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Official Formula 1 Thread (Part 6)
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crake
10-04-2011
I'm very surprised Alonso has been penalised. That was a racing incident.
Syqo
10-04-2011
Originally Posted by ICEband:
“That's an odd decision. Hamilton didn't seem to move twice IMO, but if he had, wouldn't he have been the one causing an "avoidable accident", not Alonso?”

Exactly, and we saw it replayed many times yet I didn't see Hamilton move more than once.
Blemished
10-04-2011
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L61_AevsjMs

That is apparantly why Hamilton has been penalised. He does weave slightly, but I've seen much worse before. All I can think is that it's because he was warned about the same last year? Still undeserved IMO, along with Alonso's.
Zeeth
10-04-2011
Yep the Hamilton penalty is for a double move into turn one, not during the actual collision.
Si_Crewe
10-04-2011
Originally Posted by Zeeth:
“Yep the Hamilton penalty is for a double move into turn one, not during the actual collision.”

I can't really see that myself.

Funny, given the amount of tyre debris on the track, I can see the "one move" rule causing some controversy this year.
Surely it's only a matter of time before a driver accused of infringing the "one move" rule is going to claim that they were simply dodging bits of debris on the track?
Syqo
10-04-2011
Originally Posted by Blemished:
“http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L61_AevsjMs

That is apparantly why Hamilton has been penalised. He does weave slightly, but I've seen much worse before. All I can think is that it's because he was warned about the same last year? Still undeserved IMO, along with Alonso's.”

Ah right, thanks for posting the link. Still seems very unfair to give Lewis a 'drive-through' for that, if they're going to be that strict then we're going to have a lot of penalties this year. Not sure if it's because of what happened with Petrov last year but warnings shouldn't be carried forward from previous years. I don't think Alonso should have been 'penalised' either. The FIA almost ruined 2008 with their stupid penalties, if they're going to penalise drivers over every incident then they'll kill racing and inhibit overtaking/defending.
HungerCult
10-04-2011
Having just watched the youtube clip, Hamilton did not move twice, totally undeserved. So too was Alonso's penalty, it was a racing incident on tyres that were losing front grip.
Zeeth
10-04-2011
Originally Posted by Blemished:
“http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L61_AevsjMs

That is apparantly why Hamilton has been penalised. He does weave slightly, but I've seen much worse before. All I can think is that it's because he was warned about the same last year? Still undeserved IMO, along with Alonso's.”

Yep -

"On lap 45, with 11 remaining, Alonso challenged Hamilton on the long straight to Turn One. While defending, Hamilton made more than the permitted one change of direction, resulting in his penalty."

If you watch the clip its a very slow weave down the start finish straight. - very harsh.
dsweetenham
10-04-2011
Originally Posted by Zeeth:
“Yep the Hamilton penalty is for a double move into turn one, not during the actual collision.”

Yeah probably the right decision by the letter of the law but it's an extremely inconsistent one. Lewis himself avoided a penalty for weaving all over the place last year but got one today for a far less clear cut one?!

If Alonso had got past Lewis cleanly would the stewards have bothered to investigate the second move? There are so many incidents that could be determined to be second moves that go unpunished.

You can bet your life the radio link to Charlie from the McLaren pitwall will be red hot at the merest hint of a second move by anyone next week!
El Guapo
10-04-2011
We just need to get rid of this DRS crap! What a load of rubbish. Bernie needs to go as he has lost the plot and ruined the sport.
Si_Crewe
10-04-2011
Gotta say, I'm not a fan of Alonso by any stretch of the imagination but even I wouldn't have awarded him a penalty either.
Surely being forced to pit for a now nosecone is sufficient "punishment" for what was, simply, a clumsy manoevre?

Now, if Alonso had managed to slice Hamilton's tyre open and take the place without sustaining damage himself I'd probably not be too happy but, as it was, I don't think any further action was warranted.

