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Smooth National Radio Thread |
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#2626 |
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Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 183
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Quote:
An excellent post my wife has said exactly the same thing and she is no radio anorak either and has never posted on a forum in her life.
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#2627 |
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Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,501
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Quote:
But under that remit it does not mean they have to stick with say 500 or 1,000 regularly rotated songs that the average listener will hear 5 times or more a week.
I'm basing this on London's figures because I believe Parky's strategy will be to aggressively build listening in London at the expense of Magic. But even if you look at the Smooths with the best hours, the "average listener" hears no more than an hour and 20 minutes of the station per day. A music scheduler will move songs through hours and dayparts, so it will be perhaps 3 days before a song returns to the same daypart and probably much longer until it returns to the same hour. There will also be "Yesterday" and "Prior Day" separation that prevents a song repeating in a window of, say, two hours for 2-3 days. So how on earth will the "average listener" hear the same song 5 or more times a week? Does anyone posting on here actually have even a basic grasp of how people listen to the radio or how music scheduling works? In a crowded market like London or Birmingham with plenty of other stations playing broadly popular songs, how do you propose you would build audience rotating 10,000 songs of which 95% are favourites of perhaps less than 2% of the audience? "Ooh, I must listen to that station that plays all those mediocre songs I've never heard of whilst driving home from work!". Great business model. And, while I'm ranting, why do DS posters all assume that because one song by a particular artist is popular, it is the law that you must play that artist's entire back catalogue. Normal people don't have this anal, completist appreciation of music. They like a song or they don't. |
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#2628 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 1,405
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OH DEAR .things went a bit wrong for the 'Kid' there,,,he was doing the only 'content' of his programme ie the read for the Top 500' and went into the Mitch Johnson voiceover outro.and whilst it was playing the 'Kid' was saying 'and the Hollies are next'.
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#2629 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 491
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Radio 2 actually has more repetition of tracks compared to Smooth! mostly new releases!
http://comparemyradio.com/stations/BBC_Radio_2 |
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#2630 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Newport Pagnell
Posts: 21,350
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Quote:
Smooth London has average hours of 4 - less than 50 minutes per day even if you discount weekends. Radio listening tends to be habitual, so most listeners listen to the same daypart and probably even the same hour of output every day.
I'm basing this on London's figures because I believe Parky's strategy will be to aggressively build listening in London at the expense of Magic. But even if you look at the Smooths with the best hours, the "average listener" hears no more than an hour and 20 minutes of the station per day. A music scheduler will move songs through hours and dayparts, so it will be perhaps 3 days before a song returns to the same daypart and probably much longer until it returns to the same hour. There will also be "Yesterday" and "Prior Day" separation that prevents a song repeating in a window of, say, two hours for 2-3 days. So how on earth will the "average listener" hear the same song 5 or more times a week? Does anyone posting on here actually have even a basic grasp of how people listen to the radio or how music scheduling works? In a crowded market like London or Birmingham with plenty of other stations playing broadly popular songs, how do you propose you would build audience rotating 10,000 songs of which 95% are favourites of perhaps less than 2% of the audience? "Ooh, I must listen to that station that plays all those mediocre songs I've never heard of whilst driving home from work!". Great business model. And, while I'm ranting, why do DS posters all assume that because one song by a particular artist is popular, it is the law that you must play that artist's entire back catalogue. Normal people don't have this anal, completist appreciation of music. They like a song or they don't. I listen to about what you said the average listener does each day, around 80 minutes or so. I also listen at a reasonably similar time frame. The fact is that I have heard the same song within the average listener confines approximately 4 or 5 times within 7 to 10 days. More than one song infact. You asked if anyone listening and writing on here actually has any idea about how music scheduling works. Why should we? We're listeners, not controllers. There are thousands of very well know popular hit songs, not just a few hundred! Not sure where the mediocity and unknown argument comes from. Artists such as Elton have had countless hits that are instantly recognisable. They play 3 or 4 of his, but it is fair to assume that a large swathe of his back catalogue is popular and should feature on Smooth. A good example is Blue Eyes which is perfect for Smooth but never heard. Which brings me to something ironic in its way. Is Cliff Richard banned from Smooth like elsewhere? Not heard him at all, yet he has plenty of popular hits worth playing on Smooth that the target audience would want to hear, from his mid 70's to mid 80's period especially. |
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#2631 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 2,227
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Quote:
Smooth London has average hours of 4 - less than 50 minutes per day even if you discount weekends. Radio listening tends to be habitual, so most listeners listen to the same daypart and probably even the same hour of output every day.
