I have both a LP160DTRHDMI and a LP250DTRHDMI.

The LP250DTRHDMI gets much hotter than the LP160DTRHDMI. I'd expect a 250 to run a bit warmer that a 160, but I would not expect to describe the situation as one runs warm and the other runs hot!
I have used the LP250DTRHDMI for two weeks but then got scared that it could be a fire risk.

I have some thoughts:

a/ All Vestel T825 250GBs run hot
b/ The disk is OK. It is the electronics that are faulty
c/ The disk is not OK.
d/ The fire hazard is too risky. Don't spend amy more time with the box but instead send it to the local dump

Has any one had experience of this and tracked down the cause?

I've now got both a LP160DTRHDMI and a LP250DTRHDMI having acquired the LP160 only a week ago. I've not compared the temperature of them but will do so and report back. Certainly the LP250 does get hotter than the other PVRs I'm running (Humax 9200 and a Thomson TUTV) but as the others both have fans I would expect that. I've never been concerned that the LP250 is a fire hazard. Feeling the top of the case of the PVR by hand does not feel as hot as a HDD in a computer.

Colin

I have the Hitachi 250gb version - it's been off for a couple of hours now but I'll test it tomorrow. Damn thing rebooted whilst on live TV with no recordings going on, earlier this (oops! yesterday) evening.

I do also have the Wharfedale but it was so glitchy I disconnected it. I'll get it going again - need to anyway, in case of an OAD soon.

I've set up a test this morning starting at 11:20. All units had been powered of overnight. I have placed both the LP160 and the LP250 side by side on a row of plastic laminated table mats at ground level. The ambient temperature is 21 degrees.

I set both PVRs to record manually on two channels on different MUXs until 18:00 this evening and to play back one of the recordings in Chase Play. I'm assuming this is probably the worst case power consumption condition.

About an hour after the start I also set my Humax 9200 still located on the TV shelf unit but isolated from other units to the same scenario as the Vestels. I've also switched on a Sky STB and a DVD/HDD Recorder also located on the shelf unit but isolated from the other units.

I'm assessing the temperature using the palm of my hand. Initial findings after 2h30m of operation are that the temperature of the PVRs seemed to have reach equilibrium after about 1 hour of operation. The LP250 is significantly "warmer" than the LP160 but I would not describe either as excessively hot. They are both warmer on the top of the case in the area of the left hand half of the front ventilation hole panel. (I'm currently trying to locate pictures of the internals of a T825 to relate the warmer spots to the location of the internal components).

I don't have any gear for measuring the surface temperature of the units but I'm now going to place a weather monitor temperature sensor over the front ventilation panel and see if that gives any meaningful results.

Any suggestions for modifying the test routine?

Colin

I've done nothing useful today except realise that it would have been 3am when the reboot took place

The Hitachi is set to record quite a bit this evening so I'll plonk a hand on it later, and compare it with Smartbox and Toppy.

parthena

One of those power sensor plugs will give you a wattage readout. I think Aldi have some currently ........

It may be the HDD itself - what make/model is in the 160 and 250? Possibly the 250Gb drive just runs hotter than the 160Gb. Also, drives tend to run hotter as they age (e.g. as the bearings wear).

My 250gb Hitachi is only vaguely warm on top, Toppy is red hot by comparison - it always runs hot.

I bought one from Aldi a while ago but it is not sensitive enough to measure the low wattages on PVRs accurately. It barely distinguishes between when the HDD is running or not.

Colin

To follow up on the above I measured the air temperature using the sensor located over the front ventilation panel holes. Because of the mass of the sensor body it took a long time for the reading to reach equilibrium so I only had time for one reading on each unit. Also I was unsure how well I was able to line up the small holes in the body of the sensor through which air passes to the sensor with the holes in the PVR top panel. Nevertheless these are the results I got. The LP250 recorded a temperature of 37 degrees and the LP160 34 degrees. The values were higher than I expected but the difference was less than expected.

Using my palm of hand thermometer the Sky STB was only slightly warm and and the Humax and DVD/HDD Recorder showed hardly any increase in temperature above ambient.

I also have a Thomson TUTV PVR which has internal temporature sensors on the HDD one other location and provides readouts from these in the menu. I'll re-connect that up tomorrow and check it's readings.

I took the top panel off the LP250 and am able to confirm the hot spots on the unit are immediately above the HDD and to a lesser extent above the power supply board

Colin

I took the top panel of my LP250 but all the info was printed on the underside of the HDD so I couldn't see any identification data without removing the HDD. Neither was I able decipher anything useful looking through the cut-out on the underside of the box. I've just had another look through the cut-out and established that the LP250 has a Western Digital HDD. I'll have another look at the LP160 tomorrow.

