If I were running a phone poll I'd be very suspicious of any line that had more than two or three votes listed against them. A handful could be a family all making votes, but 20,50 or more looks like an obvious attempt to rig a poll. I'd ignore all votes from that number.

It has never been confirmed, as far as I can see, that multiple votes from the same line all count equally with single votes. Multiple voting has never been encouraged on air, even with such vague promises as 'every vote counts'. The message is always 'vote for your favourite' with, I would say, an implicit message that if you vote, vote once, and only once.

It's entirely possible that it's not a factor in most votes, in that multiple votes for either side cancel each other out. In most cases they probably do nothing about them. However, I'd bet money on there being an agreement with the regulator that if votes appear to part of an attempt to rig any contest, then there is provision to omit suspicious sources in the count.

It's only ever going to happen if it's close and the multiple voting is on one side. They would not declare it in public because they would have to announce how many votes they do permit per line, whether that's 10, 4. 2 or even 1. A big advantage to anyone trying to influence the vote because they know the most efficient routine: vote, say ten times and then find another phone.

I would presume that if you'd paid to vote it would count or the BBC would be in trouble with the people who do multi-vote.

Nowhere does it say that it's not one call, one vote, I think nearly all of us assume that it is one call/one vote. It would be way clearer in the terms and conditions if only one of your votes count, just like it's very clear that your vote won't count and you will be charged if you vote after the lines have closed.

I would also imagine that it's way too complicated to start discounting multiple votes from particular phone lines, especially as the results show is a couple of hours after the live show.

Snow is in the lap of the gods, bookies being greedy sinners do not go to church so have no private line to the gods .

Online bookmakers and betting exchanges will carry on laying bets even while phone voting is going on (completely legal). The danger is that bookies will corrupt the phone company individuals and obtain up-to-minute voting figures. If so then it is no longer a bet with risk, and the greedy bookie will take a view and adjust their prices fearlessly to pocket maximum public money without the benefit of inside knowledge. There will be heavy-duty precautions to prevent leaks, but when have human situations ever been completely leak-proof?

Half-time totals counted and published at 9pm.

Stats after 109 voters, at 9pm

Not intending to vote ------ = 14 persons.
Undecided -------------------- = 15 voters (16% of total electorate intending to vote)

Kara ----- 1 votes x 16 voters = 16 votes
Kara ----- 2 votes x 6 voters = 12 votes
Kara ----- 3 votes x 8 voters = 24 votes
Kara ----- 4 votes x 4 voters = 16 votes
Kara ----- 5 votes x 9 voters = 45 votes
Kara --- 10 votes x 17 voters = 170 votes
Kara --- 20 votes x 12 voters = 240 votes
Kara --- 50 votes x 16 voters = 800 votes

Kara total ---------------------------- = 1323 votes = 57 %

Matt ----- 1 votes x 9 voters = 9 votes
Matt ----- 2 votes x 1 voters = 2 votes
Matt ----- 3 votes x 2 voters = 6 votes
Matt ----- 4 votes x 2 voters = 8 votes
Matt ----- 5 votes x 6 voters = 30 votes
Matt --- 10 votes x 3 voters = 30 votes
Matt --- 20 votes x 5 voters = 100 votes
Matt --- 50 votes x 7 voters = 350 votes

Matt total ------------------------------- = 535 votes = 23 %

Pamela -- 1 votes x 7 voters = 7 votes
Pamela -- 2 votes x 3 voters = 6 votes
Pamela -- 3 votes x 5 voters = 15 votes
Pamela -- 4 votes x 4 voters = 16 votes
Pamela -- 5 votes x 4 voters = 20 votes
Pamela - 10 votes x 4 voters = 40 votes
Pamela - 20 votes x 3 voters = 60 votes
Pamela - 50 votes x 6 voters = 300 votes

Pamela total -------------------------- = 464 votes = 20 %

It appears that Kara votes outweigh Matt and Pamela votes combined,
that at every level of single and multiple voting Kara received the most votes,
that the undecided sector looks not large enough to change the outcome.

