Just updated my B&O Beovision 7 to work with HDMI.
It works fine with Apple TV Gen 2 Via DVI - analog sound with HDMI and HDCP.

Humax box does NOT work! All I get is white noise onto screen for HD channels.
I have tried various plugging and unplugging sequences as well as different video resolutions.

Has anyone had any success with a B&O TV and Humax HDRFox T2?

Joe

What software version is installed on the Humax? There is an OTA update available today - do an automatic search to upgrade to 1.01.09.

- Simon.

Thanks - I have already loaded the 1.01.09 update foam the beta site via USB. Same problem!

Is this OTA update different from the beta site version?
I tried the auto update as well but nothing new so far.

Joe

yeah its the same update.

Have you tried a factory reset on the Humax? - Its best to check the HDMI output is setup correctly too and this reset might just do that.

Factory reset done. Tried other HDMI connectors as well.
Same problem black screen - with audio - snow on some resolutions, others black screen!

The DVI input to the TV works because I am getting perfect HD audio an video - which is HDCP - from the Apple TV2.

Any more help welcome.

Joe

The new firmware - updated via OTA - does NOT fix the problem.
Strangely the previous .05 release gives a purple picture with horizontal streaks! Definitely looks like a Humax to B&O handshaking problem ..... Humax ..

Any help welcome.

Joe

Do you have a AV receiver that accepts HDMI? Could try that. I had handshake issues on my AV reciever but not TV, but the update fixed that. Could be the other way around with you.

Sorry no AV receiver - only the TV.
Running out of options to try. A pity since I like the Humax box ... but whats the point of an HD box that does not output HD!

Has anybody managed to get the HDR FOX T2 working via DVI?

Joe

How old is your TV? is its firmware up to date? It might not be able to handle the Humax .. do you have any other HDMI devices connected or is this the first?

Seems to be some sort of copy protection going on within handshaking. Old TV's have HDMI problems due to new standards worked out for copy protection etc. DVI was the format to go at the time.

Have you tried a different HDMI cable- could be damaged??
Try a different HDMI input on your TV too.

Also go through the resolutions. The HDMI default is 1080p and your TV might not accept this.
Press and cycle through the vformat button and go to 720p or 1080i

On factory reset- did you have HDMI plugged in and tuned to the input?

If you are still getting this issue even on the new software your TV might not accept the Humax or any other hd product like a bluray.

Noticed this Techradar review of 5 years ago about connection via DVI,and that there may be problems with Sky's upcoming HD channels-
http://www.techradar.com/reviews/aud...-105984/review

Hi

Someone has the exact same issue on a Philips TV via DVI.

Undoubtedly it is due to encryption not working between the Humax and the B&O TV, could be something to do with the keys not matching up, it might never work over DVI even if the TV supports HDCP over it.

Unfortunately in attempt to stop piracy (which it doesn't as a trip to my local market confirms) we have all these complications!

I'd suggest posting a message on the Humax Facebook account of the same problem to raise it with Humax.

http://www.facebook.com/topic.php?ui...32&topic=14658

Regards

Phil

Interesting - is it Philips that supply some of B&O's parts- I'm shure I have heard of this before on the web- LCD screens or something.

I would suggest contacting B&O, they have liased with us in the past on other issues where they have needed to understand compatibility issues. We won't have the TV model to test with so there is little Humax can do about the problem.

The HDR-Fox T2 was recently tested against a compendium of TV models to help us study compatibility issues and the handshaking is now about as good as it gets as far as we can tell. I wouldn't suggest that AppleTV is a reference for good HDMI+HDCP.

It is not just me that is having this problem with HDMI DVI inputs. I am sure you have seen the thread on:

http://www.facebook.com/topic.php?ui...32&topic=14658

There are two guys there with the same issue.

As far as I can see I have a TV which receives HDMI via the DVI from at least two other sources that I have tested it with.
The Humax box is supposed to work with a DVI input and it clearly does not in this and the cases referred to in the link above.
I don't think it should be the customers problem to get this fixed!
That said I have asked B&O if they have seen any issues with the HDR FOXT2.

I have also posted my issues to the Humax Facebook thread above

Joe

Hi


To be fair to Humax or any other manufacturer, DVI is not the same thing as HDMI. HDMI happens to use the same protocal as DVI for the video part so you can cross connect, and then B&O have tagged on HDCP over DVI, but it isn't an HDMI compatible TV, for that it needs an HDMI socket.

If it was an HDMI socket, the TV would be required to be tested for compatibility, I doubt this is the case with using a DVI socket.

