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Matt is taking it too seriously
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Pasta
12-12-2010
Originally Posted by Yasmin26:
“I absolutely think the judges should pull up the pros more often when they are to blame, like they do in DWTS. It would make it much more interesting.

But I honestly don't think Aliona was to blame for the Salsa. It's becoming quite the theme to put all the blame on Aliona.



I find all that laughable, why is my contribution to thread linked to whether I like Matt or not. I don't enjoy Matt's dancing and I have been upfront about that.

But why do I have to point it out to you.

That's just silly and I often find people use the "you hate him" card to deter from the discussion. Quite childish.”

People might wonder why you persist in a single interpretation of an edited moment as 'Matt storming off', when, as several posters have pointed out, he only had a few minutes to change for the swingathon.
Tangerine_82
12-12-2010
Originally Posted by Pasta:
“People might wonder why you persist in a single interpretation of an edited moment as 'Matt storming off', when, as several posters have pointed out, he only had a few minutes to change for the swingathon.”

But surely it's only opinion both ways. Yes, he had to change quickly to get to the swingathon but that still doesn't account for his brusqueness. Some feel it's because he was tired and rushed and others feel it's because he was extremely pissed off about what the judges said to him. There's no definitive answer, it's all opinion.
Pasta
12-12-2010
Originally Posted by Tangerine_82:
“But surely it's only opinion both ways. Yes, he had to change quickly to get to the swingathon but that still doesn't account for his brusqueness. Some feel it's because he was tired and rushed and others feel it's because he was extremely pissed off about what the judges said to him. There's no definitive answer, it's all opinion.”

Well, yes - that was my point. I don't have an axe grinding away on this thread, do I?
gibletjohn
12-12-2010
I completely disagree. Bruno for some reason keeps making a point of saying he is desperate, but he is competitive and these are not the same things. I also believe he is head and shoulders better than all the others, but is let down by Aliona. He will win and Tointon will come second.
Tangerine_82
12-12-2010
Originally Posted by Pasta:
“Well, yes - that was my point. I don't have an axe grinding away on this thread, do I?”

Sorry I thought you were implying it was fact he was just rushed. In that case, I agree with you - it's all about interpretation, there is no right and wrong in this discussion.
miss_minervois
12-12-2010
I think it's all too easy to go all tin foil hat on Matt's VT.
Yasmin26
12-12-2010
Originally Posted by Pasta:
“People might wonder why you persist in a single interpretation of an edited moment as 'Matt storming off', when, as several posters have pointed out, he only had a few minutes to change for the swingathon.”

How is my interpretation any less right than how you choose to see it. At least mine is backed by the fact we know Matt has difficulty of taking criticism.

Originally Posted by Tangerine_82:
“But surely it's only opinion both ways. Yes, he had to change quickly to get to the swingathon but that still doesn't account for his brusqueness. Some feel it's because he was tired and rushed and others feel it's because he was extremely pissed off about what the judges said to him. There's no definitive answer, it's all opinion.”

It is indeed. a lot of people fail to see that.

Originally Posted by Sofajudge:
“Then I am cock a hoop to provide light relief as after all this is only an entertainment show.

Great, you don't enjoy Matt, I have no problem with that at all. My problem was the insinuation that Matt was such a bad tempered person he 'stormed' off in a paddy. Rather than the more common sense alternative that he was rushing to change for his next number.”

There is no common sense there, just how you see it. I saw exactly what the video showed. a man extremely upset by the reaction to his dancing. It is entertainment program, lets not take it so seriously that we question the motivates of others for their posts.
Starpuss
12-12-2010
I want the celebs to care passionately about what they are doing. I want them to want to win more than anything.

I am not sure why Matt is getting bashed for being upset when he is trying his hardest. Good for him I say!
tabithakitten
12-12-2010
Originally Posted by Yasmin26:
“How is my interpretation any less right than how you choose to see it. At least mine is backed by the fact we know Matt has difficulty of taking criticism.



It is indeed. a lot of people fail to see that.



There is no common sense there, just how you see it. I saw exactly what the video showed. a man extremely upset by the reaction to his dancing. It is entertainment program, lets not take it so seriously that we question the motivates of others for their posts.”