I'm basing this on London's figures because I believe Parky's strategy will be to aggressively build listening in London at the expense of Magic. But even if you look at the Smooths with the best hours, the "average listener" hears no more than an hour and 20 minutes of the station per day. A music scheduler will move songs through hours and dayparts, so it will be perhaps 3 days before a song returns to the same daypart and probably much longer until it returns to the same hour. There will also be "Yesterday" and "Prior Day" separation that prevents a song repeating in a window of, say, two hours for 2-3 days. So how on earth will the "average listener" hear the same song 5 or more times a week? Does anyone posting on here actually have even a basic grasp of how people listen to the radio or how music scheduling works? In a crowded market like London or Birmingham with plenty of other stations playing broadly popular songs, how do you propose you would build audience rotating 10,000 songs of which 95% are favourites of perhaps less than 2% of the audience? "Ooh, I must listen to that station that plays all those mediocre songs I've never heard of whilst driving home from work!". Great business model. And, while I'm ranting, why do DS posters all assume that because one song by a particular artist is popular, it is the law that you must play that artist's entire back catalogue. Normal people don't have this anal, completist appreciation of music. They like a song or they don't. I don't think DS posters are assuming for one minute that all songs by a particular artist should be played what they are saying is that they don't want to hear the same song by the same artist eg Stevie Winwood - Valerie over and over. Either play another Winwood popular track such as Higher Ground or a well known track by a different artist. I also don't think that anyone on here is suggesting a rotation of 10000 songs we are not idiots or completely naïve when it comes to music scheduling. What I will say though is that radio programmers ought to accept that listeners have a brain that can hold many more than 500 songs as acceptable tracks we are not stupid why do you think people have large CD collections or large numbers of tracks on our ipods. Could it be that this is because we are actually brassed of with hearing the same old trash on the radio over & over. Off thread but my 27 year old daughter stopped listening to radio in her car a few months back as she was fed up always hearing the same tracks everytime she drove to work. She now always listens to ipod or CD's. She previously listened to Heart & Kiss. Oh and she doesn't listen to radio indoors and she is certainly not a radio anorak.. |
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#2632 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 3,628
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I think they have the same playlist and have it one a shuffle loop all day. I have tried listening at different times and still the same songs very poor radio in my opinion especially with older tunes.
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#2633 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 183
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OH DEAR .things went a bit wrong for the 'Kid' there,,,he was doing the only 'content' of his programme ie the read for the Top 500' and went into the Mitch Johnson voiceover outro.and whilst it was playing the 'Kid' was saying 'and the Hollies are next'.
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#2634 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 1,405
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Shocking, heard that too, really truly shocking, if its recorded it could be excused, if it is live , it makes it a whole lot worse with what can be described as nothing other than appalling attention to detail or just simply not caring ...Let's hope the new PD understands what the listener wants and is not just an over paid puppet on a string; now there is a link for the next "Kid" show if they have some creative producer to help him lol.... also why do they feel the need to have had a voice over saying "this is Smooth radio on remembrance day", quite clichéd if you ask me................., Next what are we going to get "this is Smooth on a Monday coming up around corner Its the "Kid with his Atlas of artist home towns ", and he's recorded this one before in a blue Peter type Way "...............GOD give me strength!!!!ALL WE WANT IS A RELATABLE,FRIENDLY SOUNDING JOCK, THAT CAN DO IT, BRING BACK CARLOS, CHEESEY BUT ENTERTAING AND WASTED AFTER 8, then again clearly audience building appears off the list of priorities by what we hear so far.
![]() ![]() It's the 'Kid's condescending tone in his delivery.his cold delivery that gets me every time. He does every link as if he's doing a voice over for a compilation album,It's completely the wrong tone to be doing radio.He is completely unrelatelable to the listener and has no idea how to execute the 'new brief' at Smooth. The sum of his content the other day was that he had 'introduced Andy Gibb on Top of the Pops ![]() Well.I hope Dick Stone spent a productive first day in charge and has spotted the dead wood a mile off.And now the travel. |
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#2635 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Home For The Bewildered
Posts: 86,520
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My top 3 songs are not on that list, ... so how am I to register my vote?
