[Nu-Nu Who]

Hullo Digital Spy Forums of the Who Kind!!
I'm from planet 'not around here' so I'm kinda learning the ropes, so forgive me if I make any glaring mistakes!
Anyways, I just re-watched both episodes of the beginning of Series Six and I felt I was left a little... cold, specifically of one aspect: who River Song is!
The thing about who she is has been going on for some time now, and it seems we have a definitive answer... my only problem with it is that it seemed TOO obvious. I mean, didn't everybody guess who she was ages ago? Or was that only me?
Regardless, my point is this:
Are we DEFINITELY sure that RIver is

Spoiler

The Doctor's Wife?

Because at this point in time, and with all evidence we have, this appears to be the only outcome...

Many thanks one and all!!

[englishmuffin]

I think the snog this episode absolutely clinched that theory.

There was still some slight chance that they were blood-related, mother, sister whatever, even with the flirting, but lets be honest, anything but his wife/lover would just be nothing short of creepy now.

I know what you mean though, it does seem too obvious for Moffat. And I think he wants us to think it's River in the spacesuit, it's too easy for him. I mean look at all his tricks and and turns, after this setup, if it is River in that spacesuit I'll probably be a little disappointed. Unless, of course, there's a twist of some sort.

[CheeseyDude1337]

No, we are not. There are some people saying she will shoot him.

Welcome to DS.

Just because she kissed him doesn't mean she is his wife. Judas kissed Jesus, didn't he?

[DoctorQui]

I think the whole mystery has shifted now!

Its no longer, "who is she", more, "Is she the girl"?

You're right about the kiss, can only be his significant other really, any other possibility is just icky!

[Pretinama]

I don't think that's really a spoiler. It's speculation. But who knows, she could be his wife (it's been suggested since we saw her in her first episode in the library) or she could be someone else. I wonder is it a little too obvious but then it could simply be hidden in plain sight!

[wizzywick]

Originally Posted by englishmuffin

I think the snog this episode absolutely clinched that theory.

There was still some slight chance that they were blood-related, mother, sister whatever, even with the flirting, but lets be honest, anything but his wife/lover would just be nothing short of creepy now.

I know what you mean though, it does seem too obvious for Moffat. And I think he wants us to think it's River in the spacesuit, it's too easy for him. I mean look at all his tricks and and turns, after this setup, if it is River in that spacesuit I'll probably be a little disappointed. Unless, of course, there's a twist of some sort.

Don't worry, there are some twists and turns.

My theory about who's in the spacesuit is

Spoiler

The Doctor himself and the Doctor that died was infact the Doctor regenerated from the little girl.

But if you don't, genuinely don't want to know who River is, then don't click onto the spoiler below:

Spoiler

River WAS married to the Doctor but he doesn't ever recall it. But the main twist is that River is the daughter of Amy.

[DrParadox]

wizzywick, I've seen your theory on a few threads and I like it! I think it may turn out to be some form of this, but I don't believe that our real doctor would EVER shoot someone- it just goes against his character. If your theory is anywhere close to what Moffat has planned, I'm pretty sure it would be someone else in the spacesuit.

[Gogfumble]

We can't be sure of anything till it happens on screen. And even then, it's not really set in stone.

[wizzywick]

Originally Posted by DrParadox

wizzywick, I've seen your theory on a few threads and I like it! I think it may turn out to be some form of this, but I don't believe that our real doctor would EVER shoot someone- it just goes against his character. If your theory is anywhere close to what Moffat has planned, I'm pretty sure it would be someone else in the spacesuit.

If only we could truly understand Moffats mind! He has an avenue of oddness lurking in his head that drives people to come up with relentless, bizarre theories in order to search for the truth! Perhaps you're right, it probably will be someone else in the spacesuit, maybe by some kind of timey wimey miracle, the person in the spacesuit was a young Canton Dellaware just carrying out instruction from the "Doctor" that isn't the Doctor! OH!!! My head hurts with all this thinking!

[grizzlyvamp]

Originally Posted by Gogfumble

We can't be sure of anything till it happens on screen. And even then, it's not really set in stone.

Oh no. River's life is set in stone, she isn't one of the Doctor's temporal tipping points - everything she experiences has to have happened as we see it. It would create a paradox if they were to deviate. So in other words once something has been aired about her that is what happens full stop - no changing it. That is one of the big major rules - once the TARDIS has landed it cannot return to that point in time in that area without the risk of ripping a hole in the universe and getting a Father's day scenario.

[browsing03]

Just re-watching The Impossible Astronaut and when River is shooting at the astronaut after the Doctor's been killed, she misses each time and once she's run out of bullets she says "of course."
What does she mean by that?! Am I missing something really obvious or could there be more to this?

[wizzywick]

Originally Posted by browsing03

Just re-watching The Impossible Astronaut and when River is shooting at the astronaut after the Doctor's been killed, she misses each time and once she's run out of bullets she says "of course."
What does she mean by that?! Am I missing something really obvious or could there be more to this?

