I just realised that there were 2 Romanas with Tom Baker ie Lala Ward and Mary Tamm, I remember Mary Tamm but not Lala Ward so can someone tell me if Romana regenrated like the Dr or did they just re-cast and not mention the original again?
how did the 2 Romanas change?
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Originally Posted by baldbilluk:
“I just realised that there were 2 Romanas with Tom Baker ie Lala Ward and Mary Tamm, I remember Mary Tamm but not Lala Ward so can someone tell me if Romana regenrated like the Dr or did they just re-cast and not mention the original again?”
“I just realised that there were 2 Romanas with Tom Baker ie Lala Ward and Mary Tamm, I remember Mary Tamm but not Lala Ward so can someone tell me if Romana regenrated like the Dr or did they just re-cast and not mention the original again?
”
Sh regenerated....in fact more than once untill she settled on the Princess Astra body....
Originally Posted by baldbilluk:
“I just realised that there were 2 Romanas with Tom Baker ie Lala Ward and Mary Tamm, I remember Mary Tamm but not Lala Ward so can someone tell me if Romana regenrated like the Dr or did they just re-cast and not mention the original again?”
“I just realised that there were 2 Romanas with Tom Baker ie Lala Ward and Mary Tamm, I remember Mary Tamm but not Lala Ward so can someone tell me if Romana regenrated like the Dr or did they just re-cast and not mention the original again?
”
Lalla Ward first appeared as Princess Astra in The Armageddon Factor, Mary Tam's last story as Romana. The next series began with Romana choosing to regenerate into a copy of Princess Astra's body because she happened to like it. Given that Romana was already established as being a Time Lady, they would not have simply recast the character without having her regenerate. They didn't do that sort of thing on Who.
Do you know I have just seen that!!! I was just curious as I assumed that all the companions were human, now realise that some were not, thanks a lot for replying
Originally Posted by baldbilluk:
“Do you know I have just seen that!!! I was just curious as I assumed that all the companions were human, now realise that some were not, thanks a lot for replying”
“Do you know I have just seen that!!! I was just curious as I assumed that all the companions were human, now realise that some were not, thanks a lot for replying”
Aside from Romana, other companions not from Earth included Adric (who was from Alzarius), Vislor Turlough (who was from Trion) and Nyssa (who was from Traken), as well as the Doctor's granddaughter, Susan (from Gallifrey, as far as we know). Leela was from a tribe on an unnamed planet who were descended from Earth colonists.
Some questions.
1. Why did Romana regenarate (apart from the obvious reason that Mary Tamm no longer wanted to play her)?
(a) Did she just choose to regenerate for no other reason than vanity or being bored with her current appearance?
or
(b) Was the regeneration perhaps triggered by an injury she sustained in an unscreened adventure between the "The Armageddon Factor" and "Destiny of the Daleks"?
2. If Romana could select the body she regenerates into, why can't the Doctor? It always seems to be pot luck with him.
1. Why did Romana regenarate (apart from the obvious reason that Mary Tamm no longer wanted to play her)?
(a) Did she just choose to regenerate for no other reason than vanity or being bored with her current appearance?
or
(b) Was the regeneration perhaps triggered by an injury she sustained in an unscreened adventure between the "The Armageddon Factor" and "Destiny of the Daleks"?
2. If Romana could select the body she regenerates into, why can't the Doctor? It always seems to be pot luck with him.
As for number one, we never get a solid reason as to why Romana regenerates (I know, tell me about it! 
)
Number (2): In Mark of the Rani, the Rani states that female Timelords have the extra ability to choose what they look like, wheras the males are stuck with what they have
)Number (2): In Mark of the Rani, the Rani states that female Timelords have the extra ability to choose what they look like, wheras the males are stuck with what they have
Originally Posted by Vabosity:
“Some questions.
1. Why did Romana regenarate (apart from the obvious reason that Mary Tamm no longer wanted to play her)?
(a) Did she just choose to regenerate for no other reason than vanity or being bored with her current appearance?
or
(b) Was the regeneration perhaps triggered by an injury she sustained in an unscreened adventure between the "The Arageddon Factor" and "Destiny of the Daleks"?
2. If Romana could select the body she regenerates into, why can't the Doctor? It always seems to be pot luck with him.”
“Some questions.