Unquestionably multi-voters have more influence than single voters (where else does quantity not talk?). Luckily all candidates have their share of multi-voters, i.e. the more single voters then proportionally the more multi voters.

Vote count update will be published at 3pm today.

Voting will close on Sunday at midday. All are invited to continue voting in the run-up to 7pm, during the dancing and afterwards.

DS Forum overwhelmingly favouring Kara and Artem continues in spectacular disagreement with Betfair forum and the nationwide betting market (4/5 Matt best price with online bookie BET365, 7/4 Kara best price with William Hill). DS is also standing against ICM poll stating that 3 candidates are neck-and-neck, and the leak widely believed in Betfair that Matt received over 50% of the phone vote last Saturday.

Do super-keen DS dance fans know better than gamblers and disinterested viewers?
Will the alleged preference by female voters to vote male be a factor? Will the very popular Artem mitigate this factor?
Will the alleged landslide vote for Matt last Friday suddenly melt away without warning like Ann's did?

The two opposing camps cannot both be right. Which side do you believe?

i voted 40 times last week for matt and will be increasing it tonight

The betting just reflects the money wagered, as others have pointed out. I don't believe the bookies would play mind games with the punters, SCD is not a particularly large or important market for them.
I have no idea about the Betfair leak, it could be true, Matt's supporters may have been more motivated to vote last week.
One thing is sure, there will be hundreds of thousands more non-committed voters for the final, so the couple able to produce something with a real "wow factor" will pick up the majority of floating voters.
I don't think the forum here is representitive of the voting public. The majority of posters here are more discerning and enthusiastic about dance..the majority of the public probably put entertainment at the top of their list.
In my opinion, it's too close to call between Kara and Matt..it all depends on the night. Sorry, I don't see Pamela springing a surprise.

Matter of interest, not knocking, how long did it take to vote 40 times? 40 votes will make no difference to a nationwide pot of possibly 5 million (?) votes. It is a most remarkable unsigned compact between supporters of like mind, that with each person doing his little bit, collectively they will move mountains.

40 x 15p = £6, good value for entertainment and audience participation, far cheaper than going to roar at footie grounds. It is a tribute to SCD8 that it inspires such enthusiasm all round.

I actually believe this spectacular difference of opinion will not be fudged by meeting in the middle. Come 10pm tonight one side will win by a landslide. But which?

What do I believe ?? I believe it too close to call between Kara and Matt (sorry Pamela) I dont understand betting but if I was a betting person I would bet on Matt too.....Men like him have won Strictly several times so he is a safe bet to win. However this year there is another man in the mix and thats Artem, he has all the same qualities as Matt, and add to that a touch of 'danger' being an unknown Russian.....he is as much of a draw as Matt and add to that he is dancing with a girl who looks and dances like a dream.....he has produced some fantastic, romantic and special routines and you have a magic combination......they are the 'perfect' pair.....good looking, charming, sweet natured, unassuming and even though they obviously 'fancy the pants' off each other we are not getting the awful saccarine 'luuurve' rubbish that Ali and Brian produced last year. So in conclusion......my belief is that its far too close to call and if it does end up as Matt V Kara in the second half I think it will depend on who Pamela's votes go to.

Kara is 26, 5 foot 5, her sister who made such an impression on ITT is Hannah Marie, 22, also 5 foot 5, with a part in Hollyoaks. Apparently the sisters live in different flats in the same house as their parents. There is a disarming natural youthfulness about this pair which brings a smile to all ages.

Tonight will be such an exceptional vintage emotional Final that previous precedents can be tossed out the window. For me:

DS Forum 1 - Betfair Forum 0

12% of respondents are "not voting", most probably because they are outside the UK and cannot vote. This Final looks likely to break records in turnout and voting volume. If stats are available later, please can someone post in this thread.

