Delgado
(with Ainley a close second)
(with Ainley a close second)
Who was the Best Master?
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Originally Posted by Pliny the Elder:
“Delgado for me too, although they did overdo it by making him appear in every episode of Jon Pertwee's 2nd season.”
“Delgado for me too, although they did overdo it by making him appear in every episode of Jon Pertwee's 2nd season.”
I always wondered how that worked...
"oooh, there's a mysterious figure causing mayhem on Earth, I wonder who it coul....oh of course, it's The Master again! Just like it was last week! Oh well...."
As for my choice....y'see, I like Simm...but I also like the 20 seconds of Jacobi too...
But, which is better?
There's only one way to find outttt
Originally Posted by DavetheScot:
“I think if Anthony Ainley had given the kind of performance he did in Survival in all his stories, he'd have been the best ever Master.
However, he didn't, so Roger Delgado remains the best Master.”
“I think if Anthony Ainley had given the kind of performance he did in Survival in all his stories, he'd have been the best ever Master.
However, he didn't, so Roger Delgado remains the best Master.”
Sums up my feelings exactly
My problem with Ainley was that by the time he appeared I'd grown up a fair bit and whereas I loved The Master coming back every story (at least in one series) in the JP era, I started to tire of him by the time we got to Time Flight and yet another disguise (with an invisible glowing arrow above embossed with the words THIS IS THE MASTER!) and began wondering why The Doctor didn't just twig it was going to be him again.
The Beast Master? It was Marc Singer, of course...
Haha! I jest of course (but I did read it as that first)!
Haha! I jest of course (but I did read it as that first)!
Originally Posted by Webslark:
“Delgado
(with Ainley a close second)”
“Delgado
(with Ainley a close second)”
Ditto, though a little of Ainley's chuckle might have made Delgado more menacing, in a way.
Originally Posted by tingramretro:
“To be fair, that was not Ainley's fault. He wanted to make his Master genuinely sinister, but every time he tried to inject a bit too much menace into his performance,JNT ordered him to camp it up.”
“To be fair, that was not Ainley's fault. He wanted to make his Master genuinely sinister, but every time he tried to inject a bit too much menace into his performance,JNT ordered him to camp it up.”
I had heard this, but I'm going on the performance we saw on screen. It may not have been Anthony's fault that his performances were, in general, less good than Roger Delgado's, but the fact remains that they were.
Delgado number 1 for me.
I recently watched 'Mind of Evil'. I like The Master in the back of his limo, smoking a fat cigar and listening to dramatic music on his little radio - great stuff!
I recently watched 'Mind of Evil'. I like The Master in the back of his limo, smoking a fat cigar and listening to dramatic music on his little radio - great stuff!
Originally Posted by littlepete:
“Delgado number 1 for me.
I recently watched 'Mind of Evil'. I like The Master in the back of his limo, smoking a fat cigar and listening to dramatic music on his little radio - great stuff!”
“Delgado number 1 for me.
I recently watched 'Mind of Evil'. I like The Master in the back of his limo, smoking a fat cigar and listening to dramatic music on his little radio - great stuff!”
I beleive that he was listening to King Crimson's version of Mars The Bringer Of War, which for contractual reasons was renamed "The Devil's Triangle". You can find it on their second album In The Wake Of Poseidon. This lengthy track would have been unlikely to have actually been played on UK daytime radio. Perhaps the Master was a fan of the John Peel show...
And, back on topic, I agree that Delgado was the definitive Master. He was somehow so very cool, you just wanted him to win. At times, he came across as far more likeable than Pertwee's Doctor!
Originally Posted by daveyboy7472:
“I know it's something we all sort of dicussed a few weeks ago in the Jacobi thread but I was wondering what people's views are overall of who their favourite Master is and what you think of the less known Master's.
My fave is still Anthony Ainley, because he was the Master when I was growing up and his chuckle always gave me the creeps. My disguise detector wasn't so finely tuned then so when he sudenly appeared out of disguise that used to scare the crap out of me as well!!!! I guess I liked him also because he was more manic and less humourous than Delgado, who I rate highly as well.
But what about the lesser known Masters? I thought Peter Pratt did a great job using his voice in The Deadly Assassin, that was quite scary as well. And I think Geoffrey Beevers was almost as good as well in The Keeper Of Traken, though the less effective make-up sort of spoilt things a bit.
As for the others, Eric Roberts was okay until the scenes in the TARDIS at the end of the TV Movie. Went a bit of the rails after that. Loved Derek Jacobi despite his short stint in the role, John Simm was okay, just a little OTT in The End Of Time.
So who was your Fave Master and did you like the less known ones?
”
“I know it's something we all sort of dicussed a few weeks ago in the Jacobi thread but I was wondering what people's views are overall of who their favourite Master is and what you think of the less known Master's.
My fave is still Anthony Ainley, because he was the Master when I was growing up and his chuckle always gave me the creeps. My disguise detector wasn't so finely tuned then so when he sudenly appeared out of disguise that used to scare the crap out of me as well!!!! I guess I liked him also because he was more manic and less humourous than Delgado, who I rate highly as well.