Do we? Do we actually know that? You seem to be accepting it's all interpretation in one sentence and then continuing to explain why yours is correct in the next. None of us really know anything about the reactions and feelings of the celebs - only what we see (or choose to see) and hear and how we choose to interpret that which, yes, can be affected by personal opinion.
sonic157
12-12-2010
Originally Posted by Tangerine_82:
“But surely it's only opinion both ways. Yes, he had to change quickly to get to the swingathon but that still doesn't account for his brusqueness. Some feel it's because he was tired and rushed and others feel it's because he was extremely pissed off about what the judges said to him. There's no definitive answer, it's all opinion.”

No I don't think it is. This is something that has been cooked up by Matt's detractors. All the Matt bashing and Pamela hating is helping the celeb who is not being criticised - the one you want to win.
Sofajudge
12-12-2010
Originally Posted by sonic157:
“No I don't think it is. This is something that has been cooked up by Matt's detractors. All the Matt bashing and Pamela hating is helping the celeb who is not being criticised - the one you want to win.”

I agree that for some posters being harshly negative maythink this takes the 'heat' off their own favourite. I really don't think any of this is likely to affect the show results. DS posters are a a tiny percentage of the fans.

Who will go through to the final? No idea but I hope it isn't Scott or Gav as I think they were worst last night. After that it will more or less be down to the showdance.
drbolognaise
12-12-2010
Originally Posted by sonic157:
“No I don't think it is. This is something that has been cooked up by Matt's detractors. All the Matt bashing and Pamela hating is helping the celeb who is not being criticised - the one you want to win.”

Where you not on here last night? Plenty of Anti-Kara threads to choose from! They're all getting it in the neck now, no-one more so than others, it's the way of the DS world!
Sofajudge
12-12-2010
Originally Posted by drbolognaise:
“Where you not on here last night? Plenty of Anti-Kara threads to choose from! They're all getting it in the neck now, no-one more so than others, it's the way of the DS world!”

Sadly that's true also. I can understand it if the celeb is an obnoxious, arrogant git but I honestly don't think any of the final five are. Favourites now are down to personal taste and whether performers, technicians, or tryers are your thing.

Actually, I could be wrong but I think Pamela has attracted the worst personal vitriol here.
Tangerine_82
12-12-2010
Originally Posted by sonic157:
“No I don't think it is. This is something that has been cooked up by Matt's detractors. All the Matt bashing and Pamela hating is helping the celeb who is not being criticised - the one you want to win.”

This is another example of what I was talking about on the previous page.

It is opinion and your's isn't factual and neither is mine. It's all interpretation.
drbolognaise
12-12-2010
Originally Posted by Sofajudge:
“Sadly that's true also. I can understand it if the celeb is an obnoxious, arrogant git but I honestly don't think any of the final five are. Favourites now are down to personal taste and whether performers, technicians, or tryers are your thing.

Actually, I could be wrong but I think Pamela has attracted the worst personal vitriol here.”

I've not noticed that but I think all the contestants get it in waves and bursts, each day is different now the BOD has gone.
Sallyforth
12-12-2010
Originally Posted by Doghouse Riley:
“Err..

Come on! It's the BBC, he's their "blue-eyed boy!"

That wasn't an "I must go to the bathroom" look!

I try not to let personal preferences cloud my judgment. I think Kara's the "winner" but I've already said Craig was right to only give her a nine.”

I try not to let personal preferences cloud my judgement either. I don't actually have a favourite this series. I am simply obvserving that if Matt really is the BBC's blue eyed boy, they have a strange way of showing it.
Starpuss
12-12-2010
Originally Posted by Sofajudge:
“Sadly that's true also. I can understand it if the celeb is an obnoxious, arrogant git but I honestly don't think any of the final five are. Favourites now are down to personal taste and whether performers, technicians, or tryers are your thing.

Actually, I could be wrong but I think Pamela has attracted the worst personal vitriol here.”

