It was a turn of phrase, not based upon any real knowledge. Perhaps I should not have stated that if it was going to be taken that literally.


That was not the point of what I posted - as I was replying to the claim that it was not broke (when in fact a number seemed to feel that it was).



Again I will repeat (and I am not looking for an argument here, just putting forward a pointt of view) - the pro dancers WILL change over time, as sure as night follows day. Nothing in life (or broadcasting) remains static for long. Things change, Circumstances change. Requirements change. Aspirations change. Opportunities change. And that applies to the show, the producers, and of course the pros.

I dont mind change - I just cant see why the Beeb get rid of the best pros yet leave Anton 'I cant do latin' Du Beke on there?

He's actually probably only still there because of Brucie

Agreed........just depends if you think the timing of those changes are correct.

Which is precisely why I used the term "in my mind" to demonstrate that my reading of what was perverse was purely a personal opinion (one based upon my own personal outlook on life, in that [to me,the dance is far more important an aspect than an individual dancer).


Or it might struggle to make an impact whilst being only adequate in terms of success.Only time will tell.

I agree, and judging by the news about Bruce and the results show I think they've made a bit of a boo-boo. I do believe they are trying to groom Anton for Brucie's role, which leads me to believe if they'd have known about his fatigue issues prior to all the pro turnarounds they could have brought Anton in to do the results show and saved us a decent pro.

Just a thought anyway.

All depends whether you think the qualiy of dancing on SCD is enough to make you want to watch the "dance".

I can watch a dance performed by many pro dancers but only one or two pro dancers might catch my eye........if you can watch a dance and view all the dancers as exactly the same and they all catch your eye equally then OK thats you but not me.

Me too and I am very sad at what has happened so far - and the way it was first announced too. I went to the Pro tour this year and hoped it would become a traditional fixture, where I'd see my favourite pros dance live. I wish I had known that when I saw Matt and Brian dance on the tour, that it was possibly the last time I'd see them dance as part of the SCD family.

I'm still hoping the new series will keep me hooked on SCD, as the new guys Artem and Robin look fab (on the fence about Jared), but right now everything is bittersweet with familiar faces walking away from the show.

PS Some people will go to any length to have a dig at Alesha.

I don't recall viewers blaming Lilia, Darren, Ian, Brian and Matthew for the show being broke.

Their issue seemed to be more about the presenters and the judges and the somewhat lacklustre performances last year.


You always manage to lower the one

Hello gorgeous x x x

Hardly... Darren, Lilia and Matt were all out of the show in the early weeks... in fact that might have been part of the problem! Maybe Matt with Ali, Lilia with Ricky and Darren with Laila... would have produced a far better standard of dancing and choreo

(I'm not really serious with that, although for my personal preference, would have quite like to have seen those pairings)

Sorry Ignazio - that should say 'tone' not 'one' lol! x

Fair point, but do we know what the new pros will be like, especially how they will fit in with the others and how their personalities and styles might actually captivate us (or not)?

I did not say that they were being blamed. My comment (as I said in an earlier post) referred to your claim about not fixing what was not broken (when indeed, many people on these forums had said that it was broken last year).

For me, the areas of the show which needed improvement ( not in any particular order) were:-

Brucie,
The judges,
The guest entertainers,
The quality of celebs,

I would be OK with them changing a few weaker pro dancers if they brought in better ones.

They did need to create better pro dances, and one way to do that was to have a troupe and give them more time, better sets, and let them do the choreography.

The pro dancers were actually one of the strengths of the show, but they weren't being used in the best way.

There have been a lot of constructive suggestions on this forum for how to make the show better.

I so agree - makes me wonder why the one thing nobody thought of, is what the BBC comes up with for starters.

ARGHHH! Everything is wrong, wrong, wrong. I'm starting to think that it's insulting to Vincent, Flavia and Ola to keep them. They're removing everyone else who is quality - are they not good enough to get rid of?

On a serious, less bitter, note... the decisions that to me really stink are:
- Keeping Anton, who is frequently outdanced by his celebrity partner. Getting rid of Matthew, latin champion, loved by all partners, and professional choreographer.
- Keeping Brendan, Erin, Katya, Aliona and Natalie. They, generally, produce dances that we all reluctantly sit through while waiting for the good dancers (the ones who are gone) to come on. Getting rid of Brian, Matthew, Ian, Lilia, and Darren - the soul of SCD, the reliable ones, the ones that we will always enjoy no matter what they have.
- Keeping Alesha on the panel when she proved she can't hack it, yet getting rid of the man who is the sole reason she's on the panel.

Now, before Alesha stans jump in, I'm not blaming Alesha - she didn't take that decision (although she has proven two years in a row that she can't say 'no' when she should). I'm blaming whoever made these decisions.

I know what you're saying.....give the new dancers a chance,none of this is their fault,they could be very popular etc etc and i agree i but don't agree with the BBC's decisions regarding bringing them in........why move along known popular dancers ( and before you ask if i know they are popular ask anyone esp regards Matt and Ian who went to the pro tour) and bring in new dancers all the while taking the risk that they will be as popular as the ones you've moved along

It just dosen't make sense to me.

