Since getting the HDR this week I haven't been able to get a decent SD picture via hdmi. Its pretty disappointing.

On all resolutions the PQ doesn't come close to the SCART output from my 9200T or SCART from the HDR itself. Its soft/blury and lacks detail.

I have seen similar reports when the Freesat recorder came out but was apparently fixed in a update??

Also there is no Original output option in the menu as stated in the manual.

anyone else getting the same or know of a fix? Should Humax be mad aware of this?

I think you'll find you're banging your head against a brick wall. I have a Humax Freesat HD non-PVR, and have exactly the same issue as you describe. And no, there has been no software upgrade to improve SD "softness" via HDMI. So looks like you'll just have to put up with it, or use SCART for SD material, as you have been doing. Sad, but true! It's a lovely piece of kit, which is let down in just this one area.

Chris.

Its quite an important area- which I would deem more so than iplayer or media streaming etc.

I hope not

Yes I've had the same experience with soft SD picture. However, cannot fault the box in any other area.

Hopefully the "Original" option will be added in a firmware upgrade as that could solve the problem.

Hi


The original option will be no better than switching to 576i or p now, just it will switch automatically.

What Humax need to check is that they are not double scaling through the two in line HDMI chips, and that scaling is being done by Broadcom chip and not the cheaper HDMI chip, with the cheaper HDMI chip only switching on it's de-interlacer to provide the 1080p that marketing dictates but isn't necessary to have.

Regards

Phil

Is it wise for people to let Humax know? Do you know how to get this info through to them so myself and others can report this?

I have a HUMAX HD Freesat box (not PVR) and when they added 'original' to that it was agreat improvement.

I just find it odd that they haven't learn't from this and are going around the same cycle with the Freeview HD recorder.

perhaps the same chips are used in scaling?

Its not getting any better thats for shure- just soft and mushy.

As a warning to 9200T / 9150 or 9300 owners - don't upgrade. I feel like I have gone backwards.

PIP and little things like the clock have gone too.

I'm afraid that the 9300 is the same via HDMI late8, I should know, I have owned one. Uses the exact same scaler in that, the Foxsat zapper and the Foxsat HDR. Have moaned and begged and posted umpteen times and given feedback since Humax first began to use HDMI connections, but to no avail, so I do wish you luck with getting anything changed in this area.

Of course, apparently the Digital Stream unit uses the same HDMI upscaler as well, and according to owners of that unit, it too suffers from the same thing, but the DS bods have tried to do something about it by issuing a software upgrade that allows you to adjust the contrast etc.

GG

Thanks for that Grannygrunt. I guess if its Hardware related not much can be done. Very frustrating.

I remember setting up a relatives 9300T and we decided to go to scart because they liked the picture more. Cant believe HUMAX haven't done anything about this.

I am is a muddle as to send the box back and wait for something else to come along or put up with a crap picture.

I'm reading this with interest, so to clarify high definition pictures via HDMI cable are great, but standard definition pictures via HDMI cable is not so great.

I found this: http://www.pocket-lint.com/review/49...-fox-t2-review and some people at the end of the review have stated the same soft not so sharp standard definition picture.

To be honest i was going to purchase one of these Humax HDR-T2 boxes but when you come across reviews like this it puts you off, especially when people like GrannyGrunt have highlighted the problem to the manufacturer.

late8. Humax might have listened not necessarily to me alone but also to all those other users complaining about the soft muggy picture via HDMI if it hadn't have been for other posters who insisted that there was nothing wrong with the HDMI upscaling and that it was

a) My/Our TV's settings that were at fault, we hadn't got it set up properly despite the fact that everything else we had connected to it was a wonderful sharp picture.

b) We were trolls who were only intent on criticising for criticising's sake

c) It was our eyesight.

d) That the initial broadcast was pants, despite the fact that other manufacturers units could display the same content at far better and sharper, clearer quality than the Humax.

So if you want to blame anyone on Humax's inability or reluctance to act since the Foxsat Zapper regarding the soft mushy picture quality via their HDMI connection, lay the blame fairly and squarely on those who rubbished that feedback as nonsense.

I would myself be using a Humax Freeview HD PVR right now if my cries for action regarding the poor HDMI upscaling had been acted upon, but let's face it, no matter how pretty the UI is made, no matter what frills and how stable a unit is, if the picture that you view day in and day out and have to record is pants. then you aren't going to be happy are you?
The biggest plus is the picture quality for viewing, all other 'bells and whistles' are really unimportant.

GG

I bought one for the World Cup and as others have said great picture in HD but poor in SD, the quality of the tv's (panasonic) tuner is so much better.
It is plugged out most of the time these days .

Hi


I have done various tests and can see absolutely no difference in HDMI output. Playing the same recorded Freeview SD footage from a Blu-ray player and from the Humax via HDMI is as good as identical. The Humax even plays DVD video content with absolutely no difference than my expensive Blu-ray player. You can not tell the difference, both look excellent.

