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Boxing
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Nova21
11-04-2016
Originally Posted by Keyser_Soze1:
“But when they were fighting they were said to be bums, as were the heavyweights before them, and back before them to the brutal days of Tom Cribb and beyond

Every single era of heavyweight boxing is seen as the worst ever at the time.

I remember articles bemoaning how utterly crap the division was with Lewis, Bowe, Tyson Holyfield and Ruddock in the top ten.

And I have seen writers stating how fighters like Ali, Frazier and Foreman would not have cut it 'in the good old days'.

More than any sport nostalgia plays a big part in boxing.

Just my opinion of course.”

From reading and occasionally contributing to this thread I have to admit that your knowledge of boxing is more broad than mine, but I remember Razor ruddock for example being rated very highly before he fought Lewis. His only defetat being against Tyson I think. And surely you can't say the likes of foreman and Frazier weren't highly rated at the time.
Trevor Berbick, before Tyson destroyed him, was also a level above anyone currently righting.
I agree inI terms of Lewis, he didn't really get the plaudits he deserved until late in his career, but there is a huge death of heavyweights compared to previous eras I feel.
Keyser_Soze1
11-04-2016
Originally Posted by Nova21:
“From reading and occasionally contributing to this thread I have to admit that your knowledge of boxing is more broad than mine, but I remember Razor ruddock for example being rated very highly before he fought Lewis. His only defetat being against Tyson I think. And surely you can't say the likes of foreman and Frazier weren't highly rated at the time.
Trevor Berbick, before Tyson destroyed him, was also a level above anyone currently righting.
I agree inI terms of Lewis, he didn't really get the plaudits he deserved until late in his career, but there is a huge death of heavyweights compared to previous eras I feel.”

I am mainly talking about the US boxing press (the British writers tended to be more even handed).

The 'old guard' types of the time in the 70's who looked nostalgically back to the days of Tunney and Dempsey and thought that Smokin' Joe and Big George would be destroyed by those two cruiserweights.

And in the days of Dempsey the old guard of that time would be waxing lyrical about John. L. Sullivan.

Even today you see some people on forums making a case for Marciano competing with Lennox and the other modern super-heavyweights which does not bear examination in my opinion.

For the record Razor was a bloody good heavyweight who gave Tyson two cracking fights.
misawa97
12-04-2016
The worst thing I find about HW boxing is when I see fighters coming into the ring out of shape and with a gut. That to me is simply not acceptable and makes the division look a laughing stock.

Finding big athletes who want to box isn't easy when big athletes can earn a fortune playing NFL, NBA and not have to get punched in the face to do so.
Nova21
12-04-2016
I think it's the big guys who aren't good enough to make it in the nba or nfl who will then become heavyweight boxers
batdude_uk1
12-04-2016
You have MMA taking fighters away from boxing as well now, so the pool available to select from is getting smaller and smaller, as there are move options and avenues open to a young person looking to get into fighting sports.
Matt35
13-04-2016
Why is briggs wanting to fight haye? I don't think briggs is playing with a full deck to be honest going around shouting let's go champ or is it chump im not sure. This is a no win situation for haye because if wins its expected and if he loses his career is done.
TheSloth
13-04-2016
Boxing, Schmoxing. Fed up of over-hyped mediocre boxers being talked up by the promoters and media in an attempt to maximise revenue.

Multiple belts watering down the quality further until all you're left with is the odd decent fighter avoiding risky fights and then finally agreeing to actually test themselves when the want is so high that the purse is obscene - lose and they usually retire rich. It's the logical path from a financial point of view but it's killing the sport at a pro level once fans begin to see through the hype and circus acts. Farces like the fight just gone will erode the sport's credibility further.

For folk like me who lived through the massive fights of the 70s and 80s, it's laughable to watch. Younger fans probably don't know any better or are flocking to the new breed of combat sports.

I wonder where we'll be in 10 years?
tinman
13-04-2016
Originally Posted by TheSloth:
“Boxing, Schmoxing. Fed up of over-hyped mediocre boxers being talked up by the promoters and media in an attempt to maximise revenue.

Multiple belts watering down the quality further until all you're left with is the odd decent fighter avoiding risky fights and then finally agreeing to actually test themselves when the want is so high that the purse is obscene - lose and they usually retire rich. It's the logical path from a financial point of view but it's killing the sport at a pro level once fans begin to see through the hype and circus acts. Farces like the fight just gone will erode the sport's credibility further.

For folk like me who lived through the massive fights of the 70s and 80s, it's laughable to watch. Younger fans probably don't know any better or are flocking to the new breed of combat sports.

