Is it just me or is anyone else getting fed up with doctor who at the minute?
A married couple showing their love and the is she isn't she tale of pregnancy (not to mention the fast becoming tedious river song story line!) seems to be pushing the programme more into soap territory than sci fi!
Remember when the show was about the doctor fighting mad aliens!!
Rant over!

Wow, people really do forget seeing the Silence!

...and apparently have forgotten the entire run of the RTD era which featured these so-called "soap" elements. It's scary how contagious silent-litis is!

Was nowhere near as bad in the RTD era as it is now!
Point taken on the silents though!
As I said, maybe it's just me!)

Really? From what I've read, a lot of RTD episodes focused on family life. Wasn't one of the companions in love with ten? I could be wrong, I'm only reading things on here regarding previous series.

So far this series, we've had The Silence and The Siren. One mention of the possible pregnancy in the latest episode (Not even dialogue only visually) and no mention of River Song. A married couple are going to feel love for each other, if it wasn't addressed from time to time then the writer's would be accused of not focusing on it enough and complaining that there was no point in them being married if they aren't even going to mention it.

So personally, I don't think there is anything "soap" like about it.

Nowhere near as bad!!!!!!!! Are you raving mad!!!!!!??????? RTD practically turned it into a soap! Mickey and Rose very soapish storyline. Constantly bring back old companions with ever lamer excuses for doing so!!!!!!!!!!!!!! In fact their was so much cheese in some of those episodes. Particularly in series 2 there was a lot of cheesy, girny smiles. Take 2 of my favourite episodes - the beast episodes when we first met the Ood, the crew were sometimes way too cheerful for a group of people stranded on a planet orbiting a black hole which if the power source keeping the planet in orbit! The whole Cybermen vs Daleks battle - or handbags at dawn as my Dad calls it. There was just so many elements you would associate with soaps.

Granted the Amy and Rory relationship is borderline soapish but there is a lot to it. The show always had its more soapy moments from what I can tell but RTD just took the whole crate and shuffed as much in as he could (pun intended I'm afraid). If you actually look at the what you might call soap moments RTD trumps Moffat. Moffat has steared away from that far more than RTD ever did. In fact I quite like the Amy/Rory dynamic - you get some depth to the stories (albeit I'm no big fan of Amy but there you go).

Rant over

Nah, 10 and Rose making doe eyes at each other, Micky and Rose's rocky relationship, Jackie and Pete, Martha getting engaged to a doctor and then getting married to Micky, 10's relationships with Madame du Pompadour and Joan Redfern, all the family dynamics of the Tylers, the Jones and the Nobles.... And many more instances quite likely....

None of that was at all soap like and didn't at all take away from the show just being about "the doctor fighting mad aliens!!".

cobblers.

So another RTD versus Moffat thread, great. Can we not agree that they are both great in some aspects, and not so great in others. At the end of the day, they are pretty similar. They brought Doctor Who back!!

Much as I love the RTD Era, I agree with both these statements. Doctor Who became as close to a soap as it ever did during his time. SM has reduced the soap elements of the show which is a good thing. Much as I liked the family stuff, it got a bit much after a while.

in fairness, thats not what it's about, the OP is trying to claim that RTD didn't use soap elements to the same degree as Moffat in his stories, and is just being corrected, quite rightly, on this front.

How can you agree with both those statements when they are saying the exact opposite?

Great post! May I just add that Eastenders, Corrie and Emmerdale are soaps! Doctor Who is a superior family adventure sci-fi fantasy adventure series with some advanced and well written characterisation of its cast!

Not in any way the same thing, regardless of writer!

No. Not another RTD vs Moffat. Merely a there was more soap material in RTD's era than Moffat's thread. Not the same thing. Why is it people are determined to try and find apples in pears? In other words why are people looking for things that aren't really there if they acctually read the thread properly. I'm sorry if that offends someone but a matter of context needs to be applied here. :/

I think we're each entitled to our opinions. While I don't mind the soapish elements, I can certainly understand those who prefer that they not appear in DW.

Rightly or wrongly, I think RTD used those elements as a means to expand the viewer base of DW. And, from what I can tell, it's worked. Also, viewing patterns are likely different now than they were before the reboot. In order to keep viewers' attention and stop them from moving on to the next thing (and there are plenty of "next things"), DW was given some soapy elements.

As I said, it doesn't bother me, but I can see how it might bother some others.

Actually the OP didn't mention RTD at all, but asked about when Doctor Who was just about the aliens (could be referring to classic Who). Maybe I missed something though.

For the record, I don't agree with the OP, I don't think there are Soap elements in Moffat's Who at all, but I didn't really think there were Soap elements in RTD's era either (but I agree there were more in RTD's era than in Moffat's).

I think you almost have to have "soapy" like elements in order to develop the characters for a long running serial.

One can get away with 2 dimensional characters in a 2 hour movie, but for serial as long running and popular as Doctor Who you have to add some degree of emotional depth for the audience to relate to the characters and keep tuning in week after week.

There were some "soapy" elements in the classic series, they were just not as pronounced as the target audience was much younger, but just enough for us to care about the Doctor and his companions, added to the fact the writing was more along the lines of each story wrapping up at the end with no real arc to other stories (with exceptions of course).

I see the new series written on more levels than the classic series. On one hand , one could just watch it on the level of an adventure story with monsters and our hero and friends and completely ignore to "soapy" parts of it. Most younger children will probably watch it that way and not lose anything. Older children and adults will appreciate the extra depth of the emotional connections and mystery of the story arcs.

I believe both Moffat and RTD are/did an excellent job of appealing to a wide audience instead of focusing on one group, at the same time allowing the story line to be understood on all the levels without any one level of audience feeling they are missing out on something by not focusing on a deeper level.

The soap element came in 2005. in the classic series the doctor didn't cry, fall in love, had a concept of christmas. Saying that I understand why the show had to chance for a new audience who need to be convinced by character and story. In then 60's and 70's we were impressed by a disappearing blue box and a paper mache monster. The "I'll explain later" get out doesn't work now because has we read on these forums everything must be explained and make sense. There is little suspension of disbelief. Shame really because it can't be that innocent anymore, If the doctor doesn't react in an expected way fans want to know why? eg: Not peforming CPR on Rory

When William Hartnell tried to stove in a cavemans head with a rock even though he was stopped. it didn't make him less of an hero and didn't have to be explained or justified fully. couldn't do that now. It has to have a touch of likelyness to it, just because fans born return of the Jedi need more convincing. sex and death

I'd love some Doctor Who soap. It would match my dalek shaped sponge

Or an Elton Pope on a rope

Actually I like this explanation and agree with it.


I have Dalek soap. Does this count.

i want it lol

Woaaahhhh, you will never get it. It will be exterminated soon (on my body).

To be fair the OP wasn't the first person to bring RTD into this thread, that happened in post 3.....

Ok, fair enough I accept I'm defo in the minority on this, some good points made!
Maybe it's the characters in this run as it never bothered me before & while Matt Smith is very good I can't say I'm a huge Amy fan & can't see the point of Rory (though not sure how many times you can kill the same character without it turning into Dallas!)

you know you're right.... two mysterious charcters meeting in the wrong order? thats so eastenders....