Freeview HD - 1024x768

BeethovensPiano · 18-04-2011, 07:04

My parents have a 42" Plasma with a screen res of 1024x768. Now we can get Freeview HD would it make much difference on a TV of this Resolution?

Nigel Goodwin · 18-04-2011, 08:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by BeethovensPiano

My parents have a 42" Plasma with a screen res of 1024x768. Now we can get Freeview HD would it make much difference on a TV of this Resolution?

Not much on an HD Ready Plasma, they aren't very good on HD - I tried Sky HD on my 42 Plasma (just because I could), and I didn't consider it a worthwhile improvement, even though I had access to more than one free HD box.

If you're buying a new Freeview box anyway, then it probably makes sense to get an HD one though - it's likely to be more future proof. Just don't expect to go 'wow' at the HD pictures as you would on an HD ready LCD.

BeethovensPiano · 18-04-2011, 08:55

Hmmm that's disappointing. Didnt realise Plasma was no good for HD.

ArcticFox · 18-04-2011, 09:08

Plasma is good for HD there are lots of 1080p plasmas about, just not that plasma.

BeethovensPiano · 18-04-2011, 09:14

So you think it would be a waste of time getting a Freeview HD box - with no discernable difference between SD Feeview?

hardylane · 18-04-2011, 09:20

This is subjective and a bit misleading.

The screen will show 720p images perfectly fine, which is a major improvement over 576.

I have an older screen in my bedroom that does this and I'm happy with the 720p image it resolves.

1080p would be better, but I can't afford to replace.

Nigel Goodwin · 18-04-2011, 10:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by BeethovensPiano

So you think it would be a waste of time getting a Freeview HD box - with no discernable difference between SD Feeview?

If you're buying a new box specifically to get HD, then I would say don't bother - but if you're buying a box to convert the set to Freeview, as I said before it's worth getting HD as it's more future proof.

Nigel Goodwin · 18-04-2011, 10:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by hardylane

This is subjective and a bit misleading.

The screen will show 720p images perfectly fine, which is a major improvement over 576.

It will show 1080i pictures perfectly fine as well (and BETTER than 720P ones), but the picture in either case isn't likely to be much different to SD. It's not something that's worth spending much money on.

I've installed HD on a LOT of different sets, and all older plasma's barely benefited at all - the absolute worst were hugely expensive Pioneeer ones.

bobcar · 18-04-2011, 11:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nigel Goodwin

It will show 1080i pictures perfectly fine as well (and BETTER than 720P ones), but the picture in either case isn't likely to be much different to SD. It's not something that's worth spending much money on.

I've installed HD on a LOT of different sets, and all older plasma's barely benefited at all - the absolute worst were hugely expensive Pioneeer ones.

Yes but how old is his plasma? I have a 3 year old 50" HD ready Panny plasma (1366x768) and HD is a huge improvement over SD.

Okay a lot of that is the extra bandwidth of the transmitted HD signal though that applies to full HD TVs as well but Blu-ray is still a big improvement over DVD. Even on an SD set getting the HD channel can be much better than the SD one.

I would suggest that your comment needs to be qualified depending on the model as well as viewing distance. Perhaps BP could give us the make and model of his plasma?

BeethovensPiano · 18-04-2011, 12:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by bobcar

I would suggest that your comment needs to be qualified depending on the model as well as viewing distance. Perhaps BP could give us the make and model of his plasma?

It's a 42" Samsung PS42B450B Plasma - about 2 and a half years old. With a good quality Freeview source - the SD picture is actually very nice - much better than I was expecting it to be when they first got it.

hardylane · 18-04-2011, 16:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nigel Goodwin

It will show 1080i pictures perfectly fine as well (and BETTER than 720P ones), but the picture in either case isn't likely to be much different to SD. It's not something that's worth spending much money on.

Yes it is.

720p (1080i) is infinitely better than grotty 576i, on ANY set, in ANY weather!

Unless of course you have an LCD or plasma which is NOT HD (ie. ancient)

My mate's 4 year old 50" Pioneer screen looks stunning with BluRays, BTW

Where DO people get this nonsense from?

Aaron_Scotland · 18-04-2011, 17:22

I have a Freeview HD box plugged into a similar monitor with 1024x768 res and HD is very noticable vs SD.

So yes you will see a big difference.

It's not as good as my 50 inch 1080p TV but I wouldn't dare go back to SD on it.

Quote:

It will show 1080i pictures perfectly fine as well (and BETTER than 720P ones), but the picture in either case isn't likely to be much different to SD. It's not something that's worth spending much money on.

