I wasn't criticising you and I wasn't necessarily referring to you, I quoted you because it kind of fitted with what I wanted to say. I didn't contribute to the forum when RTD was the show, and to a certain degree I'm pleased about that. The amount of bile directed at him, would have made me sick. SM is not critcised as much (I'm more of an SM girl myself). I generally don't like it if things are hyped too much (I also don't like too many spoilers), because I like surprises and I don't want to be disappointed. In that context I agreed with John. If someone had said the same about RTD a few years back and I had been an active member of this forum, I would have said the same about RTD.

I don't usually disagree with you Muttley but on this one I do - it may be the executive producer's (hate Americanisms) role to promote their show but it is not their "duty" to hype it up - it is their duty to produce the requisite amount of episodes, on time, on budget and to a standard that is expected...now it's true that DS and other media rehash quotes on slow news days to make it sound like they're being said over and over but I do not believe anywhere in SM'S contract with the BBC (or RTD'S back then) that it says he has to start telling any microphone that will listen just how fabulous his new idea is.

Again, I agree. Someone asked a question about SM and I answered it. If the question was about RTD I would have answered it the same way.

I do hope you are wrong. I want River to be just River.

Thank you, that's exactly what I meant. I'm not thinking about RTD versus SM, I like them both for different things and I will defend them, and I will criticise them as well.

Me too

I wonder if Amy has got a Fob watch.

My theory is that Amy is in fact the Doctor’s granddaughter Susan who was hidden by the Doctor’s mother (the Woman seen in The End of Time).

I think that her true identity is restored and the Doctor instantly recognises her and hugs her. Rory (or River Song) sees this and in a fit of jealousy (not realising who Amy actually is) tries to kill The Doctor (or Amy). Amy/Susan is hit and regenerates into her new body.

Not bad, but I don't think River is the jealous type.

I do have a feeling a fobwatch is going to come into it somewhere, though.

It was the restorative gasses from the terraforming globe that renewed her, so many people just can't see it from the episode !

Oddly that's what I thought...I didn't know it was in doubt

....Amy wears a lot of scarves. Now call me strange if you like but didn't u know who wear a lot of scarves. (Wot is the plural of scarf?)

Amy is really Sally Sparrow...

Scarves!

And are you suggesting that Amy is actually Tom Baker?

That's the line I was going to take, until I thought that wouldn't have been surprised by the events of the Pandorica Opens if already lived through it

This, they made it obvious by making the exact same gas spew out of her mouth before they revived her. There is little to argue over I'm sure if/when we see her next the Doctor will quickly speculate over it and explain.


I reckon this amy/doctor relationship may still be to do with young amelia (more timey wimey) , and the dodgy Leadworth stuff. Her inclusion in the final seemed a bit out of place if it was a final appearance, given that they killed her off a few minutes in and that was that. Also, that dream where it was day time and the tardis was returning...

Hell, maybe Amy, Amelia and Rory will all go off on an adventure together, that would be awkward.

I don't think he should mess with Amy's backstory anymore. Though it is fairly convenient that her parents are back just like that. She really does just need to stay as a normal girl who was caught up in it all, not some fob watched Time Lord or anything similar.

Her character should now be about moving forward not us discovering crazy things from her past. Surely everyone will be rolling their eyes if she turns out to be connected to River in some way.

If Moffat's plan was to create some revelation about Amy's parentage, he wouldn't have made the climax of the last series so focussed on Amy's parentage. You can't make such a fuss about Amy's parents having been taken away, and having them restored, just to say that, oh, actually they weren't her parents.

You know what??? I rather she was the Rani!!!!


On the topic of the exect producers upping their work.....well even if it isn't in their exact, word to word job description....it has became part of their job. They are expected to raise the profile of the show, because they are as much as the face of it as are the lead actors.....even if they hated their work, they will not tell anyone that was the case. As producers they have to sell, and that is what all this "its the best thing you'll ecver see" is all about....I'd rather that than Tim Kring, who has to aplogise for disappointing fans, and admitting he has no belief in the work he has created....it makes me feel, well he didn't care for it much, how will I?
Every journo, and many fans, and those working on the show, will have to believe that the work (as head writers as well) the producer is producing is worth the time and effort before it is even shown on the screen. RTD has admitted how much he hates talking to the press in the Writer's Tale, so much so that he can have panic attacks.....so who is to say that Moff is saying all that because he too is being arrogant...or actually doing and saying all that because it has beome part of the job...whether written down or not. Yes for some it may be off putting, but there are some of us, like me, who get excited with teasers by the likes of RTD and Moff, and rarely are disappointed.

