Personally, I'd go for the Desire.

Whilst it's already been said, I agree that the Symbian^3 OS isn't as good as Android. I've seen reviews, hands-on videos and whilst it's an improvement over the software found on the N97 and XpressMusic 5800, it still has a dated look and feel to it. Also, the Android Marketplace is bigger and better than the Ovi Store, which has a poor UI and very few decent apps.

I have an N97 Mini (running the previous Symbian iteration, S60) and from experience applications designed for Nokia devices are really quite bad (although this could change in the future, but seeing as Nokia are yet to 'take off' in the smartphone market, it's unlikely). AccuWeather (which came with the phone, and I've since updated) never works, saying there's no network connection despite being connected to a WiFi network AND having full 3G signal. And whilst I don't know if it's of great importance to you, from my own experiences, Facebook for Nokia is terrible (slow, very limited) compared to the highly functional Facebook for Android. Like I said, I have an N97 Mini, and am basing my opinions regarding Andoird on my brother's HTC Wildfire.

On the plus side, the N8 camera specs are amazing, and Ovi Maps is a brilliant free Sat Nav, better than any other in my opinion.

But the Desire has 5 star reviews from a lot of places and is supposedly a really great phone.


Aww, c'mon, you don't need all of those! I'll take the normal Desire off your hands

Which seems fair enough, but the point still stands. This latest handset from Nokia, their current flagship model with all the media advertising backing it and the hype built up etc. is running an OS which Nokia themselves intend to use for the low end and budget handsets. That's hardly something you want to hear when you've just signed up for a 18-24 month contract that your top of the range handset is running the OS that's been relegated to the bargain basement.


You need to tell Nokia that then. They've already started marketing it very heavily with TV campaigns and other promos. The kind of investment they do for top end, flagship models. You also better tell the world's media too because many of them are referring to the N8 as a flagship model.

I suggest you are wrong here and that the N8 is considered one of Nokia's current top handsets, a flagship model if you will.


Which will be great, but I'd hope that Meego gets a better looking front end and isn't held back by trying to please the Symbian compatibility.


Because it's all about 'now' not 'then'. Symbian currently holds the market share of smartphone operating systems, however the important thing to realise is that the Android operating system is currently outselling it at a fast pace. So developers are looking to what's popular now and what's quickly catching up on older systems that are already out there. There's no point in developing for an ageing OS that can't hold it's own compared to modern OSs with decent UIs. If you want to make the money you need to be looking at iOS or Android because they are rapidly getting the largest audience for your products. In short, Symbian's had it's day, as recognised by many an analyst.

I believe they said they wouldn't be using it on N Series handsets .... doesn;t necessarily mean low end and budget though. Afteralll there is still E series (E7 has already been launched) and C series (C7 has been launched too) ... neither of which is low end or budget.

How does Andriod manage it then when people buy a £99 phone on android, and they also see a £400 Desire HD .... are they different, or is it just Symbian that has this problem.

How does that work? Surely if Android is outselling Symbian that it will have the biggest market share?

Sorry, I don't agree. It's a high end Nokia model with a lot of advertising behind it, as you'll see on TV and other media.


Regardless the N8 is still being pushed as a top model and having a lot of marketing time and money put in to it.

I believe the idea is to remove it from their flagship and top end handset area to the lower models with lower performance and lower price tags. This would see their top end handsets being brought in with another OS which would not be Symbian. With this in mind and with the fact that other manufacturers recently dropped the OS I think I'd be wary of entering in to a 2 year contract on a handset running such an OS. In terms of development and features Symbian will be taking a back burner compared to the next OS, so a flagship / top model will drop very quickly in priority for Nokia.


You've missed a large point here. Symbian is being removed from Nokia's top of the range handsets and pushed down to the lower end, handsets running Android run it at the top and bottom of the range, it's not being relegated to the lower range handsets it's still at the top as well as catering for those at the bottom. Quite a different situation.


A tad naive here on your part. The market share held by Symbian is from handsets already sold. Android is now outselling Symbian, so just using random figures here to help you understand let's say that Symbian in the past sold 1 million handsets but this year are only managing 10,000 handset while Android is selling 50,000 handsets. That wouldn't give Android the largest market share automatically because Android would have to catch up with handsets already sold. This is the difference, it's what's being sold NOW compared to what was sold in the past. Android is currently outselling Symbian and Symbian is currently seeing a drop in sales. Given time Symbian will loose it's largest market share and move down the ranks...

your obviously have a very good knowledge of what resources nokia/symbian are using for there models.


I wasn;t taking about past sales simply the ones released recently for 3rd quarter (unless you have a better indicator I would have thought that was most accurate data that would be currently available). Much easier to prove the point with actual data rather than trying to belittle me. I've never heard anyone ever talk market share in the terms you mentioned.

http://www.canalys.com/pr/2010/r2010111.html

Then you were off the mark it seems. The 'market share' is built up of sales past and present. This is what I was talking about and what you replied to. To now dismiss the past sales would dismiss a large chunk of users.


