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Matt & Aliona undermarked again
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Tangerine_82
14-11-2010
Originally Posted by alimyler:
“Sorry but this is grossly unfair to Matt and rather insulting to Matt fans. I don't find him hot and cute but I and the judges believe he is a good dancer. If your opinion is different then fair enough but don't undermine the ability of others to judge for themselves. I find it very patronising of others to say that just because my opinion is not the same as theirs I am somewhat deluded in my judgement.”

I didn't say you were deluded, I'm speaking from my experience off the forum, in real life where everyone in my office who supports him says they love him because he's hot, my mother loves him because he's cute and impish she says etc. I didn't mean to imply that you're deluded but I can't help it if it's my opinion. No offence meant.
Mistress
14-11-2010
He's my favourite contestant but I don't find him attractive. Not my type.
j4Rose
14-11-2010
Originally Posted by alimyler:
“You must have been watching a different Matt to me, and indeed the judges and Karen Hardy as all have praised his dancing ability. Your view of Matt seems a little harsh in my opinion.”

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. I think Matt is good, but not great. He is often quite awkward when he dances and he has yet to wow me. Kara is much better technically and her performance level is also very good. Scott has a certain charisma when he dances, which Matt hasn't shown yet. Maybe Matt will change my mind over the coming weeks.
rita1
14-11-2010
Originally Posted by Tangerine_82:
“I think if there's someone to blame for the entertainment taking the front seat, it's the public. Last year on this forum I remember being shot down a million times by Cola fans saying that I was wrong to think Ricky or Ali should win because this show is about entertainment more than dancing, hence Chris should win. Well that was the message the public gave the producers when they voted for Chris to win and now we're all paying for it. I would be interested to see how many Cola fans are now annoyed by dancing taking a backseat this year and entertainment being pushed as the purpose of the show.

I do think there's a bit of a conspiracy theory about Matt though. He just hasn't found his dance yet, that's why he's not getting great scores. But he's not being pushed off because that rumba did not deserve 9s, he was way overscored. He's being helped by the judges because they see potential in him, not hindered.”

I don't think what's happening is anything to do with last year's result. It's not the first time this has happened after all (Darren Gough?)I think it's probably all down to the new producer who has decided to turn the show into Dancing with the Stars. The judges seem to have completely given up and no longer know what they are doing. Only Craig is attempting to keep it honest - and surprisingly Alesha to some extent. Len has lost the plot completely imo, and Bruno never had it in the first place.
Tall Paul
14-11-2010
Originally Posted by j4Rose:
“It was a decent attempt by a male celeb, but it was not a good attempt overall. Why should male celebs be given a 9 for a mediocre dance when female celebs are not given the same advantage? Very unfair. Pamela's Rumba was MUCH better than Matt's - both technically and in terms of emotion and performance, yet they received the same score.”

He needs to sort his hands out big time for better marks. Btw j4Rose I sent you a pm last night of which is unread.
j4Rose
14-11-2010
Originally Posted by Tall Paul:
“He needs to sort his hands out big time for better marks. Btw j4Rose I sent you a pm last night of which is unread.”

Hi there. I thought I sent you a reply?
Tall Paul
14-11-2010
Originally Posted by j4Rose:
“Hi there. I thought I sent you a reply?”

Oh I've just read it and accept your apology.
BruciesToupe
14-11-2010
I really love Matt, I think he's incredibly natural at dancing, but just seems to go under the radar for some unknown reason. He also seems to have unfortunate dances the weeks Scott really shines. His first dance was amazing but since then he really has just dropped some what into the background.

I hope he gets to shine again soon, I suspect he could be really really good.
j4Rose
14-11-2010
Originally Posted by Tall Paul:
“Oh I've just read it and accept your apology.”

Good
teeswolf
14-11-2010
Originally Posted by BruciesToupe:
“I really love Matt, I think he's incredibly natural at dancing, but just seems to go under the radar for some unknown reason. He also seems to have unfortunate dances the weeks Scott really shines. His first dance was amazing but since then he really has just dropped some what into the background.

I hope he gets to shine again soon, I suspect he could be really really good.”

He will be, and while I would much prefer him to leave it for the finals, I think Blackpool will be when he amazes us all
Mystical123
14-11-2010
Originally Posted by Tangerine_82:
“Last year on this forum I remember being shot down a million times by Cola fans saying that I was wrong to think Ricky or Ali should win because this show is about entertainment more than dancing, hence Chris should win. Well that was the message the public gave the producers when they voted for Chris to win and now we're all paying for it. I would be interested to see how many Cola fans are now annoyed by dancing taking a backseat this year and entertainment being pushed as the purpose of the show.”

Well at least Chris could dance, the 'entertainment' this year can;t, but that's a whole other story. I do take offence at the inference that because I was a Cola fan I didn't care about the dancing, which is untrue. I care about the dancing AND the entertainment, for me they're not mutually exclusive, and Chris was certainly no novelty act. He may not have been technically perfect, but he still danced and a lot of the time danced well and with more heartfelt performance than the technically better dancers, in my opinion.