1. Why did Romana regenarate (apart from the obvious reason that Mary Tamm no longer wanted to play her)?
(a) Did she just choose to regenerate for no other reason than vanity or being bored with her current appearance?
or
(b) Was the regeneration perhaps triggered by an injury she sustained in an unscreened adventure between the "The Arageddon Factor" and "Destiny of the Daleks"?
2. If Romana could select the body she regenerates into, why can't the Doctor? It always seems to be pot luck with him.”
Romana regenerated simply because she felt like it (it was later suggested in the books that she felt her new incarnation would be a better 'fit' with the Doctor's personality if they were to continue to travel together). I think it's generally accepted that the regeneration process can be controlled to some degree but the Doctor has never bothered to learn the necessary mental disciplines.
Originally Posted by davrosdodebird:
“Number (2): In Mark of the Rani, the Rani states that female Timelords have the extra ability to choose what they look like, wheras the males are stuck with what they have”
“Number (2): In Mark of the Rani, the Rani states that female Timelords have the extra ability to choose what they look like, wheras the males are stuck with what they have
”
Thanks for that fact.
I don't actually remember the Rani saying that, but then it's been 25 years since I saw "Mark of the Rani", it's one of my least favourite stories, so I haven't watched any repeats of it.
Originally Posted by tingramretro:
“Romana regenerated simply because she felt like it (it was later suggested in the books that she felt her new incarnation would be a better 'fit' with the Doctor's personality if they were to continue to travel together). I think it's generally accepted that the regeneration process can be controlled to some degree but the Doctor has never bothered to learn the necessary mental disciplines.”
“Romana regenerated simply because she felt like it (it was later suggested in the books that she felt her new incarnation would be a better 'fit' with the Doctor's personality if they were to continue to travel together). I think it's generally accepted that the regeneration process can be controlled to some degree but the Doctor has never bothered to learn the necessary mental disciplines.”
Thanks.
Originally Posted by Vabosity:
“Some questions.
1. Why did Romana regenarate (apart from the obvious reason that Mary Tamm no longer wanted to play her)?
(a) Did she just choose to regenerate for no other reason than vanity or being bored with her current appearance?
or
(b) Was the regeneration perhaps triggered by an injury she sustained in an unscreened adventure between the "The Armageddon Factor" and "Destiny of the Daleks"?
2. If Romana could select the body she regenerates into, why can't the Doctor? It always seems to be pot luck with him.”
“Some questions.
1. Why did Romana regenarate (apart from the obvious reason that Mary Tamm no longer wanted to play her)?
(a) Did she just choose to regenerate for no other reason than vanity or being bored with her current appearance?
or
(b) Was the regeneration perhaps triggered by an injury she sustained in an unscreened adventure between the "The Armageddon Factor" and "Destiny of the Daleks"?
2. If Romana could select the body she regenerates into, why can't the Doctor? It always seems to be pot luck with him.”
There's been a number of attempts to explain the regeneration.
From Wikipedia
Quote:
“Romana's tongue-in-cheek regeneration scene in Destiny of the Daleks contrasts markedly with the Doctor's transformations. In the first episode of the serial, Romana undergoes regeneration, in the process trying out several different forms before choosing to adopt the appearance of Princess Astra, a character she encountered in a previous adventure (The Armageddon Factor).
Doctor Who television writer and script editor Eric Saward suggests in his 1985 novelisation of The Twin Dilemma (1984) that Time Lords can control the appearance of their next body if they trigger the regeneration voluntarily, but not if the regeneration is caused by death or injury. The Doctor Who Role Playing Game by FASA suggested that some Time Lords have a special ability to control their regenerations.