OMG!!! I remember that too! I knew I hadn't imagined it. Was she missing deliberately? Who was she saying "Of course" too? Oh more stuff to think about!

[KezM]

Is River is the Doctors wife - I wonder if we will get to see the actual ceremony (whatever form it takes)?

[Gogfumble]

Originally Posted by grizzlyvamp

Oh no. River's life is set in stone, she isn't one of the Doctor's temporal tipping points - everything she experiences has to have happened as we see it. It would create a paradox if they were to deviate. So in other words once something has been aired about her that is what happens full stop - no changing it. That is one of the big major rules - once the TARDIS has landed it cannot return to that point in time in that area without the risk of ripping a hole in the universe and getting a Father's day scenario.

The op asked if we were sure River is the Doctors wife. To which I said we can't be sure about anything till it happens. River being the doctors wife is just speculation.

I wasn't meaning all that stuff you came out with.

[Pootmatoot]

She might be the Dr's wife. And also not the Dr's wife. Just like Amy is pregnant and not pregnant.

I think we have two separate timelines, messily jamming themselves together.

[DSDP]

Originally Posted by CheeseyDude1337

Just because she kissed him doesn't mean she is his wife. Judas kissed Jesus, didn't he?

he didn't throw in a free tonsilitis check though.

[Butterflyy]

If she's anything blood-related then the show will just be pure wrong! I hope she's his wife I really do!

[neel]

Originally Posted by browsing03

Just re-watching The Impossible Astronaut and when River is shooting at the astronaut after the Doctor's been killed, she misses each time and once she's run out of bullets she says "of course."
What does she mean by that?! Am I missing something really obvious or could there be more to this?

Well one spin on that would be that if we assume the girl in the spacesuit IS a young river then a sort of sideways slant on the grandfather paradox would mean the laws of space and time wouldn't allow her self to shoot her younger self.

Or else she wouldn't exist to shoot herself.

Certainly, from what we saw her do to the silents at the end of the last episode, she isn't that bad a shot!

[DrParadox]

Originally Posted by neel

Well one spin on that would be that if we assume the girl in the spacesuit IS a young river then a sort of sideways slant on the grandfather paradox would mean the laws of space and time wouldn't allow her self to shoot her younger self.

Or else she wouldn't exist to shoot herself.

Certainly, from what we saw her do to the silents at the end of the last episode, she isn't that bad a shot!

She doesn't necessarily need to BE the girl in order to create a paradox by killing her. We know that the doctor's future is River's past, so it's possible that River (in her timeline) has simply seen a future version of the girl before. Which would obviously still mean she can't kill her...

[tim128]

Originally Posted by browsing03

Just re-watching The Impossible Astronaut and when River is shooting at the astronaut after the Doctor's been killed, she misses each time and once she's run out of bullets she says "of course."
What does she mean by that?! Am I missing something really obvious or could there be more to this?

I'm not sure she misses deliberatly, but the line 'Of Course' is definatly saying something. I think she realises something at that point about who is in the suit or what the suit is, and why her bullets missed. Some time paradox making hitting the suit impossible? Another possibility is the suit later in Ep 2 repairs itself and starts moving. So is it an empty suit, programmed by the Doctor himself, and therefore River realises despite hitting it the bullets just go right through?

I like an earlier post suggeting it is going back to the TARDIS under the lake!

[Talma]

Originally Posted by wizzywick

OMG!!! I remember that too! I knew I hadn't imagined it. Was she missing deliberately? Who was she saying "Of course" too? Oh more stuff to think about!

I think it was 'of course not' which is when she seems to realise why she couldn't kill whoever was it the spacesuit.

Originally Posted by Pootmatoot

She might be the Dr's wife. And also not the Dr's wife. Just like Amy is pregnant and not pregnant.

I think we have two separate timelines, messily jamming themselves together.

Well Moffat started it bringing the 'older' Doctor into it! I'm beginning to think this now, that there's a point when they can all follow one timestream or another, and whichever one they follow negates the other, like in Amy's Choice only on a massive scale.
I'm still concerned about how River knows Old High Gallifreyan and the Doctor's name and how to pilot the TARDIS better than the Doctor (I know she says she was taught), which I don't think is anything anyone but a Timelord could know (if then)?

[Nu-Nu Who]

I'd just like to thank everyone for their input into this matter, and there have been some pretty good ideas thrown around that I hadn't seen yet!!

I do now think that the answer to who River is has been well and truly set in stone, as there does indeed appear to be no other possibility than that she IS his wife! Anything else really would be very strange, given the snog that took place in "Day of The Moon"

I think the question Moffat has now given us is whether River has anything to do with either the Astronaut or the little girl, which we simply do not have the evidence as of now to make a determined answer!
Either way, I'm still a bit miffed that the BIG REVEAL of who River was... I really was expecting more out of the Moff than just "Yeah it definitely is his wife, just so you know for SURE"... or perhaps there really is something else EXTREMELY clever that she could be?

[alphonsus]

Originally Posted by DSDP

he didn't throw in a free tonsilitis check though.