Course, given that Alonso's "penalty" didn't actually make any difference, I suppose further discussion of it is somewhat academic.

I wonder if the stewards figured all this out by themselves or if Ferrari complained about lewis' driving?
Syqo
10-04-2011
Originally Posted by Si_Crewe:
“I wonder if the stewards figured all this out by themselves or if Ferrari complained about lewis' driving?”

Usually the stewards investigate an incident when Charlie Whiting instructs them to do so. It's interesting that both Buemi and Alonso's incidents have the text below in the FIA document yet this text isn't in Hamilton's document. To me, that suggests that Charlie didn't ask them to investigate Hamilton but the fact that they did suggests that somebody (Ferrari) made a complaint.

Quote:
“The Stewards, having received a report from the Race Director, have considered the following matter,
determine a breach of the regulations has been commited by the competitor named below and impose
the penalty referred to.”

http://www.fia.com/en-GB/mediacentre.../on_event.aspx
Phased050
10-04-2011
I wish they would just stop interfering with the race results.

Neither driver deserved a punishment here, this is meant to be racing.
guypd
10-04-2011
Wow, Vettel won. Never saw that coming.

If this season is going to be a Vettel procession, and it almost certainly is, it's going to turn people off F1.

Will Vettel NOT win any race?
Stunty
10-04-2011
Watching the winning ceremony, it looked like they were all happy and friendly up there. So different to when the likes of Hamilton and Alonso appear on the podium, it seems as though they are strained and congratulating their opponents through gritted teeth.


Jenson is so animated, chatty and friendy, the other drivers all seem to like him too.


As for Hamilton and his post race interview with the BBC, he was so miserable and quite offish and said he had 'nothing to say'. I notice his father was there for the race, I take it that Nicole was absent then!
Si_Crewe
10-04-2011
Originally Posted by Stunty:
“Jenson is so animated, chatty and friendy, the other drivers all seem to like him too.


As for Hamilton and his post race interview with the BBC, he was so miserable and quite offish and said he had 'nothing to say'. I notice his father was there for the race, I take it that Nicole was absent then! ”

TBH, I think Button is a bit of a smiling assasin.

I recall how full of laughter he was after the race, last year, when both him and Hamilton had been told to hold station in order to save fuel (after Vettel and Webber crashed into each other) but Button had taken it upon himself to try and overtake Lewis.

I bet if Lewis had done that to him, he'd have had a face like a smacked arse but after trying, and failing, to put one over on Lewis it was all "just a bit of friendly sparing" etc.

Don't really like people who act like that as a rule.

Hamilton's dad still attends races because he's managing Adrian Sutil, IIRC.
Barbella
10-04-2011
Originally Posted by Si_Crewe:
“TBH, I think Button is a bit of a smiling assasin.

I recall how full of laughter he was after the race, last year, when both him and Hamilton had been told to hold station in order to save fuel (after Vettel and Webber crashed into each other) but Button had taken it upon himself to try and overtake Lewis.

I bet if Lewis had done that to him, he'd have had a face like a smacked arse but after trying, and failing, to put one over on Lewis it was all "just a bit of friendly sparing" etc.

Don't really like people who act like that as a rule.

Hamilton's dad still attends races because he's managing Adrian Sutil, IIRC.”

He manages Paul Di Resta
Si_Crewe
10-04-2011
Originally Posted by Barbella:
“He manages Paul Di Resta”

Fair do's.
I knew he was managing one of the drivers but I wasn't sure which one.
Cheapthrills
10-04-2011
Originally Posted by Si_Crewe:
“TBH, I think Button is a bit of a smiling assasin.

I recall how full of laughter he was after the race, last year, when both him and Hamilton had been told to hold station in order to save fuel (after Vettel and Webber crashed into each other) but Button had taken it upon himself to try and overtake Lewis.