Originally Posted by Tangerine_82:
“He's got the teenage girl, housewife and middle England vote because people find him hot and cute”

I fit into none of those categories, and i don't think Matt is hot at all, yet I vote for them every week....
trevvytrev21
14-11-2010
Originally Posted by Strange_Famous:
“well, some purists might be worried about what shape his hands are

But the vast majority of people its just a case of whether the dance makes them get lost in the music or not

I dont necessarily think it was 40/40 intrinsically, I just think it was the best dance tonight.

Kara and Scott both are doing well, but imo Matt is more musical, and Aliona is a better pro, than the other couples.”

I'm not a purist, but his hands are a distraction. He does have lovely, well-placed arms, though.

I think your judgement may be a tad clouded, regarding it being the best dance of the night. Scott's had great energy and was a simple, well-danced routine. Kara's was a difficult, technical routine performed well. I support Kara and Artem, but readily admit Scott and Natalie were as good as them (if not, better).

Matt's Rumba was lacking in passion, lacking in story and overall hard to engage with. Usually, I like his routines.

Aliona is a GODDESS but her choreography is her weak point. Natalie is the best pro choreographer, IMO.
Tangerine_82
14-11-2010
Originally Posted by Mystical123:
“Well at least Chris could dance, the 'entertainment' this year can;t, but that's a whole other story. I do take offence at the inference that because I was a Cola fan I didn't care about the dancing, which is untrue. I care about the dancing AND the entertainment, for me they're not mutually exclusive, and Chris was certainly no novelty act. He may not have been technically perfect, but he still danced and a lot of the time danced well and with more heartfelt performance than the technically better dancers, in my opinion.”

All I'm saying is that I was constantly told last year that entertainment was more important than the dancing and it was normally people who wanted Chris to win that said it. Yes he danced but not well, I'm sorry but that's the way I see it. He was probably the 5th or 6th best in his year and he won it based on entertainment alone in my view and now that the entertainment this year isn't as popular, all of a sudden people are coming out with all the stuff I said last year and I just wondered how many of those people were Cola fans

Also, my post at the top of the page explains why I said that a lot of Matt fans seem to like him because he's hot. It's my experience in real life that tells me that. I'm not trying to imply that all Matt fans think that, how can I? I don't know them all. All I can base it on is my personal experience. I'm sorry if you feel offended but I don't think I should have to defend my opinion any more than you should have to defend your's.
trevvytrev21
14-11-2010
I was a Cola fan last year. Chris could actually dance to a good standard (Foxtrot and Charleston in particular) and his partnership with Ola was vote-worthy.

Ann is the "entertainment" this year, but it's more her being shoe-horned in as a joke contestant. Nothing like Cola, at all. Ricky was the best dancer last year but his grating personality put people off.

For me it's about 70% dancing ability, 30% personality.
Tangerine_82
14-11-2010
Originally Posted by trevvytrev21:
“I was a Cola fan last year. Chris could actually dance to a good standard (Foxtrot and Charleston in particular) and his partnership with Ola was vote-worthy.

Ann is the "entertainment" this year, but it's more her being shoe-horned in as a joke contestant. Nothing like Cola, at all. Ricky was the best dancer last year but he's grating personality put people off.

For me it's about 70% dancing ability, 30% personality.”

I agree that Chris was nowhere near as bad as Ann, nowhere near it, but for me he wasn't ever above competent - he's this year's Patsy for me - and that's why it annoyed me that he won. But we are just going over old ground and there's no point to it really, so if I've offended any Cola fans I apologise
trevvytrev21
14-11-2010
Originally Posted by Tangerine_82:
“I agree that Chris was nowhere near as bad as Ann, nowhere near it, but for me he wasn't ever above competent - he's this year's Patsy for me - and that's why it annoyed me that he won. But we are just going over old ground and there's no point to it really, so if I've offended any Cola fans I apologise ”

Personally, I'm not offended at all and I hope my post didn't make you think I was!

I was just as annoyed when Tom beat Rachel.
Tangerine_82
14-11-2010
Originally Posted by trevvytrev21:
“Personally, I'm not offended at all and I hope my post didn't make you think I was!

I was just as annoyed when Tom beat Rachel.”

Not at all hon Just covering my bases in case I do offend inadvertently someone lol.

I wasn't too bothered about Tom/Lisa/Rachel. To be honest, if any of them had won I'd have been okay with it. I thought Tom was a natural, Lisa had a great journey and Rachel was technically good, so it really was a lucky draw for me.
JVS
14-11-2010
Originally Posted by trevvytrev21:
“
For me it's about 70% dancing ability, 30% personality.”

I don't think it is that high for most voters, after all most of them couldn't tell a rumba from a samba.