![]() Hardly an 'All Time' top 500 if the songs are to be chosen from a pre-determined list. I recall the Hall Of Fame on Capital years ago, and we could choose ANY three songs we wanted. |
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#2636 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Newport Pagnell
Posts: 21,350
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Quote:
Ah,glad I'm not the only one that heard it.
![]() ![]() It's the 'Kid's condescending tone in his delivery.his cold delivery that gets me every time. He does every link as if he's doing a voice over for a compilation album,It's completely the wrong tone to be doing radio. Well.I hope Dick Stone spent a productive first day in charge and has spotted the dead wood a mile off.And now the travel. Now the weather.....
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#2637 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Tied Up in Notts
Posts: 1,581
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The Blue Eyes point raised earlier is a very good one.
People (just humble listener types like me and not experts in 'radio station track scheduling demographics') want to hear more than just a handful of good songs by a major hit making artist. Not their whole back catalogue, but perhaps at least five to ten examples of their work, rather than just one, two or three played again and again. I think it is fair to say that an artist like Elton John can rustle up more likeable Smooth-type songs than just Candle in the Wind, I Guess That's Why They Call It the Blues, Don't Let the Sun Go Down on Me or Sad Songs (Say So Much). I think you could realistically find a choice from at least twenty (maybe more) of his hits over the last forty years or so to comfortably fit within Smooth's apparent remit. I don't expect to hear songs like Crazy Water, Breaking Hearts (Ain't What it Used to Be) or Skyline Pigeon played, as I accept the typical Smooth listener they seek may not either remember or feel comfortable with these, but the following ten songs of his would be a good fit in my view: Passengers Island Girl Song for Guy Rocket Man Goodbye Yellow Brick Road Blue Eyes Someone Saved My Life Tonight Part-Time Love Are You Ready for Love Crocodile Rock Perhaps some of the above have been played. It's just that whenever I do listen, I just hear the same few mentioned earlier. |
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#2638 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Newport Pagnell
Posts: 21,350
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Quote:
The Blue Eyes point raised earlier is a very good one.
People (just humble listener types like me and not experts in 'radio station track scheduling demographics') want to hear more than just a handful of good songs by a major hit making artist. Not their whole back catalogue, but perhaps at least five to ten examples of their work, rather than just one, two or three played again and again. I think it is fair to say that an artist like Elton John can rustle up more likeable Smooth-type songs than just Candle in the Wind, I Guess That's Why They Call It the Blues, Don't Let the Sun Go Down on Me or Sad Songs (Say So Much). I think you could realistically find a choice from at least twenty (maybe more) of his hits over the last forty years or so to comfortably fit within Smooth's apparent remit. I don't expect to hear songs like Crazy Water, Breaking Hearts (Ain't What it Used to Be) or Skyline Pigeon played, as I accept the typical Smooth listener they seek may not either remember or feel comfortable with these, but the following ten songs of his would be a good fit in my view: Passengers Island Girl Song for Guy Rocket Man Goodbye Yellow Brick Road Blue Eyes Someone Saved My Life Tonight Part-Time Love Are You Ready for Love Crocodile Rock Perhaps some of the above have been played. It's just that whenever I do listen, I just hear the same few mentioned earlier. Cold As Christmas. This is a wonderful and underplayed easy listening record by Elton John. |
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#2639 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 369
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Blimey! Poor Kid can't do right for doing wrong in some people's eyes (or is it ears?). So he crashed the vocal on a pre-record! Not the end of the world is it? I heard the above mentioned link and he'd actually started to talk before the Mitch Johnson voiceover which must've just caught him out. As if other jocks have never made this type of mistake. It's certainly not as greatvoice says... Quote:
Originally Posted by greatvoice
...Shocking, heard that too, really truly shocking... what can be described as nothing other than appalling attention to detail or just simply not caring ...
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#2640 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Northumberland
Posts: 1,099
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I heard this link this afternoon while I was stuck at traffic lights, it was his first link at 16:20, and noticed it crashed into the smooth voiceover.... so is he actually live/or pre-recorded, with him dropping the headlines at half past the hour, there is actually no content at all other than , that was, this is, travel next........