Mine didn't, Tried it and the tv was out of range, Had to hard reset the box and get it to output 720p to get a picture but that is still vastly better than SD.

Nigel Goodwin · 18-04-2011, 18:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aaron_Scotland

Mine didn't, Tried it and the tv was out of range, Had to hard reset the box and get it to output 720p to get a picture but that is still vastly better than SD.

Your TV isn't HD Ready then, accepting 1080i is one of the main requirements to meet the HD ready spec.

Aaron_Scotland · 18-04-2011, 18:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nigel Goodwin

Your TV isn't HD Ready then, accepting 1080i is one of the main requirements to meet the HD ready spec.

No I know it's not, It's a monitor in my office with DVI in. I just assumed when the OP said 1024x768 that was the maximum res but your right it does appear it's HD Ready so should do 1080i.

captainkremmen · 18-04-2011, 19:16

I have a 50 inch Plasma that is HD Ready, with my Freeview HD recorder set to output 1080i and the difference in picture quality between SD and HD is VERY noticeable. As is the difference between a BluRay and a DVD from the PS3 and a DVD player.

Take something like the opening credits to Holby City. Switch between BBC1 and BBC1 HD and there is a very stark difference in my opinion.

Of course it depends on how you've set the TV up, viewing distance etc.

gemma-the-husky · 18-04-2011, 22:36

I have a Hitachi Plasma, which is 1024 x 1024, and I find the SD picture stunningly good.

HD broadcasts look hardly different at all.

pocatello · 19-04-2011, 01:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by BeethovensPiano

Hmmm that's disappointing. Didnt realise Plasma was no good for HD.

Not true at all, it depends on the plasma, some of the best high end 3d displays are plasma. They have come a long long way since they first came out. That native resolution is low end though, 720p, slightly lower actually. Modern plasma is 1080p. So even if that set is a few years old, it was probably a low end set when it came out.

Furthermore it is 42", kind of small.

That being said, dvd and regular sd is 480p, not 720p. Will you get a better image with HD? Yes, will it be as good as a 1080p plasma? No. Can you see the improvement? It will be a bit sharper, but viewing distance/resolution/small size of screen will take a toll. Even 720p is ~3x resolution of sd.

As for the guy above me, I have a true 1920x1080 1080p plasma, and the difference between 1080p and sd is night and day. Tends to be older screens that have the odd native resolutions, and their image quality might be lower to begin with. But I have seen a 720p low end panasonic 50" 1024x768 before, and while the resolution does seem crude, when you stand back 8 feet it did look pretty decent in HD, but if you walked up to it you could see the pixel structure.

Chris Frost · 19-04-2011, 01:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by gemma-the-husky

I have a Hitachi Plasma, which is 1024 x 1024, and I find the SD picture stunningly good.

HD broadcasts look hardly different at all.

What you've got is an ALiS panel and it's an odd set up on those. It's one of the few panels that's natively interlaced. In 'P' terms it is 1024x512.

pocatello · 19-04-2011, 01:43

Ah yea that was before I got into plasma, so I'm guessing 2006~ model. Interesting bit of technological oddity guess, something they did because of the limitations of the technology of the day. 1024x1080 is a weird resolution, it doesn't meet 720p resolution in one direction,and it doesn't meet 1080p's resolution in the other, and the native interlacing means it gets worse from there. Before interlacing it has to do some scaling even, gaining even more fun artifacts. I guess the reason he doesn't see much difference is just that, it was a display from when the tv's were just not quite fully baked technology yet...atleast at a reasonable price. For what those things cost you could get a top of the line display today.

Plus they were selling those to people without HD sources in the uk for the most part. So yea not a good screen to compare HD for today. In the last few years plasma has jumped way ahead with resolution/power consumption and price.

grahamlthompson · 19-04-2011, 08:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by pocatello

That being said, dvd and regular sd is 480p, not 720p. Will you get a better image with HD? Yes, will it be as good as a 1080p plasma?.

In PAL areas DVD and SD is 576i/p (normally 720 x 576 at 25fps - horizontal res of 544 or 704 is also used for digital broadcasts). Only NTSC country based sources are 480i/p (720 x 480 at 29.97fps)

noise747 · 19-04-2011, 09:43

My three and a half year old 42 inch Philips plasma is full HD, Blu-ray looks great on it. A friend of mine who got the same T.V have Freesat, I am not so impressed by the HD from that. I think that is down to the so called HD BBc broadcasts

BeethovensPiano · 19-04-2011, 09:59

Hmmm still confused.

pocatello · 19-04-2011, 10:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by grahamlthompson

In PAL areas DVD and SD is 576i/p (normally 720 x 576 at 25fps - horizontal res of 544 or 704 is also used for digital broadcasts). Only NTSC country based sources are 480i/p (720 x 480 at 29.97fps)

Yes I know but the difference between pal and ntsc is the difference between a turd and a slightly shiner turd.