Colin

Colin, I appreciate the time you've given to trying to help out with this. P.

Yeah, I forgot the HDDs were mounted "upside down". Of course the whole chassis acts as a heatsink, particularly to the HDD which is physically connected to the casing with heatplates. Most of the heat you can feel probably comes from the HDD - it is normal for them to run at 40 degrees or so (another reason why ventilation is important). The STM5100 chip must get pretty hot too - FYI, the T835 actually has a heatsink mounted on it (my T816 doesn't). Interestingly, my T835 gets way hotter than my T816 does, and probably that is a lot to do with the compact size (i.e. less air flow / ventilation) - the casing gets really very warm to touch even when the HDD hasn't been running, and of course it has no internal PSU to generate extra heat (unlike the T825). That's one reason I use low power mode as it then cools down in standby.

I meant to mention that the underside of the casing directly under the HDD on my T825s feel hotter than the top of the unit.
Yes that certainly seems to be the case. It is to be expected as the power consumption doubles when the HDD is running compared to when it isn't.

I checked the reading of the HDD temperature sensor on a Thomson TUTV PVR today and it read around 40 degrees. The speed of the fan seems to vary in speed to keep it at this value.

Colin

Thanks Colin for all your time. I really appreciate it. I don't use the Wharfdale continuously but there are periods where its series link behaviour is exactly what I need due to power outages, and combined with the WIDE button, lack of fan, USB export its is very useful, that's why a boought a second unit as a backup.

I've tried to reseat the HDD cables to see if that made a difference to the HDD sounds it makes compared with my 160GB. It hasn't made a difference to the sound but it feels a lot cooler.

I have now identified the HDDs in my LP160 and LP250. They are both Western Digital. The LP250 has a Part No. WD2500AVJB and is also marked with the description WD Caviar SE. The LP160 has a Part No. WD1600AVBB and is marked with the description WD AV.

On the Western Digital website both drives are described as suitable for "streaming digital audio/video environments such as PVR/DVR". The specifications quote a power dissipation in the read/write mode of 6W for the LP250 drive but higher at 6.61W for the LP160 drive. Theoretically this should mean the LP160 drive will run hotter which is opposite to what would be expected. However, the LP160 drive is quoted as being tested at a duty cycle of 20% whereas the duty cycle is not quoted for the LP250 drive so the test conditions could have been different.

Not sure this helps very much.

Colin

Me too!


I love the WIDE button too. Few other manufs offer it.

I wonder if anyone could provide a link to instructions for USB export and playback?

Also, I have had to retire the T816 (no power, so I'd have to take the hard drive out to do anything) and T810, I believe that it's problematic getting recordings off them Probably beyond me?

parthena

It's described in the Manual (Page 27 in the LP250DTRHDMI Manual) under the heading Media Browser. . I found it OK for loading MP3s onto the PVR but JPEG images and Video Files I had problems with. I used to get messages to the effect that the "file was not compatible". I forget the details but Someone else having problems posted a workaround involving something on the lines of putting the USB stick into the USB port and then rebooting the PVR before opening Media Browser and starting the procedure. That worked for me at the time. Maybe Luis can comment as he uses the facility?
It can be done but I don't remember how. There is a thread on it somewhere.

Colin

I don't have manuals for any of my "refurbs"


That's what I thought, so I dropped a hint at your encyclopaedic memory Ah well, we all get older

Oh dear. Futaura has links to a lot of Vestel manuals on his site here but I'm not sure any of the ones listed had the USB ports and Media Browser. I did think there was at least one in addition the the Wharfedale LPHDMI models.
If you can't find one I'll scan the relevant bits and PM it to you if that is possible.
LOL, I'm afraid so.

Colin

I'd be very grateful if you could PM me the USB export instructions, Colin - one day - no rush whatsoever

If attachments not poss, I'll send you my email address.

P.

I've scanned the relevant pages but I don't think PMs allow images to be added.

Is your email addy still pxxxx@xxxcxxx@xxxcxxx.co.uk?

Colin

Yes ... -ish. There's a dot in place of your first @. Which you would have corrected anyway, I know.

email sent. I hope.

Colin

[quote=creddish;47980503]Maybe Luis can comment as he uses the facility?QUOTE]

Intro
====
The USB port on these Vestel units are for attaching external memory. It is possible to transfer recordings to some HDD and flash drives directly. No computer is needed for this. The recordings are transferred in TS format. It is not possibly to transfer the exported files back to the Vestel using the USB port.