I wonder where we'll be in 10 years?”

Best keep off this thread then
robborocks
13-04-2016
Originally Posted by tinman:
“Best keep off this thread then”

I think opinions for and against boxing should be welcome on here, that wasn't even a massively negative post either, pointing out some valid facts such as the multiple belts watering down the quality of fights on offer, which I agree with.
TheSloth
13-04-2016
Originally Posted by robborocks:
“I think opinions for and against boxing should be welcome on here, that wasn't even a massively negative post either, pointing out some valid facts such as the multiple belts watering down the quality of fights on offer, which I agree with.”

Thanks - I'm not anti-boxing, I'm just massively disillusioned with a sport I used to really enjoy watching. Getting defensive and refusing to admit the sport has got issues is myopic. Left as it is, pro boxing will only go one way sadly.
hunter23
13-04-2016
Originally Posted by Matt35:
“Why is briggs wanting to fight haye? I don't think briggs is playing with a full deck to be honest going around shouting let's go champ or is it chump im not sure. This is a no win situation for haye because if wins its expected and if he loses his career is done.”

i don't think it'll be a contest tbh but briggs will get some people interested in it because he's acting a fool. so haye will get an easy pay day and he'll more than likely knock him out before 4 rounds. easy money for both
Syntax Error
13-04-2016
Originally Posted by Matt35:
“Why is briggs wanting to fight haye? I don't think briggs is playing with a full deck to be honest going around shouting let's go champ or is it chump im not sure. This is a no win situation for haye because if wins its expected and if he loses his career is done.”

Briggs is employed by Haye to give David some relevance whilst he fills up the O2 every few months knocking over Daffodils.
mcg3
13-04-2016
Originally Posted by Syntax Error:
“Briggs is employed by Haye to give David some relevance whilst he fills up the O2 every few months knocking over Daffodils.”

Totally agree with you.

The whole thing looked stage managed to try and drum up interest in a farce of a fight.

I really don't know what Haye is playing at these days.
nainz
13-04-2016
Originally Posted by Matt35:
“Why is briggs wanting to fight haye? I don't think briggs is playing with a full deck to be honest going around shouting let's go champ or is it chump im not sure. This is a no win situation for haye because if wins its expected and if he loses his career is done.”

Briggs is just trying to talk himself into a payday, he tried it with Klitschko but failed, now he's trying it with Haye. Which is funny as hell, because Haye wasn't above some self promotion to get the fight with Klitschko himself and now he's having to put up with some of the same tactics and you can see he hates it.

If they both come through their May fights then their clash will be hyped into a decent payday, the build up alone will be worth it.


Originally Posted by TheSloth:
“I wonder where we'll be in 10 years?”

Let's be honest, 10 years ago, people were saying exactly the same thing when UFC turned up on the scene, since then we've had Mayweather and Pacquiao doing mega PPV buys, British boxing with Hatton doing gang busters and it's buiggest gate receipts, 12 current British title holders and a slew of others in the past. Tons of new stars for every style and weight, from GGG and Kovalev to Chocalito and Ward.

Boxing is doing fine and will continue to be so for many years to come, despite it many self inflicted wounds.
Aftershow
14-04-2016
Originally Posted by Matt35:
“Why is briggs wanting to fight haye? I don't think briggs is playing with a full deck to be honest going around shouting let's go champ or is it chump im not sure. This is a no win situation for haye because if wins its expected and if he loses his career is done.”

Money. The same, and only, reason that Haye is fighting anyone now.
misawa97
14-04-2016
Originally Posted by Aftershow:
“Money. The same, and only, reason that Haye is fighting anyone now.”

He also doesn't have the backing from a network or promoter who can afford to pay for better opponents.
Keyser_Soze1
14-04-2016
Originally Posted by Nova21:
“I think it's the big guys who aren't good enough to make it in the nba or nfl who will then become heavyweight boxers”

You may have a point but I think that this excuse only started cropping up when the Americans lost their monopoly on the heavyweight title and boxing in general.

How long have the NBA and NFL been going?

Until very recently the press over there was incredibly jingoistic and would make any excuse as to why they no longer had the heavyweight champ - just look at the contemptuous treatment Lennox got in the beginning.
Nova21
14-04-2016
Originally Posted by Keyser_Soze1:
“You may have a point but I think that this excuse only started cropping up when the Americans lost their monopoly on the heavyweight title and boxing in general.

How long have the NBA and NFL been going?

Until very recently the press over there was incredibly jingoistic and would make any excuse as to why they no longer had the heavyweight champ - just look at the contemptuous treatment Lennox got in the beginning.”