Compared to HD the difference is so insignificant that it doesn't matter.

chrisjr · 19-04-2011, 10:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by BeethovensPiano

Hmmm still confused.

I have a totally 100% guaranteed solution to your dilemma.

Switch off your PC.
Switch on your telly.
Select an HD source.
Watch the telly.

The only way you are going to know for certain if HD makes any difference to your eyes on your telly is to try it. You are the one who is going to have to sit in front of it all day long so only you can really say if it is worth bothering with.

Chris Frost · 19-04-2011, 10:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nigel Goodwin

If you're buying a new Freeview box anyway, then it probably makes sense to get an HD one though

^^^ This is probably the most sensible advice

They say beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I think that's equally true with TV pictures. You'll get a variety of recommendations depending on each persons personal experiences and preferred technology.

FWIW, my own view is that SD can look anything from pants e.g. Freeview high compression channels on LCD - to excellent....say from a well mastered DVD on a decent plasma.

A correctly adjusted reasonable quality TV, whether SD, HD Ready or Full HD, should be able to let you see the difference between a good source and a bad one. Giving the TV a better source such as a HD should result in a better picture. Whether it's a night-and-day difference then depends on the TV technology and how well it is set up.

In the end all you can do is suck it and see. Good luck

18-04-2011, 07:04	#1
BeethovensPiano Inactive Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: ♫ At The Keyboard ♫ Posts: 11,556	Freeview HD - 1024x768 My parents have a 42" Plasma with a screen res of 1024x768. Now we can get Freeview HD would it make much difference on a TV of this Resolution?

18-04-2011, 08:43	#2
Nigel Goodwin Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: North Derbyshire Posts: 41,789	Quote: Originally Posted by BeethovensPiano My parents have a 42" Plasma with a screen res of 1024x768. Now we can get Freeview HD would it make much difference on a TV of this Resolution? Not much on an HD Ready Plasma, they aren't very good on HD - I tried Sky HD on my 42 Plasma (just because I could), and I didn't consider it a worthwhile improvement, even though I had access to more than one free HD box. If you're buying a new Freeview box anyway, then it probably makes sense to get an HD one though - it's likely to be more future proof. Just don't expect to go 'wow' at the HD pictures as you would on an HD ready LCD.

18-04-2011, 08:55	#3
BeethovensPiano Inactive Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: ♫ At The Keyboard ♫ Posts: 11,556	Hmmm that's disappointing. Didnt realise Plasma was no good for HD.

18-04-2011, 09:08	#4
ArcticFox Forum Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 314	Plasma is good for HD there are lots of 1080p plasmas about, just not that plasma.

18-04-2011, 09:14	#5
BeethovensPiano Inactive Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: ♫ At The Keyboard ♫ Posts: 11,556	So you think it would be a waste of time getting a Freeview HD box - with no discernable difference between SD Feeview?

18-04-2011, 09:20	#6
hardylane Forum Member Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Manchester Posts: 2,945	This is subjective and a bit misleading. The screen will show 720p images perfectly fine, which is a major improvement over 576. I have an older screen in my bedroom that does this and I'm happy with the 720p image it resolves. 1080p would be better, but I can't afford to replace.

18-04-2011, 10:16	#7
Nigel Goodwin Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: North Derbyshire Posts: 41,789	Quote: Originally Posted by BeethovensPiano So you think it would be a waste of time getting a Freeview HD box - with no discernable difference between SD Feeview? If you're buying a new box specifically to get HD, then I would say don't bother - but if you're buying a box to convert the set to Freeview, as I said before it's worth getting HD as it's more future proof.

18-04-2011, 10:19	#8
Nigel Goodwin Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: North Derbyshire Posts: 41,789	Quote: Originally Posted by hardylane This is subjective and a bit misleading. The screen will show 720p images perfectly fine, which is a major improvement over 576. It will show 1080i pictures perfectly fine as well (and BETTER than 720P ones), but the picture in either case isn't likely to be much different to SD. It's not something that's worth spending much money on. I've installed HD on a LOT of different sets, and all older plasma's barely benefited at all - the absolute worst were hugely expensive Pioneeer ones.