But what about the lesser known Masters? I thought Peter Pratt did a great job using his voice in The Deadly Assassin, that was quite scary as well. And I think Geoffrey Beevers was almost as good as well in The Keeper Of Traken, though the less effective make-up sort of spoilt things a bit.
As for the others, Eric Roberts was okay until the scenes in the TARDIS at the end of the TV Movie. Went a bit of the rails after that. Loved Derek Jacobi despite his short stint in the role, John Simm was okay, just a little OTT in The End Of Time.
So who was your Fave Master and did you like the less known ones?
”
Roger Delgado top - followed by Anthony Ainley. I've never liked John Simms performance - it feels more like he is just plain crazy rather than the Machieavellian. That is not to say I've anything against John Simms - he was excellent in the likes of Life on Mars - I just have never warmed to his Master.
Delgado for me, for sure.
I think with more time Jacobi could have given him a run for his money, but it was such a brief attempt that I have to give Ainley second spot.
Simm left me cold, and the others even more so.
I'm a bit of a traditionalist, the Master requires a goatee and a sinister laugh, a blonde was never going to cut it!
I think with more time Jacobi could have given him a run for his money, but it was such a brief attempt that I have to give Ainley second spot.
Simm left me cold, and the others even more so.
I'm a bit of a traditionalist, the Master requires a goatee and a sinister laugh, a blonde was never going to cut it!
Originally Posted by Anne C:
“Delgado for me, for sure.
I think with more time Jacobi could have given him a run for his money, but it was such a brief attempt that I have to give Ainley second spot.
Simm left me cold, and the others even more so.
I'm a bit of a traditionalist, the Master requires a goatee and a sinister laugh, a blonde was never going to cut it!”
“Delgado for me, for sure.
I think with more time Jacobi could have given him a run for his money, but it was such a brief attempt that I have to give Ainley second spot.
Simm left me cold, and the others even more so.
I'm a bit of a traditionalist, the Master requires a goatee and a sinister laugh, a blonde was never going to cut it!”
True, with the ruthlessness of the Daleks/Cybermen/Sontarens we need a villain who won't just kill people. He disposes of them after use. Mwuah ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha har!!!!!!! But yes, a sort of intelligent villain. One who is defeated by his own arrogance not his stupidity. Daleks are defeated by the flaw in there logic, or there technology being reversed/destroyed. The Master should be defeated by surrendering. If he doesn't surrender into custody then he is not defeated. He is despicable, manipulative and he'll only give up if there absolutly no way out apart from death. Which he doesn't do. he doesn't do death at all.
He should be smart, clever, and an intellectual equal to the Doctor. But not crazy just quirky. Like Delgado. If Delgado was losing lifeforce, would he eat people? I like to think he would pop down to the butchers, hynotize them, then eat the meat there. Hes a monster, when it suits him.
Anyway, I love Delgado. Top Master. Jacobi could have been equally brilliant. That has to be the one thing I am angry with RTD for is wasting Jacobi on such a short tenure. Thats all though. Love everything else!
To be honest though, my first Master was Eric Roberts. And we all try to forget him.
Originally Posted by dalekaddison:
“True, with the ruthlessness of the Daleks/Cybermen/Sontarens we need a villain who won't just kill people. He disposes of them after use. Mwuah ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha har!!!!!!! But yes, a sort of intelligent villain. One who is defeated by his own arrogance not his stupidity. Daleks are defeated by the flaw in there logic, or there technology being reversed/destroyed. The Master should be defeated by surrendering. If he doesn't surrender into custody then he is not defeated. He is despicable, manipulative and he'll only give up if there absolutly no way out apart from death. Which he doesn't do. he doesn't do death at all.
He should be smart, clever, and an intellectual equal to the Doctor. But not crazy just quirky. Like Delgado. If Delgado was losing lifeforce, would he eat people? I like to think he would pop down to the butchers, hynotize them, then eat the meat there. Hes a monster, when it suits him.
Anyway, I love Delgado. Top Master. Jacobi could have been equally brilliant. That has to be the one thing I am angry with RTD for is wasting Jacobi on such a short tenure. Thats all though. Love everything else!
!
To be honest though, my first Master was Eric Roberts. And we all try to forget him”
“True, with the ruthlessness of the Daleks/Cybermen/Sontarens we need a villain who won't just kill people. He disposes of them after use. Mwuah ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha har!!!!!!! But yes, a sort of intelligent villain. One who is defeated by his own arrogance not his stupidity. Daleks are defeated by the flaw in there logic, or there technology being reversed/destroyed. The Master should be defeated by surrendering. If he doesn't surrender into custody then he is not defeated. He is despicable, manipulative and he'll only give up if there absolutly no way out apart from death. Which he doesn't do. he doesn't do death at all.