I agree with this. I much prefer Kara and Matt as dancers and so am sensitive to any criticism of them but even I have noticed that it is Pam who gets the most personal attacks.
dancefever
12-12-2010
Just to make it very clear again, and this especially to the matt fans, yes, i am a huge kara fan, however i would in no way insult another contestant in favour of my favourite, that just isn't me. I just made this thread to express how i felt and i welcome every bodies views whether they agree or not. I really like all the contestants on the show and i think matt is brilliant, and i do agree he did not storm off, people were taking matt away to get him changed. But i also agree that matt may have been made to feel invincible and that he was the golden boy, which is not fair to the others which is why he gets very hurt even with the slightest of criticism. I just feel he should take it on the chin like everybody else and move on, yes he is allowed to get upset. But i feel that whenever he gets criticism he gets very down on himself. That's why i said he should just enjoy the experience, it seems to me that it's all about the winning with him. Again i repeat, i do really like him, he's a really nice guy and a great dancer, he deserves to be in the final.
Doghouse Riley
12-12-2010
Originally Posted by dancefever:
“Just to make it very clear again, and this especially to the matt fans, yes, i am a huge kara fan, however i would in no way insult another contestant in favour of my favourite, that just isn't me. I just made this thread to express how i felt and i welcome every bodies views whether they agree or not. I really like all the contestants on the show and i think matt is brilliant, and i do agree he did not storm off, people were taking matt away to get him changed. But i also agree that matt may have been made to feel invincible and that he was the golden boy, which is not fair to the others which is why he gets very hurt even with the slightest of criticism. I just feel he should take it on the chin like everybody else and move on, yes he is allowed to get upset. But i feel that whenever he gets criticism he gets very down on himself. That's why i said he should just enjoy the experience, it seems to me that it's all about the winning with him. Again i repeat, i do really like him, he's a really nice guy and a great dancer, he deserves to be in the final.”

Matt's likely to be linked to the BBC by a "golden handcuffs" deal, he won't be used to criticism.
Sofajudge
12-12-2010
Dancefever I never read your op as an opportunity to attack Matt. I agree with most of what you say and indeed Matt is his own worst critic and down on himself rather than others. He is tough on himself and that is why his demeanour is in no way bratty.

He should loosen up and if he gets through, enjoy himself more and forget perfectionism, I think all the winners have embraced the fun in the end rather than fretted over the technicalities.
blackberry000
12-12-2010
Originally Posted by dancefever:
“Sorry if this has been addressed before, i haven't been on the forums for a while, but matt is too desperate to win and i feel he is ruining his own chances. It's like winning this show has become the most important thing in his life, when that's just so silly. This is a dance competition but it should also be enjoyable. Matt's expectations for that salsa were too high which is why he was so upset when he got those comments and scores. This is the only thing that puts me off him. He needs to just relax.”

I don't know what Matt's expectations were regarding his Salsa, but his scores were far too low. He got scored less than Gavin by every judge except Craig, giving him a lower score than Gavin! I remember when my friends and I were watching it we were in awe at how quickly he picks up the dance, how good he looks and how naturally he moves. I didn't expect a perfect score for him, and sure he should be be penalized for looking too serious through the dances, but those comments, and marks were out of order. I don't understand what the judges were thinking.

Matt's reaction to the judges comment was totally normal in my opinion. My friends and I were all gobsmacked at how harsh they were to what was potentially a good dance for a celebrity.
Tangerine_82
12-12-2010
Originally Posted by blackberry000:
“I don't know what Matt's expectations were regarding his Salsa, but his scores were far too low. He got scored less than Gavin by every judge except Craig, giving him a lower score than Gavin! I remember when my friends and I were watching it we were in awe at how quickly he picks up the dance, how good he looks and how naturally he moves. I didn't expect a perfect score for him, and sure he should be be penalized for looking too serious through the dances, but those comments, and marks were out of order. I don't understand what the judges were thinking.

Matt's reaction to the judges comment was totally normal in my opinion. My friends and I were all gobsmacked at how harsh they were to what was potentially a good dance for a celebrity.”

The following is my personal critique of Matt's salsa, not an attack on Matt fans, Aliona or Matt. I just feel I have to make that disclaimer considering the defensiveness I've encountered over the last few days.