18-04-2011, 11:58	#9
bobcar Forum Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 14,718	Quote: Originally Posted by Nigel Goodwin It will show 1080i pictures perfectly fine as well (and BETTER than 720P ones), but the picture in either case isn't likely to be much different to SD. It's not something that's worth spending much money on. I've installed HD on a LOT of different sets, and all older plasma's barely benefited at all - the absolute worst were hugely expensive Pioneeer ones. Yes but how old is his plasma? I have a 3 year old 50" HD ready Panny plasma (1366x768) and HD is a huge improvement over SD. Okay a lot of that is the extra bandwidth of the transmitted HD signal though that applies to full HD TVs as well but Blu-ray is still a big improvement over DVD. Even on an SD set getting the HD channel can be much better than the SD one. I would suggest that your comment needs to be qualified depending on the model as well as viewing distance. Perhaps BP could give us the make and model of his plasma?

18-04-2011, 12:10	#10
BeethovensPiano Inactive Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: ♫ At The Keyboard ♫ Posts: 11,556	Quote: Originally Posted by bobcar I would suggest that your comment needs to be qualified depending on the model as well as viewing distance. Perhaps BP could give us the make and model of his plasma? It's a 42" Samsung PS42B450B Plasma - about 2 and a half years old. With a good quality Freeview source - the SD picture is actually very nice - much better than I was expecting it to be when they first got it.

18-04-2011, 16:59	#11
hardylane Forum Member Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Manchester Posts: 2,945	Quote: Originally Posted by Nigel Goodwin It will show 1080i pictures perfectly fine as well (and BETTER than 720P ones), but the picture in either case isn't likely to be much different to SD. It's not something that's worth spending much money on. Yes it is. 720p (1080i) is infinitely better than grotty 576i, on ANY set, in ANY weather! Unless of course you have an LCD or plasma which is NOT HD (ie. ancient) My mate's 4 year old 50" Pioneer screen looks stunning with BluRays, BTW Where DO people get this nonsense from?

18-04-2011, 17:22	#12
Aaron_Scotland Forum Member Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Scotland Posts: 8,330	I have a Freeview HD box plugged into a similar monitor with 1024x768 res and HD is very noticable vs SD. So yes you will see a big difference. It's not as good as my 50 inch 1080p TV but I wouldn't dare go back to SD on it. Quote: It will show 1080i pictures perfectly fine as well (and BETTER than 720P ones), but the picture in either case isn't likely to be much different to SD. It's not something that's worth spending much money on. Mine didn't, Tried it and the tv was out of range, Had to hard reset the box and get it to output 720p to get a picture but that is still vastly better than SD.

18-04-2011, 18:05	#13
Nigel Goodwin Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: North Derbyshire Posts: 41,789	Quote: Originally Posted by Aaron_Scotland Mine didn't, Tried it and the tv was out of range, Had to hard reset the box and get it to output 720p to get a picture but that is still vastly better than SD. Your TV isn't HD Ready then, accepting 1080i is one of the main requirements to meet the HD ready spec.

18-04-2011, 18:22	#14
Aaron_Scotland Forum Member Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Scotland Posts: 8,330	Quote: Originally Posted by Nigel Goodwin Your TV isn't HD Ready then, accepting 1080i is one of the main requirements to meet the HD ready spec. No I know it's not, It's a monitor in my office with DVI in. I just assumed when the OP said 1024x768 that was the maximum res but your right it does appear it's HD Ready so should do 1080i.

18-04-2011, 19:16	#15
captainkremmen Forum Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: DAVEVILLE, Daveshire DA1 1VE Posts: 33,621	I have a 50 inch Plasma that is HD Ready, with my Freeview HD recorder set to output 1080i and the difference in picture quality between SD and HD is VERY noticeable. As is the difference between a BluRay and a DVD from the PS3 and a DVD player. Take something like the opening credits to Holby City. Switch between BBC1 and BBC1 HD and there is a very stark difference in my opinion. Of course it depends on how you've set the TV up, viewing distance etc.

18-04-2011, 22:36	#16
gemma-the-husky Forum Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: UK Posts: 17,858	I have a Hitachi Plasma, which is 1024 x 1024, and I find the SD picture stunningly good. HD broadcasts look hardly different at all.

19-04-2011, 01:13	#17
pocatello Inactive Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 8,622	Quote: Originally Posted by BeethovensPiano Hmmm that's disappointing. Didnt realise Plasma was no good for HD. Not true at all, it depends on the plasma, some of the best high end 3d displays are plasma. They have come a long long way since they first came out. That native resolution is low end though, 720p, slightly lower actually. Modern plasma is 1080p. So even if that set is a few years old, it was probably a low end set when it came out. Furthermore it is 42", kind of small. That being said, dvd and regular sd is 480p, not 720p. Will you get a better image with HD? Yes, will it be as good as a 1080p plasma? No. Can you see the improvement? It will be a bit sharper, but viewing distance/resolution/small size of screen will take a toll. Even 720p is ~3x resolution of sd. As for the guy above me, I have a true 1920x1080 1080p plasma, and the difference between 1080p and sd is night and day. Tends to be older screens that have the odd native resolutions, and their image quality might be lower to begin with. But I have seen a 720p low end panasonic 50" 1024x768 before, and while the resolution does seem crude, when you stand back 8 feet it did look pretty decent in HD, but if you walked up to it you could see the pixel structure.

