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  • Strictly Come Dancing
Craig Revel Horwood -are you fed up of his acid tongue?!
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sofakat
20-10-2010
Craig is fantastic, funny and honest.

I like the fact that he knows more about dance than the average 'ballroom' person, because ballroom - the be frank - is a little bit tunnel-visioned, whereas a true dancer has some knowledge of ballet (the basis of all dance), stage and jazz.

Poor old Len falls flat on his face all the time because he is so out of touch with the times, and so limited in his knowledge of anything other than the 1950s ballroom era.

At least Craig has classical knowledge and knows what salsa and Argentine tango are really about.

Bruno is now a parody of himself and I think he's an irritating little twerp

Alesha was a great dancer, but she's not really a great judge. I've never really heard her say anything useful to anyone.
Ignazio
20-10-2010
Craig is much less acid this series than previous years - and his criticism is constructive.

Bruno is manic - unfortunately the good advice he gives is often lost in the manic delivery.

This year I've heard very little from Len that can be taken away and worked on.

I've said enough about Alesha - no need to repeat it here.
ruby-tuesday
20-10-2010
Originally Posted by Tiger Rose:
“Craig is the fairest and most consistent scorer. And I like the way that he always finishes off his comments with something positive. Also if Craig does praise you then you know you have done well.”

yes, I agree with this, I like Craig and I'm sure that, after the show, he's very friendly towards all the celebrities

Originally Posted by RubyT:
“So the consensus here is that the poll is probably right.

Also thought it was pretty interesting that Alesha and Arlene are so closely matched. People are obviously still fairly divided on that”

hi Ruby .... like your forum name btw

I think the poll is right, I know I'd rather listen to Craig's comments than any of the other judges
Camis
20-10-2010
I like Craig as a judge - he gives balanced criticism as well as praise. I think he is the one that the contestents most look to for marks - an 8 from Craig is worth more than a 9 from some of the judges!
Eugenie
20-10-2010
Originally Posted by Ballroom-B.:
“I don't like Craig as a judge. He does talk a lot of nonsense sometimes. It is pointless spouting all these ballet terms because I cannot think of ever hearing the steps called that in ballroom and latin classes (ronde being the exception). He'd do better to learn the correct ballroom and latin terminology. I also think he has a tendency to undermark. His comments are not always constructive and can be quite cutting.

Despite what people think Craig isn't qualified in ballroom and latin and the panel in its current format is hugely unbalanced away from ballroom and latin experts. Given the form of dancing in this competition is ballroom and latin for the most part, it would make sense to have a panel with more judges expert in that field.

Yes have one or two performance judges on the panel (so I'm not necessarily saying get rid of Craig) but have them stick to judging what they know which is performance of dance as a whole. Craig sometimes strays into the technicalities of ballroom and latin, says something nonsensical and then Len looks at him in despair.

Len is the only judge qualified to judge ballroom and latin competitions professionally and he does know what he is talking about. Sometimes routines on Strictly bear little relation to the dance they are supposed to be so no wonder he gets frustrated. The dances are supposed to be ballroom and latin. If the routines start to incorporate other dance styles, props and gimmicks into them, what is the point of it still being called that dance? The programme may as well be celebrity SYTYCD.”

Craig is my favourite and I can’t imagine the show without him.

However, sometimes he does get into the detail a bit – but it’s not a huge issue for me.

I really am not keen on Len – I find him inconsistent and he can be truly nasty when he wants despite the “nice guy” image. Love Bruno and don’t mind Alesha, apart from her voice and terrible grammar.

Even though I am not keen on Len, the show still needs him. I think the mix is good although was better with Arlene.
letsdance
20-10-2010
Love him. He's my favourite judge. Especially in the last two seasons, he's started giving both constructive criticism and praise to each dancer, and that's very professional. He's often the only voice of reason in the judges' panel... I like his sense of humour too.
Evilredzebra
20-10-2010
I think Craig has been a lot less scathing this year. Looking at the 4 judges, I listen to Len for the technical feedback, Alesha for appalling grammar, Bruno increasingly for sexual innuendo and Craig for an overall look at the performance.