He should be smart, clever, and an intellectual equal to the Doctor. But not crazy just quirky. Like Delgado. If Delgado was losing lifeforce, would he eat people? I like to think he would pop down to the butchers, hynotize them, then eat the meat there. Hes a monster, when it suits him.
Anyway, I love Delgado. Top Master. Jacobi could have been equally brilliant. That has to be the one thing I am angry with RTD for is wasting Jacobi on such a short tenure. Thats all though. Love everything else!
!
To be honest though, my first Master was Eric Roberts. And we all try to forget him
”
He was the sexiest though
Whilst I do like the Classic Master, I appreciate Simm/RTD for showing him as a proper 'regeneration'. This properly opens up the series without having to get someone in to camp it up in leather gloves and a beard.
(Incidentally the: "Has he still got a beard?" / "He's got a wife" is still one of the best lines of the series.)
(Incidentally the: "Has he still got a beard?" / "He's got a wife" is still one of the best lines of the series.)
Originally Posted by dizzywhore_1804:
“Whilst I do like the Classic Master, I appreciate Simm/RTD for showing him as a proper 'regeneration'. This properly opens up the series without having to get someone in to camp it up in leather gloves and a beard.
(Incidentally the: "Has he still got a beard?" / "He's got a wife" is still one of the best lines of the series.)”
“Whilst I do like the Classic Master, I appreciate Simm/RTD for showing him as a proper 'regeneration'. This properly opens up the series without having to get someone in to camp it up in leather gloves and a beard.
(Incidentally the: "Has he still got a beard?" / "He's got a wife" is still one of the best lines of the series.)”
Yes. I'm still glad though Simm is different because otherwise it would just be repeats of the same character. The Master as well should be just like the Doctor, in that, when he regenerates, he changes personality a great deal. Like DT to MS or indeed DJ to JS. A big personality/character change that keeps the character flowing.
Yeah!
Another vote for Ainley, from me.
(He's outstanding as Portreeve in Castrovalva: Mrs Chuff didn't realise it was Ainley for at least an episode).
My second choice would be this one.
(He's outstanding as Portreeve in Castrovalva: Mrs Chuff didn't realise it was Ainley for at least an episode).
My second choice would be this one.
He was given little direction on his style at the time, and played it how he thought best.
Ainley was almost pantomime, which, during McCoy's era was probably the "best fit".
Simm wasn't so bad, though RTD just pushed his character to panto style villain again in the end, John Simm is a great actor, and acted as directed by RTD despite Simm protesting at some scenes.
Ainley was almost pantomime, which, during McCoy's era was probably the "best fit".
Simm wasn't so bad, though RTD just pushed his character to panto style villain again in the end, John Simm is a great actor, and acted as directed by RTD despite Simm protesting at some scenes.
I don't think that Ainley was panto (though many do), but I am sure many would agree that Ainley was at his "least" panto with McCoy!
Originally Posted by chuffnobbler:
“I don't think that Ainley was panto (though many do), but I am sure many would agree that Ainley was at his "least" panto with McCoy!”
“I don't think that Ainley was panto (though many do), but I am sure many would agree that Ainley was at his "least" panto with McCoy!”
Yes that comment baffled me a little.
Originally Posted by chuffnobbler:
“I don't think that Ainley was panto (though many do), but I am sure many would agree that Ainley was at his "least" panto with McCoy!”
“I don't think that Ainley was panto (though many do), but I am sure many would agree that Ainley was at his "least" panto with McCoy!”
I think Ainley is "remembered" as panto but if you actually watch his perormances, some of them, not all, but some are very menacing indeed.
Originally Posted by JohnFlawbod:
“I think Ainley is "remembered" as panto but if you actually watch his perormances, some of them, not all, but some are very menacing indeed.”
“I think Ainley is "remembered" as panto but if you actually watch his perormances, some of them, not all, but some are very menacing indeed.”
I agree, as I said above, his first three stories were not panto at all in my opinion. it's only after Season 20 that the problems kicked in. I think in Logopolis especially he really is menacing and manic and you can quite believe he would destroy the Universe if he had the chance.
Originally Posted by swadey:
“He was given little direction on his style at the time, and played it how he thought best.
Ainley was almost pantomime, which, during McCoy's era was probably the "best fit".
Simm wasn't so bad, though RTD just pushed his character to panto style villain again in the end, John Simm is a great actor, and acted as directed by RTD despite Simm protesting at some scenes.”
“He was given little direction on his style at the time, and played it how he thought best.
Ainley was almost pantomime, which, during McCoy's era was probably the "best fit".
Simm wasn't so bad, though RTD just pushed his character to panto style villain again in the end, John Simm is a great actor, and acted as directed by RTD despite Simm protesting at some scenes.”
Please elaborate - I've not seen or read about Simm's protestations. I'd be interested to know more.
Originally Posted by deadline:
“Delgado
End of.
He was The Master.
The rest were fertilizer.”
“Delgado
End of.
He was The Master.
The rest were fertilizer.”
Is right la!
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