The glamour and money in the NFL especially has hugely increased in the last twenty years or so as the glamour in heavyweight boxing at least has fallen. I think this has helped push more young athletes to NFL or nba as their first port of call, rather than sticking it out in the boxing gym through their teen years..

But as you say, there will always be excuses sought for such a decline.
Keyser_Soze1
14-04-2016
Originally Posted by Nova21:
“The glamour and money in the NFL especially has hugely increased in the last twenty years or so as the glamour in heavyweight boxing at least has fallen. I think this has helped push more young athletes to NFL or nba as their first port of call, rather than sticking it out in the boxing gym through their teen years..

But as you say, there will always be excuses sought for such a decline.”

That is interesting, I did not know that.

But I do think the Americans tend to make more excuses for their fighters than they do for boxers from other nations - it is quite an insular country (in general).
Tip top 2
15-04-2016
Congratulations to Anthony Joshua. I predicted a probable loss, although to be fair Charles Martin just didn't turn up on the night. I still think that Joshua has a lot to learn though, and a world class opponent who is actually up for it will turn his legs to jelly when he connects. Joshua has a lot to learn.

Khan has a puncher's chance against Alvarez, although I just can't take the man seriously. He was knocked out cold at light welter and welter, and now wants to prove himself at middle weight?! His ego is too big for his brain.

Britain is dominating the heavyweight division! That is a first. We had Lennox Lewis and Bruno briefly, but with Fury holding most belts, Joshua as IBF champ and Haye still around, this must be the best era of British heavyweight boxing ever. Respect.
kobashi100
15-04-2016
Originally Posted by Tip top 2:
“Congratulations to Anthony Joshua. I predicted a probable loss, although to be fair Charles Martin just didn't turn up on the night. I still think that Joshua has a lot to learn though, and a world class opponent who is actually up for it will turn his legs to jelly when he connects. Joshua has a lot to learn.

Khan has a puncher's chance against Alvarez, although I just can't take the man seriously. He was knocked out cold at light welter and welter, and now wants to prove himself at middle weight?! His ego is too big for his brain. ”

has khan got a punchers chance?

when did he last stop anyone? His only chance is staying away from canelo and winning rounds with hit and move tactics.

i cant see him keeping canelo away for 12 rounds though. once canelo walks him down its all over.
crofter
16-04-2016
Originally Posted by hunter23:
“i don't think it'll be a contest tbh but briggs will get some people interested in it because he's acting a fool. so haye will get an easy pay day and he'll more than likely knock him out before 4 rounds. easy money for both”

Sadly acting a fool 24/7 doesn't normally get you anywhere in life. Haye should be making up for lost time as he probably has another 3 or 4 fights in him.

If he is serious about getting back to the top - this fight shouldn't be anywhere near his radar. If he wants to knock over bums then I don't really see the point of his comeback, other than adding a couple of hundred thousand to his bank balance.
dazc
16-04-2016
just watched the boxing on sky great night apart from some shocking judges scores how did one give warrinton by 13 they are a jock oh good luck to smith tonight
Syntax Error
17-04-2016
Originally Posted by Tip top 2:
“Congratulations to Anthony Joshua. I predicted a probable loss, although to be fair Charles Martin just didn't turn up on the night. I still think that Joshua has a lot to learn though, and a world class opponent who is actually up for it will turn his legs to jelly when he connects. Joshua has a lot to learn.

Khan has a puncher's chance against Alvarez, although I just can't take the man seriously. He was knocked out cold at light welter and welter, and now wants to prove himself at middle weight?! His ego is too big for his brain.

Britain is dominating the heavyweight division! That is a first. We had Lennox Lewis and Bruno briefly, but with Fury holding most belts, Joshua as IBF champ and Haye still around, this must be the best era of British heavyweight boxing ever. Respect.”

Charles Martin hasn't turned up on any night.

He's a poor fighter who should never have been anywhere near a HW 'Championship' fight, even a bogus one like this for a spurious title stripped away from the real & linear champion.

Look at his highlights reel on YouFace to see what I'm talking about!!
Syntax Error
17-04-2016
Originally Posted by crofter:
“Sadly acting a fool 24/7 doesn't normally get you anywhere in life. Haye should be making up for lost time as he probably has another 3 or 4 fights in him.

If he is serious about getting back to the top - this fight shouldn't be anywhere near his radar. If he wants to knock over bums then I don't really see the point of his comeback, other than adding a couple of hundred thousand to his bank balance.”

Spot on.

He's making a mockery out of his career & if he fights Briggs after knocking over this latest daffodil, all bets will be off as far as I'm concerned.
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