For the general public it is; who would you fancy most, who's got the nicest personality or who would you prefer to go down the pub with. When it comes to dance, a gimmick or a spectacular lift counts for more than correct footwork.

And I love the comments on the first page of this thread by posters who think they are dance experts.
marinamau
14-11-2010
Thing is that for all the talk about Matt's gymnastic background helping him move, it seems that it is not helping with his hands.
I prefer aliona as a dancer (more compact) and her personality but Natalie does better choreographies and chooses better music.
tangos_with_tim
14-11-2010
Originally Posted by JVS:
“I don't think it is that high for most voters, after all most of them couldn't tell a rumba from a samba.

For the general public it is; who would you fancy most, who's got the nicest personality or who would you prefer to go down the pub with. When it comes to dance, a gimmick or a spectacular lift counts for more than correct footwork.

And I love the comments on the first page of this thread by posters who think they are dance experts.”


I quite enjoyed reading page 1, it read like a reasoned debate on technique to me.

I can't see anyone putting themselves up as a 'dance expert' either, however you want to define that. Even if you have never danced yourself, if you've watched Strictly enough to bother post on here, you're bound to have picked up tips on how the dances are meant to look etc.

Personally, I have been learning ballroom and latin for over 4 years and have followed Strictly for longer. I wouldn't count myself as an expert, it's not like I teach or anything, but I'm entitled to my opinion and I happen to agree with a lot of the points about Matt's rumba. Dodgy hands, varying hip action, but good lines (withstanding the hands!) and intensity. Overall a convincing performance, I really enjoyed it!

His 10s will come, wish Tess and Claudia would stop asking him about it!
Pices-55
14-11-2010
Originally Posted by teeswolf:
“For the nth time, when DOES HE ASK FOR THEM?

Tess and Claudia mention it every time they interview him, so he has to come out with the 'obvious' comment that it would be nice to get them.

I have never heard Matt come right out and ask for a 10, but if someone can put a link to a clip of him doing so, it would be appreciated!!”

I think the reason he is asked about it a lot is most likely that he keeps going on about it.
In tonights results show he yet again commented on what to do to get a Ten, he wasnt asked but offered it anyway.I do think he must be slightly obsessed with getting one, I even think he may be a little rattled that so far he has not managed it.
I do like Matt, but I sort of get the feeling he is a tad obsessed with his scores, after being overhyped at the beginning I almost get the feeling he feels a bit of entitlement for one.
Its just my opinion ....but its how he comes across to me.
VWgirl
14-11-2010
Originally Posted by Pices-55:
“ In tonights results show he yet again commented on what to do to get a Ten, he wasnt asked but offered it anyway.”

I knew someone would post about that, and my response is this: He wasn't talking about wanting to get 10s, his comment was that everyone else is asking him about it!!

Matt's exact quote on the show was : "It should be called 'Strictly-can-you-get-a-10?'", very obviously alluding to the constant questioning from Tess (she had just asked him about it, yet again) and Claudia on ITT about the 10 issue.

Outside of that, he just looked happy to book a place on the bus to Blackpool. Even Claudia said on Friday's ITT that the 10 thing is manufactured by the Strictly Production team to suit "their purposes". It's a shame that some people can't see that.
Tall Paul
14-11-2010
Reckon there is plenty of time to get a ten, he will have to conquer his hands to break the deadlock and thus get the tens he deserves. At this present moment of time I'd rather see him enjoy himself, he will probably go from a famine of tens to a feast of them.
Pices-55
14-11-2010
Originally Posted by VWgirl:
“I knew someone would post about that, and my response is this: He wasn't talking about wanting to get 10s, his comment was that everyone else is asking him about it!!

Matt's exact quote on the show was : "It should be called 'Strictly-can-you-get-a-10?'", very obviously alluding to the constant questioning from Tess (she had just asked him about it, yet again) and Claudia on ITT about the 10 issue.

Outside of that, he just looked happy to book a place on the bus to Blackpool. Even Claudia said on Friday's ITT that the 10 thing is manufactured by the Strictly Production team to suit "their purposes". It's a shame that some people can't see that.”

Well you are using conjecture there, you dont know thats why he said it at all, my guess is that he is just a little too desperate for a ten.
As for why people cannot see what you see.....well I guess at the end of the day we all see things differently and interpret them differntly.
I do however smell a whiff of desperation about Matt atm, its slightly putting me off him.
Tangerine_82
14-11-2010
Originally Posted by Pices-55:
“I think the reason he is asked about it a lot is most likely that he keeps going on about it.
In tonights results show he yet again commented on what to do to get a Ten, he wasnt asked but offered it anyway.I do think he must be slightly obsessed with getting one, I even think he may be a little rattled that so far he has not managed it.
I do like Matt, but I sort of get the feeling he is a tad obsessed with his scores, after being overhyped at the beginning I almost get the feeling he feels a bit of entitlement for one.
Its just my opinion ....but its how he comes across to me.”

This is exactly how I see him.
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