The fan reference book The Discontinuity Guide suggests that the various "try-ons" were projections of potential future incarnations like the K'anpo Rinpoche/Cho Je situation in Planet of the Spiders.[8] Miles and Wood's About Time also mentions this along with theorising that the Time Lords had improved the technology of regeneration since the Doctor's time; Romana, being of a later generation than the Doctor, would therefore have finer control over the regenerative process in its early stages.[9] Aside from the how of it, at least three attempts have been made in the spin-off media to explain the necessity for Romana's regeneration.[LIST][*]In the short story "The Lying Old Witch in the Wardrobe" by Mark Michalowski, published in the Big Finish Productions anthology, Short Trips: Companions, unknown to the Doctor, Romana suffers damage due to exposure to the Key to Time. Just as she is about to regenerate, a humanoid manifestation of the TARDIS, jealous of Romana, traps her in a force field. It proceeds to pretend to be Romana, changing into different forms until finally becoming a double of Princess Astra. This manifestation is the one who appears in Destiny of the Daleks. Realising the error of its ways after that adventure, it releases Romana, but not before making the female Time Lord assume the image of Astra.[/LIST][LIST][*]The second explanation, which may or may not be consistent with the first, is given in the Gallifrey audio series. Gallifrey: Lies by Gary Russell reveals that Romana forced her own regeneration to prevent an ancient Gallifreyan evil called Pandora from gaining power over her (see also History of the Time Lords - Audio plays).[/LIST][LIST][*]The third explanation is in the Fifth Doctor audio story The Chaos Pool by Peter Anghelides, which states that the creators of the Key to Time re-disguised its final segment as Romana, which is why she changed and why she chose Astra's form. It is possible that the previous explanation was arranged by the Key's makers to facilitate this one.”
“Romana's tongue-in-cheek regeneration scene in Destiny of the Daleks contrasts markedly with the Doctor's transformations. In the first episode of the serial, Romana undergoes regeneration, in the process trying out several different forms before choosing to adopt the appearance of Princess Astra, a character she encountered in a previous adventure (The Armageddon Factor).
Doctor Who television writer and script editor Eric Saward suggests in his 1985 novelisation of The Twin Dilemma (1984) that Time Lords can control the appearance of their next body if they trigger the regeneration voluntarily, but not if the regeneration is caused by death or injury. The Doctor Who Role Playing Game by FASA suggested that some Time Lords have a special ability to control their regenerations.
The fan reference book The Discontinuity Guide suggests that the various "try-ons" were projections of potential future incarnations like the K'anpo Rinpoche/Cho Je situation in Planet of the Spiders.[8] Miles and Wood's About Time also mentions this along with theorising that the Time Lords had improved the technology of regeneration since the Doctor's time; Romana, being of a later generation than the Doctor, would therefore have finer control over the regenerative process in its early stages.[9] Aside from the how of it, at least three attempts have been made in the spin-off media to explain the necessity for Romana's regeneration.[LIST][*]In the short story "The Lying Old Witch in the Wardrobe" by Mark Michalowski, published in the Big Finish Productions anthology, Short Trips: Companions, unknown to the Doctor, Romana suffers damage due to exposure to the Key to Time. Just as she is about to regenerate, a humanoid manifestation of the TARDIS, jealous of Romana, traps her in a force field. It proceeds to pretend to be Romana, changing into different forms until finally becoming a double of Princess Astra. This manifestation is the one who appears in Destiny of the Daleks. Realising the error of its ways after that adventure, it releases Romana, but not before making the female Time Lord assume the image of Astra.[/LIST][LIST][*]The second explanation, which may or may not be consistent with the first, is given in the Gallifrey audio series. Gallifrey: Lies by Gary Russell reveals that Romana forced her own regeneration to prevent an ancient Gallifreyan evil called Pandora from gaining power over her (see also History of the Time Lords - Audio plays).[/LIST][LIST][*]The third explanation is in the Fifth Doctor audio story The Chaos Pool by Peter Anghelides, which states that the creators of the Key to Time re-disguised its final segment as Romana, which is why she changed and why she chose Astra's form. It is possible that the previous explanation was arranged by the Key's makers to facilitate this one.”
[/LIST]
Originally Posted by davrosdodebird:
“As for number one, we never get a solid reason as to why Romana regenerates (I know, tell me about it!)
Number (2): In Mark of the Rani, the Rani states that female Timelords have the extra ability to choose what they look like, wheras the males are stuck with what they have”
“As for number one, we never get a solid reason as to why Romana regenerates (I know, tell me about it!
)Number (2): In Mark of the Rani, the Rani states that female Timelords have the extra ability to choose what they look like, wheras the males are stuck with what they have
”
Are you sure? I can't recall ever seeing that this had been actually stated in the show.