19-04-2011, 01:30	#18
Chris Frost Forum Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Cheshire Posts: 6,462	Quote: Originally Posted by gemma-the-husky I have a Hitachi Plasma, which is 1024 x 1024, and I find the SD picture stunningly good. HD broadcasts look hardly different at all. What you've got is an ALiS panel and it's an odd set up on those. It's one of the few panels that's natively interlaced. In 'P' terms it is 1024x512.

19-04-2011, 01:43	#19
pocatello Inactive Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 8,622	Ah yea that was before I got into plasma, so I'm guessing 2006~ model. Interesting bit of technological oddity guess, something they did because of the limitations of the technology of the day. 1024x1080 is a weird resolution, it doesn't meet 720p resolution in one direction,and it doesn't meet 1080p's resolution in the other, and the native interlacing means it gets worse from there. Before interlacing it has to do some scaling even, gaining even more fun artifacts. I guess the reason he doesn't see much difference is just that, it was a display from when the tv's were just not quite fully baked technology yet...atleast at a reasonable price. For what those things cost you could get a top of the line display today. Plus they were selling those to people without HD sources in the uk for the most part. So yea not a good screen to compare HD for today. In the last few years plasma has jumped way ahead with resolution/power consumption and price.

19-04-2011, 08:41	#20
grahamlthompson Forum Member Join Date: May 2005 Location: Redditch Worcs Posts: 17,293	Quote: Originally Posted by pocatello That being said, dvd and regular sd is 480p, not 720p. Will you get a better image with HD? Yes, will it be as good as a 1080p plasma?. In PAL areas DVD and SD is 576i/p (normally 720 x 576 at 25fps - horizontal res of 544 or 704 is also used for digital broadcasts). Only NTSC country based sources are 480i/p (720 x 480 at 29.97fps)

19-04-2011, 09:43	#21
noise747 Forum Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Herefordshire Posts: 22,810	My three and a half year old 42 inch Philips plasma is full HD, Blu-ray looks great on it. A friend of mine who got the same T.V have Freesat, I am not so impressed by the HD from that. I think that is down to the so called HD BBc broadcasts

DS Forums

Freeview HD - 1024x768

19-04-2011, 09:59	#22
BeethovensPiano Inactive Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: ♫ At The Keyboard ♫ Posts: 11,556	Hmmm still confused.

19-04-2011, 10:15	#23
pocatello Inactive Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 8,622	Quote: Originally Posted by grahamlthompson In PAL areas DVD and SD is 576i/p (normally 720 x 576 at 25fps - horizontal res of 544 or 704 is also used for digital broadcasts). Only NTSC country based sources are 480i/p (720 x 480 at 29.97fps) Yes I know but the difference between pal and ntsc is the difference between a turd and a slightly shiner turd. Compared to HD the difference is so insignificant that it doesn't matter.

19-04-2011, 10:38	#24
chrisjr Forum Member Join Date: May 2004 Location: Reading Posts: 27,916	Quote: Originally Posted by BeethovensPiano Hmmm still confused. I have a totally 100% guaranteed solution to your dilemma. Switch off your PC. Switch on your telly. Select an HD source. Watch the telly. The only way you are going to know for certain if HD makes any difference to your eyes on your telly is to try it. You are the one who is going to have to sit in front of it all day long so only you can really say if it is worth bothering with.

19-04-2011, 10:46	#25
Chris Frost Forum Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Cheshire Posts: 6,462	Quote: Originally Posted by Nigel Goodwin If you're buying a new Freeview box anyway, then it probably makes sense to get an HD one though ^^^ This is probably the most sensible advice They say beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I think that's equally true with TV pictures. You'll get a variety of recommendations depending on each persons personal experiences and preferred technology. FWIW, my own view is that SD can look anything from pants e.g. Freeview high compression channels on LCD - to excellent....say from a well mastered DVD on a decent plasma. A correctly adjusted reasonable quality TV, whether SD, HD Ready or Full HD, should be able to let you see the difference between a good source and a bad one. Giving the TV a better source such as a HD should result in a better picture. Whether it's a night-and-day difference then depends on the TV technology and how well it is set up. In the end all you can do is suck it and see. Good luck