Something else is happening, and no wonder Humax can't fix it as I expect all their resolution tests and their own eyes, like mine, can't see a difference.

At least it is stable and works flawlessly, and knows when the clocks change For us HDMI picture quality is as good as it gets for the over compressed rubbish that is Freeview SD, and HD looks absolutely stunning.

Regards

Phil

It's not mentioned in the latest version of the manual available online from Humax.

http://www.humaxdigital.com/uk/suppo...ter_manual.asp

Its odd how some see a difference and others don't. I just wonder if its image processing?

personally I turn all image processing off- it does more damage than its worth. The Humax SD picture does have less artefacts and blocks than my SCART picture but then again it has less finer detail.

Quality of the SCART cable makes a lot of difference too.

Just did a test I posted on AV Forums. On SCART i turned my TV's Digital Noise Reduction up to max and got a very similar picture to the Humax on HDMI.

I will be accused of bias but:

This weekend I changed TVs at home and I have to say the picture looks amazing, the clarity is fantastic in SD over HDMI. My partner even commented as such without prompting. I've never had an issue with any of the HD products other than the v.minor issue with the Foxsat when it was first launched (which was resolved and is a completely different design).

Bob

Sorry Bob, but that's baloney. My Panasonic TV is less than a year old and the SD picture quality through the HDR-FOX T2 is clearly much sharper via SCART than it is via HDMI. I'm bemused that Phil can't notice it, because it's quite clear to see when you do a comparison.

Hi


We have absolutely no complaints regarding picture quality, like I've said elsewhere the output is identical to my Blu-ray player. You can't see any difference in an A/B comparison.

I suspect for some their SCART inputs are being processed considerably by their TV and sharpened. HDMI being all digital should be more of a pure direct route with minimal messing about with so making a comparison between the two subjectively the SCART input might appear sharper, although this is an illusion of course and it contains no more real detail or picture resolution. Also if the Humax is outputting 1080i and so upscaling the already lacking in any detail Freeview SD source, then unless you have pixel-to-pixel mapping mode on the TV engaged, the picture will be scaled again, which will result in some loss of detail.

Freeview SD can never be described as sharp anyway, as it contains little real detail due to the severe compression.

There seem to be no complaints regarding Freeview HD, which is odd considering the software and hardware is the same.

Hopefully if Humax are listening they will supply some access to the picture settings so that if MPEG noise reduction is on for example, this can be turned off by those preferring the artefacts and least processed picture.

Regards

Phil

It would be interesting to know the models of the TVs ... and degree of modification from default settings on those TVs.

I'm on a 37" Panasonic plasma. all picture processing is off apart from image overscan (which is available option on Panasonics). Each input has its own calibrated picture settings applied.

I have found the colour on scart and 576i HDMI is stronger too?

Are you a or SD person...

That is your opinion and you have every right to it.

I'm a SD person.



I guess my TV (and a few others) have superior SD picture processing on SCART. (A comment made in reviews at the time) Its not over sharpened or noisy, just a good up scaled SD picture. SCART quality also has a role to play.
Interestingly SD up scaled stuff on ITV HD looks closer to my old 9200T SCART detail wise than the SD stuff from the HDR. (apart from compression noise)

There is a loss of detail- and you can tell by things like hair and skin pores. On the HDR SD This is lacking and looks fuzzy / washed away.On BBC1's Commonwealth Games for example the presenters in the studio look particularly soft.

Have seen a couple of reviews and comments elsewhere now mention this so its obviously something the Huamx does with its SD processing. Personally I think the HDR is applying too much DNR to the SD image during the upscale process. I guess this is the nature of the box. The Foxsat, Fox-T2, 9300t all seem to have the same issue with SD up-scale.

Humax got back to an email I sent and recommended using 576i on the vformat options for SD and cycle through this.
Which begs the question - Why not have the HDR do this automatically in the first place.?

Your comments regarding the picture quality sound very much like issues caused by two lots of scaling, which is why upscaling HDMI SD DVD players for example are just a big waste of money, they rate along side £50 HDMI cables, a con. Have you tried any other Freeview SD HDMI sources with you kit, if so, how did they fair when upscaling?

Having the resolution switch automatically isn't pretty either, I know, I've seen it in action on the Philips PVR. For example, do you switch back up to HD when dropping into the menus, if so this can be annoying if you quickly want to check something, if not, you have rough fonts and graphics somethings, other times it looks great, all depending on if you are watching HD or SD before you go into the menus. Likewise if you are flicking between an HD and SD channel, you've got to wait for the picture to sync up.

Probably better to just make the switch toggle between two preset resolutions and you just switch yourself as required.

Regards

Phil