Yep - 'm pretty much 100% that the Rani said the Doctor was "stuck with what you've got" - it was in the scene where the Master shows up at the bath house and says hello to Peri
I might just go and watch that story now...
I might just go and watch that story now...
Originally Posted by davrosdodebird:
“In Mark of the Rani, the Rani states that female Timelords have the extra ability to choose what they look like, wheras the males are stuck with what they have”
“In Mark of the Rani, the Rani states that female Timelords have the extra ability to choose what they look like, wheras the males are stuck with what they have
”
You're misremembering, I'm afraid.
Got a link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k59HG...eature=related
She says it pretty much at the start
She says it pretty much at the start
Quote:
“ "Your regeneration isn't very attractive either! But at least I can change my appearance, you're stuck with what you've got!"
"My face is of no importance, brain regeneration, that's what I need! I should have been able to pin this one down to you..."”
“ "Your regeneration isn't very attractive either! But at least I can change my appearance, you're stuck with what you've got!"
"My face is of no importance, brain regeneration, that's what I need! I should have been able to pin this one down to you..."”
Originally Posted by davrosdodebird:
“Got a link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k59HG...eature=related
She says it pretty much at the start”
“Got a link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k59HG...eature=related
She says it pretty much at the start
”
I'm at work and can't access the site - what is said exactly?
Originally Posted by outside:
“I'm at work and can't access the site - what is said exactly?”
“I'm at work and can't access the site - what is said exactly?
”
look above for my edit
There is the possibility she is talking about her clothes (At the beginning, the Doctor says they do nothing for her.)
But as the Rani mentions the Doctor's regeneration before mentioning that he is "stuck with what he's got", I think it's more likely that it's the regeneration she's talking about
Originally Posted by davrosdodebird:
“Got a link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k59HG...eature=related
She says it pretty much at the start”
“Got a link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k59HG...eature=related
She says it pretty much at the start
”
Pretty sure she is just talking about her clothes rather than a regeneration.
The Doctor insults her clothes, she then insults his new face.
Then she says that at least she can change her appearance (meaning the clothes she is wearing) while the Doctor has to keep his face.
If she is talking about changing her form it makes it sound like she can do it whenever she wants (ie not just during regeneration).
Isn't that kinda what Romana did?
EDIT: Nice to see you bring clarity to that (vaguely worded) scene, Corwin. Pip & Jane Baker were never very good at that sort of thing
EDIT: Nice to see you bring clarity to that (vaguely worded) scene, Corwin. Pip & Jane Baker were never very good at that sort of thing
Originally Posted by davrosdodebird:
“Isn't that kinda what Romana did?
EDIT: Nice to see you bring clarity to that scene, corwin. Pip & Jane Baker were never very good at that sort of thing”
“Isn't that kinda what Romana did?
EDIT: Nice to see you bring clarity to that scene, corwin. Pip & Jane Baker were never very good at that sort of thing
”
Well Romana had just regenerated and as we saw in the Christmas Invasion a Time Lords body is somewhat flexible (the Doctor growing a new hand)in the hours post regeneration.
My take on the whole thing is
All Time Lords (both male and female) can choose their new look if the regeneration is not due to dying. Even then some Time Lords have more control over it than others.
For example
Docs #2 to #3. The Time Lords offered the Doctor a choice of bodies so it's obvious that it doesn't have to be random for male Time Lords.
A bit more vague but the Master decides to be Young when changing from Yana.
I've always put the Doctors lack of "regeneration skill" down to him being half human
Originally Posted by Corwin:
“Well Romana had just regenerated and as we saw in the Christmas Invasion a Time Lords body is somewhat flexible (the Doctor growing a new hand)in the hours post regeneration.
My take on the whole thing is
All Time Lords (both male and female) can choose their new look if the regeneration is not due to dying. Even then some Time Lords have more control over it than others.
For example
Docs #2 to #3. The Time Lords offered the Doctor a choice of bodies so it's obvious that it doesn't have to be random for male Time Lords.
A bit more vague but the Master decides to be Young when changing from Yana.
I've always put the Doctors lack of "regeneration skill" down to him being half human”
“Well Romana had just regenerated and as we saw in the Christmas Invasion a Time Lords body is somewhat flexible (the Doctor growing a new hand)in the hours post regeneration.