I would take a criticism from Craig a lot more seriously than a "you was great babe" from Alesha. The fact that he words his critique in a way to make the audience laugh or gasp is inevitable on what is basically a TV talent show. He still makes valid points.

Reading some of Paul's comments, he reminds me more of last year's Craig - the deluded Mr Kelly. Seems to me that the poison dwarf doth protest too much and it isn't Craig who is old and bitter!
molo flapian
20-10-2010
I like Craig - but hate the mandatory booing.
He isn't Captain Hook, Bruce. tsk.

One thing - usually I agree with his marks, but last week Ann & Anton a 3, Gavin & Katya also a 3.
Shows he is tighter than a ducks bottom sometimes
shoesgirl
20-10-2010
Originally Posted by Evilredzebra:
“ Looking at the 4 judges, I listen to Len for the technical feedback, Alesha for appalling grammar, Bruno increasingly for sexual innuendo and Craig for an overall look at the performance. ”

Alesha for appalling grammar,
Yep - I think that just about hits the nail on the head

When she danced with Matthew I often wondered if he corrected her grammar, either out loud or secretly in his head. He was always so well spoken it wouldn't surprise me

To add my two pennorth's worth to the discussion though, I agree with the majority. I love Craig, he may have an acid tongue at times but he almost always finds something to praise too. He is the most balanced judge on the panel.
Dorabella14
20-10-2010
Originally Posted by RubyT:
“So according to reports in the papers this week, Paul Daniels said that the public are bored by Craig and his put-downs of the celebrities on Strictly.

I've been running a poll on Twitter about who people's favourite Strictly Judge is (past or present) and Craig is well in the lead with 45% of the vote!

What do you think? Love him or loathe him!

Oh, and have your say in the poll! http://twtpoll.com/e7f2q2”

Am never fed up with (not of) Craig's acid remarks.

Besides, if you left the acetic acid (vinegar) out of salad dressing, how could you eat a bland salad?
Veri
20-10-2010
Craig is my favourite judge, but ...

He often makes a big deal out of something minor, such as what the celeb did with their fingers, when there are far more significant aspects that could stand improvement. I wonder sometimes whether that's because he lacks the knowledge needed to comment usefully on things that aren't such minor details. Still, he also gives his overall opinion of the dance, and he often makes useful and interesting comments there.

Re marking, I think his marks are the most realistic, and he gives himself room at the top for exceptionally good dances and for improvement over the course of the series. The other judges can 'paint themselves into a corner' at the top and end up giving out 10s for dances that contain obvious flaws (which annoys many viewers).

However, so long as a judge doesn't run out of room, it doesn't actually matter whether their marks are high or low, so far as the leader board is concerned. All that matters for that is the differences between that judge's marks. (As a simple example, giving all but one of the couples 3, and one couple 4, has the same effect on the leader board as giving all but one of them 7, and that other one 8.)

There is a theory that Craig uses a wider range of makes and therefore (the "therefore" is still part of the theory) has a greater effect on the leader board placings. Some even went as far as to claim Craig decided the leader board.

To test that theory, I looked at the marks from weeks 3 through 10 last year in the "Individual Judges Scores Thread", for example here.

There is something to the theory, but it doesn't work as well as people thought. For example, in week 6 (the post linked above), Craig used the widest range of marks, but he was not the "deciding" judge in any case. Len used the narrowest range of marks but decided 4 cases. (Alesha decided 2.)

Which is the opposite of what the theory predicted.

By "deciding", I mean: suppose couple A finished above couple B in the leader board. Was there any one judge who made the difference? It can be tricky to work it out in some cases, but week 6 was relatively straightforward. For example, the marks for Natalie and Vincent vs Chris and Ola:

Chris and Ola: 7 7 7 7 = 28
Natalie and Vincent: 7 8 7 7 = 29

where the scores go with judges from left to right.

Len was sitting next to Craig that year, and as you can see, he was the only judge who gave N&V a different mark than C&O. It was therefore his marks that meant N&V finished higher than C&O.

