Hi people,
i'm looking into buying a MiniDv camcorder soon, price max 450 euro. I have the following models in sight:

Panasonic NV-GS11 (24x optical, 1/6" CCD, 800k pixel, dv-out)
Sony DCR-HC14 (10x optical, 1/4" CCD, 800k pixel, ....)

I narrowed it down to those 2 brands since JVC and Canon seem to pick up a lot of motor/zoom noise on the tape.

Sony has a Zeiss HAD 1/4" CCD objective, sadly only 10x optical zoom, but from what i saw, the zoom & autofocus response and image stabilisation was better than Panny's.

Does anyone have any experience in this price range or with those cameras? Sony seems to offer less at the same price than the Panny, but does it live up to its reputation?

I don't really need Dv-in, Mic-in or SD cards...just good, sharp video quality at a decent price.

Thanks in advance!

I bought a Sony DCR-TRV16 a couple of years ago and am completely happy with it (apart from the absence of DV-in!). It has a Zeiss lens and I always get comments on how good the picture is (it is very sharp and looks like TV transmission quality) after comparision with other DV machines.
The battery lasts forever as well.

Try and check out the DCR-TRV16 on the web and compare it to the Sony one you listed. It was at the bottom of the Sony DV range when I bought it and cost about 700GBP.

so no-one has a Panasonic camcorder or can comment on them?

Yeah, I have the TRV14E (the same camera as the DCR-HC14 except from cosmetic apperence) and the lens quality is great (Zeiss). And once you get going with digital editing etc its well worth paying the extra money for a sony. I have made a few holiday video's..great fun. And it has a proper 16:9 fuctions and the nightvision is great. The best place to look is a price/product comparison site such as Dealtime or Pricerunner.

Anyway good luck!