My take on the whole thing is
All Time Lords (both male and female) can choose their new look if the regeneration is not due to dying. Even then some Time Lords have more control over it than others.
For example
Docs #2 to #3. The Time Lords offered the Doctor a choice of bodies so it's obvious that it doesn't have to be random for male Time Lords.
A bit more vague but the Master decides to be Young when changing from Yana.
I've always put the Doctors lack of "regeneration skill" down to him being half human
”
And there opens another Can of Worms!!!!
I think his lack of control maybe down to the fact that he is well a bit of disorganised personality....very out of control when it comes to wanting something...he can't the Tardis properly...he has thousand thoughts in his head at the same time sometimes...he isn't focused enough I feel to do what he wants...hence why he may have felt that he will end up with no head in Parting of the ways....and wassuprised to have legs and everything in EOT, mainly because he also thought he may die this time....and seemes suprised on his look most of the time...unlike Romana...who had no difficulty in choosing...
And there's also the fact that the Doctor only just passed his exam, with 51% on the 2nd try...
I think I would have trouble if I got that result at the Academy
I think I would have trouble if I got that result at the Academy
Originally Posted by crazzyaz7:
“And there opens another Can of Worms!!!!
I think his lack of control maybe down to the fact that he is well a bit of disorganised personality....very out of control when it comes to wanting something...he can't the Tardis properly...he has thousand thoughts in his head at the same time sometimes...he isn't focused enough I feel to do what he wants...hence why he may have felt that he will end up with no head in Parting of the ways....and wassuprised to have legs and everything in EOT, mainly because he also thought he may die this time....and seemes suprised on his look most of the time...unlike Romana...who had no difficulty in choosing...”
“And there opens another Can of Worms!!!!
I think his lack of control maybe down to the fact that he is well a bit of disorganised personality....very out of control when it comes to wanting something...he can't the Tardis properly...he has thousand thoughts in his head at the same time sometimes...he isn't focused enough I feel to do what he wants...hence why he may have felt that he will end up with no head in Parting of the ways....and wassuprised to have legs and everything in EOT, mainly because he also thought he may die this time....and seemes suprised on his look most of the time...unlike Romana...who had no difficulty in choosing...”
The 10th Doctor seemed to have some control over his regenerations, he was able to deflect the energy to his handy spare hand in JE, and to postpone the actual regen in TEoT.
It seems a bit perverse to me to regenerate on purpose just because you want a change. It's wasting a whole regeneration! She'll be sorry when she gets to her 12th.
Originally Posted by Granny McSmith:
“The 10th Doctor seemed to have some control over his regenerations, he was able to deflect the energy to his handy spare hand in JE, and to postpone the actual regen in TEoT.
It seems a bit perverse to me to regenerate on purpose just because you want a change. It's wasting a whole regeneration! She'll be sorry when she gets to her 12th.”
“The 10th Doctor seemed to have some control over his regenerations, he was able to deflect the energy to his handy spare hand in JE, and to postpone the actual regen in TEoT.
It seems a bit perverse to me to regenerate on purpose just because you want a change. It's wasting a whole regeneration! She'll be sorry when she gets to her 12th.
”
Yes he did manage to deflect it didn't he.....but we have no idea when abouts the idea may have popped into his mind...I doubt very much he knew form the onset that he will do such a thing....
I think the Romana thing could also poo-poo the whole 13 regeneration thing
Or maybe just like Humans where females tend to live for longer....Time Ladies probably are given a bigger batch of regenerations?
Originally Posted by crazzyaz7:
“
I think the Romana thing could also poo-poo the whole 13 regeneration thing Or maybe just like Humans where females tend to live for longer....Time Ladies probably are given a bigger batch of regenerations?”
“
I think the Romana thing could also poo-poo the whole 13 regeneration thing
Or maybe just like Humans where females tend to live for longer....Time Ladies probably are given a bigger batch of regenerations?”
But there's no reason to suggest she used up multiple regenerations.
Either (Classic series explanation) they were just projections she tried on before selecting a permanant form (as with K'anpo Rinpoche/Cho Je or possibly the Doctor/Watcher)
Or (nuwho Explanation) her control over regeneration was so good that she could alter her form a number of times in the hours after regeneration when a Time Lord body is still in a state where it can be altered (such as regrowing of limbs).
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