I know they want long music sweeps but even compared to Magic's more music, less talk, this smooth drive home is getting worse every week... |
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#2641 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Tied Up in Notts
Posts: 1,581
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The Smooth Drive Home (Alone) is what my wife has been calling it recently,
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#2642 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 1,405
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Quote:
I heard this link this afternoon while I was stuck at traffic lights, it was his first link at 16:20, and noticed it crashed into the smooth voiceover.... so is he actually live/or pre-recorded, with him dropping the headlines at half past the hour, there is actually no content at all other than , that was, this is, travel next........
I know they want long music sweeps but even compared to Magic's more music, less talk, this smooth drive home is getting worse every week... Anyone listening with sensible ears (quite apart from the music policy) can tell that the Snooz drive home is put together very badly and executed with no flair whatsoever by someone who always seems to seek the refuge of the next break so he can go and hide again.And next the travel. |
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#2643 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: May 2003
Location: wirral
Posts: 9,276
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Ah,glad I'm not the only one that heard it.
![]() ![]() It's the 'Kid's condescending tone in his delivery.his cold delivery that gets me every time. He does every link as if he's doing a voice over for a compilation album,It's completely the wrong tone to be doing radio.He is completely unrelatelable to the listener and has no idea how to execute the 'new brief' at Smooth. The sum of his content the other day was that he had 'introduced Andy Gibb on Top of the Pops ![]() Well.I hope Dick Stone spent a productive first day in charge and has spotted the dead wood a mile off.And now the travel. |
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#2644 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,438
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I think you've managed to identify the reason why it feels like I am listening to recorded radio links when I'm listening to live radio. Good analogy.
Now the weather..... ![]() |
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#2645 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Newport Pagnell
Posts: 21,350
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Glad you heard that too.It was diabolical was nt it,You would think that in the fifteen to twenty minutes the 'Kid' (I;m David Jensen) has between actual spoken links you would have thought he would have it worked out in his mind where he was going with the link,and actually thought it through,or indeed have listened to the voice over parts he was to play.No.I'm sorry.It all adds fuel to the fire of the possibility that the whole damn thing is recorded in ten minutes earlier in the day.
Anyone listening with sensible ears (quite apart from the music policy) can tell that the Snooz drive home is put together very badly and executed with no flair whatsoever by someone who always seems to seek the refuge of the next break so he can go and hide again.And next the travel. ![]() He is a consumate and seasoned professional. He has an engaging and warm radio personality. He is passionate about music I've no doubt. But this bloody radio station seems to have ripped the heart and soul out of the man from the evidence of what I hear on air. What a terrible shame and way to treat long time respected broadcasters/DJ's. I'm sorry but radio (even mainly music based) is not just about the music. Never has been, never will be, and isn't now. If that is all you want, then get your jukebox, find your iPod or grab your turntable or CD player. Speech counts! |
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#2646 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Inverness
Posts: 3,473
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My wife expressed similar views recently, and even asked why I was listening to such a dire station, then went on to describe it, as radio that should only be played in " Gods waiting room " ....think that says it all, oh, and before anyone asks, she is smack bang in the target demographic age range
!Global undoubtably know much more than I do about putting together a radio station (and making it profitable). But I feel there is a huge gap in the commercial sector for a easy listening and chat station (albeit with more music than BBC local radio). Given the demographic chat is an important component. |
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#2647 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 97
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Slightly off subject but i'm sure i read a while back that radio stations pay much less royalties for a track the more times they play it.This would account for the same tracks being played in rotation.
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#2648 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 1,113
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Same here. I put Smooth on in the office yesterday. One comment was similar to yours; the other was that it sounded like Radio 2 30 years ago. That wasn't meant in a positive way.
Global undoubtably know much more than I do about putting together a radio station (and making it profitable). But I feel there is a huge gap in the commercial sector for a easy listening and chat station (albeit with more music than BBC local radio). Given the demographic chat is an important component. |
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#2649 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 2,227
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I fear we will all have to wait until the Q4 RAJAR to see who is right. A failure to gain listeners then will maybe make Global think again.
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#2650 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jul 2000
Posts: 2,924
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Slightly off subject but i'm sure i read a while back that radio stations pay much less royalties for a track the more times they play it.This would account for the same tracks being played in rotation.
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