I assume it is an older TV hence it doesn't have HDMI proper, so it will not support all the nuances of HDMI, more information about the differences, and some information about HDCP over HDMI is here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HDMI#Co...ility_with_DVI

Either way your TV doesn't have HDMI so difficult to blame Humax in this case, they've had HDMI issues that is true and have worked to fix those, but supporting older equipment with just DVI isn't practical and may not even be possible with the newer versions of the HDMI specification they are using. It's not a positive answer, just the facts.

I think your only options are a new TV with a true HDMI interface, or try a different PVR, perhaps the Philips HDT8520 as this uses a different chipset, although it isn't great in some other respects. Remember if you buy online you have 7 working days in which you can return stuff for any reason you like, so if doesn't work you are not stuck with it. The DigitalStream internally is the same chip and design as the Humax, so I would suspect it has the same issues.

Regards

Phil

Hi

Looking at the response to Facebook posts about this issue just thought you might find this information useful in getting something done.

The chip that is responsible for sending HDMI out of the Humax is the TDA9984A (a Philips part), this supports outputting RGB or YCbCr.

I suspect it got fixed at YCbCr (if this is what has happened causing issues with DVI) when Humax were trying to resolve various HDMI issues.

There is no reason why Humax couldn't support a user selectable setting to change between the colour spaces, getting them to do this however is a different matter, unfortunately Humax aren't DigitalStream and don't respond that quickly with bug fixes let alone adding new functionality requested by a handful of users.

If they are listening, then the easiest thing to check if this is the problem would surely be to build a quick test firmware with RGB enabled for those affected to try, then if that resolves the issue they just need to add an option in the menu to make this switchable.

Regards

Phil

Rubbish. Don't go blaming the problem on DVI vs HDMI incompatibility. The problem is down to device/device compatibility and that applies equally to HDMI to HDMI devices and repeaters and switches.

HDMI is a basically superset of DVI-D, in the same way that HDMI 1.3 is a superset of HDMI 1.1 etc etc etc. Would you expect an HDMI 1.1 TV not to work with an HDMI 1.3 source? Apart from not getting the extra features of 1.3, you would expect it to work. The significant part is that HDCP was a mandatory part of the HDMI specification, with DVI it was an option. HDMI carries audio, DVI does not. Talking about B&O bolting on HDCP on to DVI makes it sound like a kludge, it is not; it is a perfectly legitimate and common protocol used on many video devices, even manufactured today.

If a DVI device supports HDCP and the standard video resolution and colour space (rather than just PC resoutions and colour space), then there is no reason not to expect a DVI-D display device to be fully compatible with the video side of an HDMI source. Humax say as much in their quick start guide.


Nothing there about the HDR-FoxT2 being incompatible with DVI.

Also, from HDMI themselves...


So a TV supporting standard video resolutions and supporting HDCP should be fully compatible with the video side of HDMI in the same way that an HDMI 1.0 device should support HDMI 1.3 or 1.4. You may not get all the features, but an HDMI source should detect what is available on the sink (display) and a adjust its feature set accordingly.

The reason why I am here...my Loewe Xelos SL DVI equipped TV is having exactly the same issues. Its known good with other HDMI/HDCP reliant sources from Meridian (DVD), Panasonic (DVD) and the Freeview HD trial box (Freeview HD) from about five years back.

I did have HDCP handshaking issues at the start when using the Meridian DVD player, but Meridian updated their firmware and LinnSight updated their firmware after collaboration between us all. The Panasonic DVD and Freeview HD trial box worked right from the start, as expected. Also, my initial cable was found to have an intermittent mechanical issue at the DVI end causing non optimal connection resulting in intermittent HDCP handshaking. This was resolved by using a cable with a Molex DVI connector. The cable in use is the replacement cable, although it has not been in use for a while so may have developed a fault. But it does work with the Panasonic DVD player; the Meridian DVD and Freeview HD trial box having long been disposed of.

The bit about YCbCr vs RGB is interesting. Im not sure if it is my problem as watching the TV via SCART when the HDMI/DVI cable is inserted results in a message flickering on the screen too fast to wholely read but basically says that the TV does not support HDCP, and I know 100% that it does. In addition, the HDR should use the information in the EDID to recognise that the source does not support YCbCr (which I know from Meridian DVD troubleshooting that my TV does not) and revert to RGB.

It would be highly disappointing (ie the otherwise excellent HDR will be returned) if Humax did enforce YCbCr on a sink. I believe that this would actually be against the HDMI specification (which a source is expected to support the lowest feature subset of the display/sink) which would technically make the HDR-FoxT2 not HDMI compliant.

Having only purchased the HDR on Saturday, I missed the download and I have yet to manually update to latest firmware, but from previous posts, I have little hope that this will resolve the issue. So for the time being, we can add the Loewe Xelos SL to the list of devices incompatible with the Humax HDR-FoxT2.