Quite.

Double quite (except I now like Natalie ).

I like/love Brendan, Erin and Natalie. I don't mind Katia, and it's hardly fair to say that Aliona produces dances that people "reluctantly sit through" when she choreographed all of three for her celeb partner (who seemed like an obstinate pain in the bum) and then did a bunch of extremely well received pro dances with Matthew.

I'm not getting into slagging pros I don't like off to build others up, but I would profoundly disagree that all of those dancers mentioned in the second category always produce choreography that everyone is interested in watching, and most of them have series where their arse was constantly in the bottom two, often despite the natural quality of their partner, to prove it.

I like her, but I don't think she is great at Strictly. I think she's an example of someone who would have been ideally suited to the dance troupe- especially given that Ian is doing it- because the creativity of her professional choreography is far more watch-able than what she does for celebs (so far). Although less of the splits in ballroom dances would be nice!

I would say conversely Darren and Lilia are ideally suited to the main show... personally I love watching them dance professionally, but I don't think they have their equal for putting together watch-able routines for any celeb, talented or otherwise.

And then you have people like Anton, who are not suited to either

Hear Hear - well said

Yes, but not because of their choreo I think.
Ian/Denise- was more attitude/personality than anything... on both their parts, Ian mellowed a lot in the third series! Making fun of the male celebs' latin, and then saying 'Oh I didn't want to win every week' after topping the leaderboad in week two (he must be grateful to Jill then) came back to haunt them on more than one occasion. Choreo wasn't really at fault.
Ian/Zoe- that was plain and simple down to Zoe's annoying-ness. I don't think anyone could deny the genius of Ian's choreo in say the Tango and the showdance... or even the Samba, for hiding that Zoe really wasn't very good at Samba.

Darren/Emma- people hated them before she set foot on the floor. Not a choreo issue.

Lilia/Don- well there was a talent issue here, but again choreo very well respected- Don's Tango giving the lie to the argument that people of John Sergeant's age and stature could only do comedy routines.

Brian/Heather- yes, I would agree this was a choreo issue, with a bit of racism thrown in for good measure.
Brian/Ali- I think this was a personality/stop shoving their romance down my throat issue.


I don't think there were many instances where it was the choreography that let the partnership down, although if the point you're after making is that their choreo can't make people watch/vote in spite of other issues such as personality, yes that is true.

I just want to say I find it profoundly depressing that many regular posters who profess to be knowledgeable about dancing, and I am absolutely sure love the show, think it helpful to deal with the disappointment of losing their favourite pros by slagging off those who remain, even to the extent of making ridiculous comments along the lines of x is frequently outclassed by his celebs or that 'we' are reluctant to watch 'y's choreography. I would have been happy to see all the 'demoted' pros stay on the show. I liked some better than others, but I hate change. I will miss one of the demoted ones a lot more than the others. But, if some had to go, I think they have got it about right. In particular, I think it would have been madness for them to have got rid of either Brendan or Anton who are, frankly, far and away the most recogniseable pros to casual viewers.

And fans of Brendan, Erin and Natalie would probably likewise say that the personality of their celeb partners didn't help them on occasion either (in fact given that Colin Jackson is currently demonstrating amply on Celeb Masterchef that he doesn't have one, I'd say Erin deserved ample praise for the job she did on him in series 3).

Natalie I'd say deserves another chance with the public as Ian did, I don't get this whole "Brendan is a vote killer" thing given how Jo Wood, Natasha Kaplinsky, Claire King and Fiona Phillips (and to a certain extent Kelly Brook, who I think had the least public-friendly personality of anybody on the show ever) all did with him, Aliona did three dances, Katia did well and ultimately got minced by an awful set of circumstances and a silly dance-off result, and I'm not even going to get into defending Erin's watchability because then I might start going red-eyed and gnashing my teeth.

IMO Anton (yes, that Anton) and Ola are the only two pros who consistently choreograph to the public's approval. Everyone else has had serious wobbly moments, and also times when they've upset the apple-cart in a positive fashion, apart from those without enough show-time to have really proved themselves.

I think DS has always been a place where people have felt free to say what they think of the pros... as long as it doesn't break T&Cs, I don't see what the problem is with that.

I don't think it's the case that people have decided 'my favourite's gone, so I'll start criticising Anton (or similar) to deal with my disappointment'... I think a lot of people are genuinely confused and even disappointed that certain pros have been kept on despite having a much poorer record and being quite widely agreed to be not fit for purpose (sorry that's harsh I know).

And that leads on to a more general disappointment about what the BBC have prioritised for the show... if, as you say, they have chosen to keep on 'far and away the most recognisable pros to casual viewers' for that reason and not for the sake of making the show as dazzling and entertaining as possible, that is disappointing. I commented on another thread recently, that in my straw poll at work, pretty much everyone had heard of Anton, but they had heard of him in a very negative way... eg for the racism debacle last year, for the cheesy jokes, for 'not really being able to dance' (not my words). None of these things is likely to make a casual Saturday night viewer switch over. And it's not likely to make the show quality what it could be.