Vote count to date will be published at 3pm.

All right, I'll get off the fence.
I don't see it being a landslide to anyone, but I have a feeling a lot of Pamela's votes may go to Kara in the second round of voting. So, Kara to win..by a short head.

Do you mean a short neck?

No, I agree it's never been clarified one way or the other. However, I think I'd interpret that on the side of caution rather than 'anything goes'. You do have to remember thare is money staked on the outcome. If it's been published how much, I've not seen it, however it's a market nearly all of the bookies offer so it must be worthwhile for them.

What we know is that series 5 had 8 million votes across 12 voting rounds (the last Children in Need contribution). if we assume that there are many more in the semi final and final than early rounds we might be talking as many as half of the total for the two rounds in the final.

It's all digital exchanges, you get a list of every vote against the originating number. By the way, your number is only concealed to other ordinary subscribers, the telecoms company has it recorded and can use it for fraud detection (like for phone voting), harassment and other purposes as defined by the legislation.

Sort four million numbers, list and remove over, say, 5 occurrences? Even as a text file that's only 10 bytes a number or a 40MB file, maybe 50 if you include the vote detail and end of line bytes. I'd be surprised if that took more than ten minutes, even on the cheapest laptop at PCWorld.

I think that voting more than 10 times for anyone makes a mockery of the whole competition.

This is an arms race. If the other side voted more than 10 times you would need to do the same or more to protect your own candidate, or he/she is toast.

In the general election all three parties need to spend money big time, in USA horrendous amounts. There may be a case for disarmament, but it would have to be binding on all sides.

I've polled voting for Kara 10 times - who knows though, after their dances it may be more or less. Everyone in this house likes to vote a few times (that's why it stands at 10 or more).

Stats after 109 voters, at 2:50pm Saturday

Not voting --------------------- = 20
Undecided -------------------- = 15 voters (5% of total electorate intending to vote)

Kara ----- 1 votes x 20 voters = 20 votes
Kara ----- 2 votes x 8 voters = 16 votes
Kara ----- 3 votes x 12 voters = 36 votes
Kara ----- 4 votes x 6 voters = 24 votes
Kara ----- 5 votes x 11 voters = 55 votes
Kara --- 10 votes x 27 voters = 270 votes
Kara --- 20 votes x 17 voters = 340 votes
Kara --- 50 votes x 21 voters = 1050 votes

Kara total ------------------------------- = 1811 votes = 58 %

Matt ----- 1 votes x 13 voters = 13 votes
Matt ----- 2 votes x 1 voters = 2 votes
Matt ----- 3 votes x 5 voters = 15 votes
Matt ----- 4 votes x 2 voters = 8 votes
Matt ----- 5 votes x 9 voters = 45 votes
Matt --- 10 votes x 4 voters = 40 votes
Matt --- 20 votes x 6 voters = 120 votes
Matt --- 50 votes x 11 voters = 550 votes

Matt total ------------------------------- = 793 votes = 25 %

Pamela -- 1 votes x 8 voters = 8 votes
Pamela -- 2 votes x 4 voters = 8 votes
Pamela -- 3 votes x 5 voters = 15 votes
Pamela -- 4 votes x 4 voters = 16 votes
Pamela -- 5 votes x 4 voters = 20 votes
Pamela - 10 votes x 5 voters = 50 votes
Pamela - 20 votes x 3 voters = 60 votes
Pamela - 50 votes x 7 voters = 350 votes

Pamela total ---------------------------- = 527 votes = 17 %

If Pamela gets eliminated after round 1, then anyone who voted for Pamela as female and good dancer, would be more likely to switch to Kara in round 2.
If so, Kara will be home and dried. If Pamela votes switched in total to Matt, then Kara will still lead by 58-42.

On paper.
Good luck to all voters, observers, celebs and dancers.