The salsa that Matt danced was awkward, uncomfortable, far too simple, full of lifts that looked shoehorned in and Matt himself over-danced it. His hip movement was independent from his body, if you know what I mean. It's the difference between rotating your hips like you're playing with a hoola hoop and pushing from your foot, up your leg, into your hip and creating the proper hip action. He was trying far too hard. Everything was exaggerated and while I know some people think that's what letting go is, it's really not. Letting go is putting feeling into your steps and dancing with abandon, not over-exaggerating every single step to the point where you look like you're being electrocuted (much like Chris Hollins always did). I think Matt suffered from over-dancing an already sub par routine. Half of it was the fault of the choreography and half of it was Matt's over-enthusiasm. I think his scores were fair. He obviously was shocked at how bad everyone thought it was because he thought he'd really let it all out and done well and I think that's also Aliona's fault - she hasn't taught him how to really dance and I think that's why a lot of people think he'd have done much better with another pro. He does have natural ability and another pro might have been able to tap into it. But then look at Scott - he's got the technique and the performance and having a great pro hasn't helped him master a lot of dances. Natural talent isn't enough.
labasheedy
12-12-2010
OP, "desperate" is always a horrible word isn't it?
If someone is described as desperate is always a blow really isn't it.


I love Matt, I think he's a real gentleman with very traditonal modest values, a lovely supporting wife and with a young family.

Did you see his home on "Cribs"
It was so homely and modest, full of his own home-made furniture and wee children and toys and ..pickles

He's never arrogant or cheeky, sometimes he is so genuinely deflated and crushed by the judges comments and we love him for having feelings and being a real person.

He's a BBC blue eyed boy, because he has an immense likeable appeal alongside these values.


He has the One Show because of this charisma and its unlikely you will find him Facebook messaging in an hotel room in the middle of the night ( sorry Jason)

I don't really understand some people's need to find opportunities to criticise his efforts and take the odd lob or two at him when they can .. but accept that variety is the spice of life and we must all have different views.

anyhow,
He's a fabulous person and I'm really pleased to have him as my champion.
Doghouse Riley
12-12-2010
Originally Posted by Sallyforth:
“I try not to let personal preferences cloud my judgement either. I don't actually have a favourite this series. I am simply obvserving that if Matt really is the BBC's blue eyed boy, they have a strange way of showing it.”

You mean the judges?

They aren't the BBC. Given the "socksgate" scandal and others of a few years ago, the BBC will not put pressure on any judge to vote one way or another. They've had their fingers burned too often by the authority when they've indulged in direct manipulation.
They use more subtle ways, TV is "all smoke and mirrors" so they can project any image of any person they want by what they include in any VT or any live transmission. They've projected him as the loveable " boy next door" throughout this series.

We only got a glimpse of Matt's reaction last night and it was in no way like "the boy next door."
Jan2555*GG*
12-12-2010
Originally Posted by labasheedy:
“OP, "desperate" is always a horrible word isn't it?
If someone is described as desperate is always a blow really isn't it.


I love Matt, I think he's a real gentleman with very traditonal modest values, a lovely supporting wife and with a young family.

Did you see his home on "Cribs"
It was so homely and modest, full of his own home-made furniture and wee children and toys and ..pickles

He's never arrogant or cheeky, sometimes he is so genuinely deflated and crushed by the judges comments and we love him for having feelings and being a real person.

He's a BBC blue eyed boy, because he has an immense likeable appeal alongside these values.


He has the One Show because of this charisma and its unlikely you will find him Facebook messaging in an hotel room in the middle of the night ( sorry Jason)

I don't really understand some people's need to find opportunities to criticise his efforts and take the odd lob or two at him when they can .. but accept that variety is the spice of life and we must all have different views.

anyhow,
He's a fabulous person and I'm really pleased to have him as my champion. ”

Thats a lovely post in favour of Matt but you dont actually know him personally do you ? you may be absolutely correct in all you say but equally it is just as possible that there are things about him that you dont know that are not so nice.......Videos made by the BBC about celebs on Strictly will show you what they want you to see.....happens every year.
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