was the fact that Sherlock was dealing with so many high profile cases at the beginning of the episode. That's really not like him.

I'd like to think that he was in some way baiting Moriarty. Pre-empting the game and planning his strategy before it had even begun...
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