In short, if Craig uses his wider range of marks only to separate couples who were going to be separated anyway by the marks of the other judges, then the wider range makes no difference to the leader board. Len used his vote differentials much more effectively that week, despite his narrower range of marks.

Perhaps Len is a craftier marker than we thought!
Balthus
20-10-2010
Craig is my favourite judge too. Though brutally honest, he's usually funny with it -- a bit like a pantomime villain. One thing I have noticed this year is how he always ends his critique on a positive note, which is good for the morale of the contestants.

His marking is usually spot on too. The only time I was disappointed in him was for all those 10s that he uncharacteristically dished out to Lisa Snowden.
Abbasolutely 40
20-10-2010
Originally Posted by shoesgirl:
“[b]When she danced with Matthew I often wondered if he corrected her grammar, either out loud or secretly in his head. He was always so well spoken it wouldn't surprise me
.”

I doubt very much if Mathew would be that rude .I think he is a gentleman who would see that everyone differs and we all have accents and our own ways .
crazybabe
20-10-2010
Craig is the best judge and has a wonderful way with words. Humorous clever and says what needs to be said.

I love him.

Bruno is entertaining and makes me laugh.

Len is out of date and whether he is making out he is grumpy or not, I dont really care.

Aleysha - well all I can say is "you was a waste of space"
SheShe
20-10-2010
Love Craig - best judge on there. Uses his whole range of marks and is witty and observant. What's the point in having the lower numbers if they're never used? Craig gives praise where it's due and is very constructive.
HeidiB
20-10-2010
I have always loved Craig. He tells it as it is. He will mark down his favourites - as did Arlene- and is extremely fair. I wish they were all like him.
Tall Paul
20-10-2010
Originally Posted by HeidiB:
“I have always loved Craig. He tells it as it is. He will mark down his favourites - as did Arlene- and is extremely fair. I wish they were all like him.”

I agree.
elven62
20-10-2010
Love Craig! He's the best judge in my opinion. Witty and knowledgeable. Clearly has huge sense of fun..

I could live without Bruno to be honest - getting a bit fed up of him - and Alesha (enough said).

My dream panel would be Craig, Len and Karen Hardy. Those 3 judges would work just fine and I think the professionals would respect everything they said .
CaroUK
20-10-2010
Originally Posted by HeidiB:
“I have always loved Craig. He tells it as it is. He will mark down his favourites - as did Arlene- and is extremely fair. I wish they were all like him.”

Except for Emma Bunton and Lisa Snowdon!!!!!
Stockingfiller
21-10-2010
Craig ? Can't stand him. I can understand why he's there though ie to thrill viewers via the humiliating put - downs of celebs and professional dancers. I'm surprised he doesn't just use the raised or lowered thumb sign used by Roman emperors. He's not got ballroom or Latin experience, either. A case of the emperor's new clothes.
Tall Paul
21-10-2010
Originally Posted by Stockingfiller:
“Craig ? Can't stand him. I can understand why he's there though ie to thrill viewers via the humiliating put - downs of celebs and professional dancers. I'm surprised he doesn't just use the raised or lowered thumb sign used by Roman emperors. He's not got ballroom or Latin experience, either. A case of the emperor's new clothes.”

Your opinion lol.
Stockingfiller
21-10-2010
He'll be on as Caligula, next week.
Kat1966
22-10-2010
I like Craig as well, but I also like Len. Craig usually finishes with a positive comment to contestants and I like Len's understanding of the dances, Alesha I loved as a competitor, my favourite after Ramps, but as a judge she is not very good at all, but I have to say that the judge who consistently gets on my nerves in the same way that Arlene did is Bruno. I mute the sound when he is speaking, especially in the last 2 series.

Craig is fab~u~los Daaarrrrrrling!!!!
SugarNSpice
22-10-2010
Strictly would be boooring without CRH!
alisonrose3764
22-10-2010
You have to love The Craig, The Revel and The Horwood - by far the best judge - the only one that makes any notes for as start
Always fair I think and tries to improve their performance!
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