The exported recordings can easily be played on a computer with some popular free software.
With varying effort the recordings can be converted to other formats to enable playback on other devices. Unfortunately with the TV recordings this can be a lengthy complex process to convert using free software. Also long term storage of most programmes will infringe copyright. Even short term storage of most programmes is dubious.

I hate spending a lot of time fiddling. My use of TS exports are therefore limited to very occasional TV programmes to watch on a laptop when I am in a hotel, and radio programmes which are easy to convert to MP3 using WinFF and are far better quality than iPlayer downloads which with my hearing I cannot always understand.

What is an exported recording?
=======================
The exported file is a copy of the file from the Vestel’s HDD. Do not attempt to export while a recoding is taking place. If there is a recoding going on during the transfer then the exported file may be truncated.

The recoding is in TS format. This is a common format that can be recognised by a lot of players and converters but not all. Free quality player software is available.

IMO converting recordings to burn to a DVD so that a relative/friend/colleague can watch via a standard DVD player is downright illegal, and also a lengthy process.

The exported TS files start with up to the first 15 characters of the programme name. After that is a load if numbers. These numbers are the date of the recording. The numbers start with the year e.g. 2011, and then the month, 00 is January, 01 is February, etc. The next two digits are the days within the month. 00 is the 1st day of the month, 01 is the 2nd day of the month. After that is the start time of the recording, e.g. 200945 is 08:09:45 pm

USB recognition
=============
Whether exporting TS files or importing MP3/JPEG the Vestel needs to recognise the USB memory stick/drive.
External HDD drives are preferable to USB flash memory due to their larger capacities and HDD transfers being faster than flash drives.
The memory needs to be either FAT or FAT32 formatted. This also means that due to FAT limitations recordings over 4GB cannot be exported in their entirety.

After connecting the memory to the Vestel’s USB port nothing may happen for up to a minute, or perhaps the memory is not recognised. If it works the TV shows a pop-up asking to switch to the media browser menu. Plus the front panel display should show a very very small 'USB' at the bottom of the display just to the left of the channel name ... if you have reading glasses you will need them, plus you will need to get up close to see 'USB' when it is displayed.

Some of my external memory devices are not recognised. I have not managed to get any modern HDD recognised.
My favourite is an old 80GB USB powered HDD. It is usually quickly recognised when there are very few files on it. My quickest memory device to be recognised, and the most reliable, was a 2GB fake 64GB Kingston flash drive from China. Annoyingly the fake has been shredded and I cannot replace as ebay has band the seller from which I bought the fake memory.

Don't bother to try USB memory transfers when you want the Vestel to do anything else. It really is not worth the effort because either it is not possible or if the Vestel is recording the transfer will most likely fail.
... Export/Import of files can only be done when the Vestel is not playing back a recording.
... Export/Import of files is flaky when the Vestel is recording. The connection to the USB memory is usually lost after a recording starts.

If the USB drive is not recognised then keep the USB drive plugged in and then re-boot by pressing the on/off button for a bit and then releasing. It takes almost 5 minutes for my Vestel to reboot, I tend to manually brush my teeth to pass some of the time.

Exporting (of single programme)
=========
Once a USB memory is recognised press the 'LIB' button and move the focus to what you want to export.
Then press OK to get the play options displayed. The last option is 'Export to USB'. Use your remotes navigate buttons to focus on that function and then press 'OK'.

What should happen is that a progress bar is displayed and the progress bar shows progress.
If the USB memory device has not been recognised the progress bar will just stay frozen.
If the USB memory device has been recognised and a recording is taking place then the connection usually gets lost and the progress bar will just stay frozen.

Exproting of multiple programmes
=========
This is possible.
I only realised that this was possible 10 days ago.
Use the Yellow button to tag the relevant recordings and then select the export option from any one of those. So far it has only worked for me when all the selected programmes are listed on one screen

Verifying export is OK
=================
Errr. I do not usual bother to check that the programme has been exported OK to the external memory.
When I do occasionally check I do this via my PC. I look at the file size and check that the size is reasonable compared to others I have exported.

What to do with exported programme
=============================
There is no provided option to transfer it back to the Vestel.
Not all PC setups will play these files using Windows Media Player. IMO the easier alternative is Media Player Classic Home Cinema (Google " MPCHC " for download). VLC is often quote as THE player but despite a few attempts at using VLC I’m sticking to MPCHC for ease and quality. If a non-free option is required then I have no idea!

Playing exported files on other devices
===============================
For TV recordings (i.e. not radio) I've run into aspect ratio and jittering issues. I'm not spending any more time on compatibility conversion.
For Radio conversions I use the free WinFF. Only 1 page of documentation is provided but it's not needed as it is very simple to use and has good defaults for the settings. (BTW it allows batch conversion as well.)