I bet if Lewis had done that to him, he'd have had a face like a smacked arse but after trying, and failing, to put one over on Lewis it was all "just a bit of friendly sparing" etc.

Don't really like people who act like that as a rule.

Hamilton's dad still attends races because he's managing Adrian Sutil, IIRC.”

Yeah Jenson is ever effusing when things are good, biut becomes whiny when things don't go his way.

Was devastated for Lewis towards the end of this race, the penalties are just as plastic as the little bag of tricks Bernie has added in DRS and KERS. I'd really like to see another route of development for engines and also think multiple tyre manufacturers.
soulboy77
10-04-2011
Originally Posted by Zeeth:
“Yep -

"On lap 45, with 11 remaining, Alonso challenged Hamilton on the long straight to Turn One. While defending, Hamilton made more than the permitted one change of direction, resulting in his penalty."

If you watch the clip its a very slow weave down the start finish straight. - very harsh.”

Yes, I can't understand what the offence really was on the part of Hamilton. If Alonso was actually attempting to overtake and Lewis moved one way then the other in quick succession to block then fair do's but Alonso was just following him as he moved from one side of the track to the other.

I do hope McLaren appeals this as Alonso's 20 seconds penalty makes f'ck all difference but Lewis looses a place.
North Downs
10-04-2011
Let's hope it's not going to be a Vettel led procession all season.
Had enough Schumacher processions for best part of ten years. :yawn:

And another thing, it's a recipe for disaster, the combination of petulant Alonso and
"one rule for us, another for everyone else" Ferrari.
CakeLover
10-04-2011
Originally Posted by Si_Crewe:
“TBH, I think Button is a bit of a smiling assasin.

I recall how full of laughter he was after the race, last year, when both him and Hamilton had been told to hold station in order to save fuel (after Vettel and Webber crashed into each other) but Button had taken it upon himself to try and overtake Lewis.

I bet if Lewis had done that to him, he'd have had a face like a smacked arse but after trying, and failing, to put one over on Lewis it was all "just a bit of friendly sparing" etc.

Don't really like people who act like that as a rule.

Hamilton's dad still attends races because he's managing Adrian Sutil, IIRC.”

No it was Lewis who had the face like a smacked arse.
Stunty
10-04-2011
Originally Posted by Si_Crewe:
“TBH, I think Button is a bit of a smiling assasin.

I recall how full of laughter he was after the race, last year, when both him and Hamilton had been told to hold station in order to save fuel (after Vettel and Webber crashed into each other) but Button had taken it upon himself to try and overtake Lewis.

I bet if Lewis had done that to him, he'd have had a face like a smacked arse but after trying, and failing, to put one over on Lewis it was all "just a bit of friendly sparing" etc.

Don't really like people who act like that as a rule.

Hamilton's dad still attends races because he's managing Adrian Sutil, IIRC.”


Hamilton is the one to have those when things aren't going his way ....... a bit like today. Thought his interview was dreadful, anybody would think that his dad had taken away his favourite toy.

We have to agree to disagree on the two drivers personalities, but I know which one seems more fun to be around and the friendlier. Jenson is the driver's driver, Lewis is completely out for himself. Would love to know what the other drivers really think of these two, but to me it is quite obvious.
Stunty
10-04-2011
Originally Posted by Barbella:
“He manages Paul Di Resta”

Does he indeed.

I bet he is thrilled that his old Dad is around on the circuit full time again!!

I have my own theory on the goings on in the Hamilton family, would love to know the truth sometime.
Barbella
10-04-2011
Originally Posted by Stunty:
“Does he indeed.

I bet he is thrilled that his old Dad is around on the circuit full time again!!

I have my own theory on the goings on in the Hamilton family, would love to know the truth sometime. ”

Well, Di Resta came up through karting the same time as Hamilton ( although Di Resta moved into different categories because he was very tall as a teenager).

I would imagine Di Resta knows where the skeletons are buried ( or vice versa)
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