I have no interest in belittling you, I was just very surprised that you failed to grasp the basic concept of user numbers building up an overall market image.


That's fair enough. I am surprised at this, but each to their own...

I fully understand that but any analysts that quote market share are talking about the current sales of phone, over whatever quarter/year of sales (As shown by the link I provided.) not the installed user base (which for symbian would be huge).

Can you provide a link that shows that andriod is outselling symbian?

I'm very interested to see your reasoning for saying that symbian is dropping sales too, as Nokia certainly said recently that they had just sold more than previous quarters and previous years

http://www.allaboutsymbian.com/news/...s-beats_ex.php


Please provide the numbers/links that have these details as I've not seen anyone displaying them

There are no features missing from Symbian - if you can point out a specific feature thats missing, then please go ahead.


You must write for Gizmodo in your spare time, as thats not what Nokia have stated. Symbian is intended for low-mid range devices, with Meego taking the higher end (and tablets?).

What is there - on the OS - to differentiate something bargain basement like the ZTE Blade from the SE kit costing twice the price, or HTC kit costing four times as much? Its the same OS, and its only the screen and camera that are missing on the blade. And paying four times as much for a device with a camera thats still not even slightly cutting edge is a pretty depressing thought.


No it isn't, you really couldn't be more wrong. The figures quoted are per quarter. At which point Symbian is still outselling iOS and Android combined - we're talking worldwide here, not stateside figures.

If you include legacy handsets still out there, Symbian has a gigantic advantage in volumes.

You've also missed the one interesting element with Symbian and Meego - both are using the same development environment (QT), and apps will run on both (and are apparently very easy to develop?).

Just to update everyone. I decided to get the N8, I've been using symbian for while on the 5800, and then I used the HTC hero for a while android. I personally like both the operating systems equally - I find once you get used to symbian it's fine. And, the camera is what closed the deal for me. Anyways the upgrade is now final and the N8 will be here tomorrow.

And maybe now folks we can stop the Nokia OS vs Android OS battle that's been hijacking this thread! :sleep:

you wont be disappointed. it's great. and if you are familiar with symbian you wont need to bleat on about it not being intuitive. it's kinda like the 5800, but on crack.

I'll give a couple of caveats.

1. Don't install Opera Mobile - it always used to freeze my 5230, same issue on the N8. Rebooting is easy enough though .... Opera Mini may be okay, I'll have to try that.

2. HyperX (samsung i8910 modder) has a couple of updates for the camera, giving either 97% or 100% settings for the stills camera. Both of them caused my N8 to crash out ......

Stick to kosher apps though, and its absolutely fine. I still can't get over how damn good the camera can be.

If a great camera is what you're looking for and you're used to Symbian, I think you've made a good choice. Good luck, enjoy your new phone!

I was in the o2 shop this afternoon and had my first play with the Nokia N8. To be honest, I'm rather disappointed.

What's all this about a solid feel I've heard about? The N8 felt like plastic to me. It didn't creek or wobble, but it wasn't amazingly solid either. The amoled, capacitive screen was as you would expect. OS-wise, it didn't feel all that different from a Samsung Tocco Lite. You get the basics and that's that - it's a phone. It froze once in-between menu transitions, whi

The HTC Desire is very iPhone-like, so I would choose that one.

Felt like plastic? Honestly? Its good quality cold metal, and it feels solid, sturdy, etc. Everyone I've let play with mine has commented on the build and the response of the menus - and thats even from iPhone/Android owners.

As for "you get the basics", you get way more than the basics, you get a spec sheet thats longer than darned near any other phone on the market.

The phone wars is getting likle the 8bit computer wars in the 80s lol.

So tempted to get the n8 but may wait to see what the c7 i think it is early next year before i decide.

Same. a fantastic phone.

I've been thinking exactly the same The BBC/Spectrum/Amstrad (and Apple, but not so much in the uk), and then a bit later on the 16/32 bit "wars" between the Amiga, ST and to some extent the Acorn Archimedes.

Reckon that Acorn won that last one in one way - the processor technology they designed for the Archimedes has been the runaway success in the CPU arena in mobile devices.

Just to update everyone I'm getting the N8, should be coming on Saturday. I tried them out again in store and the camera on the N8 clinches the deal for me.

I had an st but always wanted an amiga lol and yeah the acorn machine was very powerful but never took off for gaming,

never thought on until now and yeah the arm cpu

I think the question should really be Nokia N8 vs HTC Desire HD to be honest.

Aye, that little team of geeks from Acorn changed the world in ways they probably never quite expected.

I had some good games on the Archimedes; the definitive version of Elite, Zarch, Conqueror .... but very little else really. Was good to get experience of ARM coding at the outset.