Feel free to vote now to register the spread across the Terrific Three,

or vote in the final round for the Peerless Pairs.

Ok I've decided to vote. Don't normally but I've had a beer. 5 for Kara & Artem.

Showbumpsadaisy

DS Forum 1 - Betfair Forum 0

Joy

Credit must also go to the nationwide jury voting with their heart each for his own candidate, at a cost to the pocket.

Well done GBP. Well done DS voters.

With this poll now closed, here are the final counts including votes during and after dancing last night, from 196 respondents:

Not voting --------------------- = 25 (12%)
Undecided -------------------- = 16 voters (8% of total electorate intending to vote)

Kara ------ 1 votes X 25 voters = 25 votes
Kara ------ 2 votes X 11 voters = 22 votes
Kara ------ 3 votes X 14 voters = 42 votes
Kara ------ 4 votes X 7 voters = 28 votes
Kara ------ 5 votes X 15 voters = 75 votes
Kara ----- 10 votes X 29 voters = 290 votes
Kara ----- 20 votes X 19 voters = 380 votes
Kara ----- 50 votes X 22 voters = 1100 votes
Kara total -------------------------------- 1962 votes = 56 %


Matt ------ 1 votes X 15 voters = 15 votes
Matt ------ 2 votes X 2 voters = 4 votes
Matt ------ 3 votes X 55 voters = 15 votes
Matt ------ 4 votes X 22 voters = 8 votes
Matt ------ 5 votes X 11 voters = 55 votes
Matt ----- 10 votes X 53 voters = 50 votes
Matt ----- 20 votes X 81 voters = 160 votes
Matt ----- 50 votes X 13 voters = 650 votes
Matt total ----------------------------------- 957 votes = 27 %

Pamela -- 1 votes X 9 voters = 9 votes
Pamela -- 2 votes X 5 voters = 10 votes
Pamela -- 3 votes X 5 voters = 15 votes
Pamela -- 4 votes X 4 voters = 16 votes
Pamela -- 5 votes X 5 voters = 25 votes
Pamela - 10 votes X 5 voters = 50 votes
Pamela - 20 votes X 4 voters = 80 votes
Pamela - 50 votes X 8 voters = 400 votes
Pamela total --------------------------------- 605 votes = 17 %


DS Strictly readership even in high season is probably below 2,000 (the biggest poll response ever seen here was 1,200 votes). Out of 2,000 only 196 responded, so this poll sample is truly a drop in the 15-million nationwide ocean. Somehow this miniscule crystal ball forecast the nationwide response spectacularly better than the ICM polls, the Betfair consensus, the insider vote leaks, and bookmaker dispositions placing money where mouth was. Voting from the heart beat voting from the wallet.

This poll has been an eye-opener on multiple voting -- completely legal, always has been. Had "100 votes" been available as an option then for sure it would have been ticked. In this anonymous poll I myself do not believe the battalions of 50-voters were pulling legs as the proportion of 50-voters matched the single-voters for each candidate. Those who have been around long have always known about the passion of multi-voters; it appears that multi-voting is the norm and single-voting the exception. 10-, 20-, 50-voters had a disproportionate say in the outcome. In this respect Strictly voting approximates not a General Election at national level, but more like tireless community volunteers with disproportionate effect at village, town and city level. Multi-voters were spread across all 3 candidates in the same proportion as single-voters, thus ensuring an outcome representative of the electorate at large.

In the end Kara and Artem won, but it was voters not dancers or judges who delivered the glitterball. A round of applause for voters who spared no effort in defending their ideal all the way to fruition.

Last night every person who voted 20, 50 times knew her effort had no effect on a vote pool of 5(?) million. Each voter appeared to understand that if she stayed true to herself across time and space then the collective will would look after itself, and it did.

Mrs Thatcher said there was no such thing as society. Who said only ants and bees can combine for a common goal in the absence of a contract with guarantees?