So whether you like it or not...Moff will continue doing it...he has to do it....and good on him I say...

You forgot to put this in spoilers Tony. Now you've ruined it for everyone

anyway..... I'm sure Amy is just Amy, and the part where Moffat comments...

"You will see the Doctor's life change forever, you will gasp in astonishment at the true nature of his relationship with Amy"

I'm sure this is nothing more than the same kind of feeling everyone has had themselves when during your school days one of your best pals does something completely out of character that is a bit 'off'... You don't say anything but you know things can never be the same again.... I know I've had this anyway...

Me thinks that this is all that will happen and that Amy isn't a past character at all.... I think that since that great reveal where Prof Yana turned out to be the Master everyone is obsessed with the same thing happening again....

Look at things the other way round from how we looked at them last series.
We know that Amy lost her parents because the crack in her bedroom erased them from her history, therefore the Doctor took an interest in her, therefore the Alliance used her memories to create the Pandorica, TARDIS blows up, etc., etc.
What if it's the other way around? If the 'mysterious other' engineered the TARDIS to explode at that particular date, so that an individual whose timeline was connected to an important moment on that date would become of interest to the Doctor. What if the whole arc of last series was just a plan to get Amy aboard the TARDIS?

Or that River is Amy's great-great-great-great-granddaughter. One or the other.

Could be the other way around...River regenerated into Amy in the library instead of staying dead...

But there is still a problem of a Time Lady meeting her past and/or future self, so I doubt that Amy is River.

I agree with you there, and of course I would expect them to say it's great and to promote it. What I don't like it's when it's too much hyped "It will be jawdropping, and the best finale every", etc. IMO it leads to wrong expectations and the attempt to outdo the last finale (e.g. how often can you destroy the Universe). I love the story archs, but I do agree with some people on here that they sometimes distract from a good story.

Even Matt has been guilty of this, in one of the DW magazines he went on how these were the best stories ever written for Doctor Who. Really Matt? Are you saying that all stories without you and not written by Moff were rubbish ? (and I really love Matt).


As said before in my case it's just building up too much excitement and then not living up to it. Teasers are great, telling me that my jaw will drop and that this is an even more exciting finale than the last one is not working for me personally. I think we live in a fast food society where everything has always to be bigger and better. Write a good story and tell me that you have written a good story, but don't tell me it's the best story since sliced bread.

Whether people like it or not that's my opinion, and I'm well aware that Moff won't stop doing it because of me, and why should he.

Oh yeah sure...its definitely your opinion...and I wouldn't ask you to change it..... (might threaten you, but won't ask you)

And I can see why some would be disappointed if it doesn't live up to the expectation of the hype...but at the same time, we can equally end up hyping an episode ourself (as I did with Victory) without much of the likes of Moff or RTD saying its the best thing since slice bread....and then still end up being disappointed.....but then in the end our like and dislikes differ so much that if one person is disappointed...there will be always someone else that has been more than satisfied with what the saw.....

Also for all we know, maybe those who are praiing their work do actually believe that....after all, when recently I introduced my friend to Doctor Who...al I kept saying was "oh its the best show on Earth, there are episodes that I know you are just going to love!!" when in actual fact she could end up hating them..... so we all do it.....and as sellers of the show, the likesof Moff/RTD, Matt/David will definitely say that what they have just made is out of gold....rightly or wrongly

Don't think Amy is River song. There were a lot of rumours about Omega returning so I think he might be involved in her origin.

The silence is very likely a group/cult linked to Omega and River song is probably a member of it. The title of the episode silence in the library fits in with this.

I can't help thinking that the duck pond might be Checkov's gun but Amy being a transformed duck is too silly, maybe Omega's hiding under it?


.

Just seen your response now. I think I completely understand why they are doing it, but I just think they need to tread a fine line, so that it doesn't become too much. No writer will ever say, oh good this is sh*te.

By the way, my last line in my other post was meant as a bit of a joke.