Interestingly the Humax Foxsat-HD satellite STB does have a switch on the back for YPbPr or RGB. I would of assumed that the later produced HD boxes for both Sat & Terrestrial in not having this, must have the option now controlled by the software. I wonder if Bob_Cat could comment?

Just to add to this...

Again from HDMI Org FAQ.

The latest HDR software release resolves a number of HDMI handshaking issues so it is certainly worth a try.

http://beta.humaxonline.co.uk/freeview-hd-t2

- Simon.

Thanks Simon

I have now found a compatible USB stick and successfully installed 1.01.09 (from 1.00.04) and HDCP seems to be more stable, possibly even issue resolved - I no longer see the "Your TV is not HDCP enabled" type message when watching ITV 1 HD via SCART - although this is not conclusive as the message implies that it is program/content specific and whilst I witnessed it on ITV 1 HD, I did not on BBC 1 HD. However, what makes me think that the HDCP issue is gone is that, whilst I get not valid picture, just random lines and pixels, this image is now stable, I get resolution/timing information as I scroll through the video formats and occasionally some resemblance of an image in a thin strip down the screen which would imply that if the signal was HDCP encrypted, is is being encrypted albeit being incorrectly received/decoded/displayed. The TV displaying resolution and timing which changes with video format would imply that the frame size and rate is also now being correctly recognised, which again is progress in the right direction solely down to the firmware change.

Also, with the thin strip of the image, it would appear that colours are not right. I do not believe that my TV supports YUV and I believe that the colour shift that I am seeing is a result of incorrect colour space, ie displaying YUV in RGB colour space. For instance, if I bring up the TV guide, which would be a grey (?) overlay, it displays as purple overlay and the humax logo on startup is a white HUMAX on purple.

I'm going to try the HDR on a more modern Panasonic HDMI TV and see if I get a proper image then. This will rule out a hardware fault with the HDR.

Actually. I spoke too soon about the upgrade. Having returned it from being connected to a different HDMI TV which works as expected, the HDR is back to its tricks. Yes it is more stable and I can interrogate received resolutions/timings, but the HDCP issues are still there. Although as a plus, hopefully the EPG find lockup bug has gone with the new firmware update so progress is still being made.

Having power cycled the TV, it would be more likely that this is hot plug related. Power cycling the TV seems to clears the problem message, although I don't think it did anything different prior to doing the update, not that I spent too much time trying to debug the problem. If it is a hot plug issue, then whilst the issue is not fixed, it will merely be an inconvenience that I can live with.

The pixelated black display is not, and will, much as I like the improvements over my 9200T, unfortunately result in the HDR being returned as the only reason to upgrade was to get and record the new HD channels. Which will save on me having to get an optical to coax digital converter which (the coax digital out) humax unfortunately omitted from the design (and my TV manufacturer unfortunately appear to have omitted the ability to assign one of its analogue audio inputs to the component or DVI inputs), my only other criticism from this otherwise excellent product.

As HDCP handshaking is more stable, I can now read the erroneous HDCP message via SCART connection. It reads...


This is no longer repeatedly flashing on and off alsothough is briefly displayed when changing channel.

As mentioned earlier, I can confirm that TV is HDCP compliant. As well as being confirmed with the manufacturer, this has been used with other HDMI/HDCP devices, including DVD (upscaling to 576p/720p/1080i and another fixed at 576i) and official iCann Freeview HD trial box (at 576i/576p/720p/1080i), although there is the possibility that the latter source did not force HDCP as it was a 'prototype' device.

I may see if I can borrow from someone an Humax HD Satellite STB and see if the more mature sat box fairs any better.

I see the 1.02.07 release notes mentions "HDMI > DVI improvements"

Anyone have any experience with this?

I returned my unit as it didn't work with my TV, unlike my other HDMI devices, but would be interested in re-purchasing especially as it now looks like its interactive features are operating.

Not the same thing, the switch on the Foxsat-Hd changes the output from digital HDMI to analogue component from the three RCA phono sockets. A short time after it was released Freesat switched off HD component analogue so it's largely useless for HD use.

The thread refers to the two colour spaces that can be used on a hdmi/dvi digital interconnect component/RGB.

I stumbled across this forum thread whilst searching for information on this very same problem. My Hyundia HD ready TV with DVI connection would not display a picture from the Humax HDR Fox T2, but was fine when using a PS3 via the DVI. After reading ianh64's post, I downloaded the software update from Humax this afternoon and problem now resolved. Would recommend anyone else having similar HDMI- DVI problems to install the software update.