And could possibly explain "half-human, on my mother's side" - discounting the "and half-Auton, sort of, and part time vortex wibbly wobbly thing" which obviously he just didn't bother to say to Grace

Nope, having just rewatched it, the Doctor and River are looking into the Cot, not at the writing on the side, that's what Amy and Rory are assuming they are talking about from their viewpoint, as they can't see the cloth from where they are standing.

Lot of people getting way to complicated about this!!!

are you suggesting that the story line isn't complicated?

Why would the Doctor ask Amy's child "how do I look?". If all he saw was the material inside the cot, then all he knows is that River Song is Melody.

I think it is more complicated.

It was a cheeky bit of misdirection by the writer/director.

The Doctor asks who she is, she says "I am. Can't you read?" and guestures downwards. The Doctor looks down and sees the leaf, it's not been translated by the TARDIS yet but it doesn't need to be because the Doctor speaks (and probably reads) all languages. This had been demonstrated earlier in the episode and highlighted by his talking baby and then clearly stating that he speaks all languages.

Amy sees this exchange and assumes River is talking about the "writing" on the side of the cot. The camera view follws her point of view to the symbols and so the viewer has no option but to make that same assumption. Had it used a wide screen shot from above we would have seen what the Doctor and River were really looking at.

When Amy and River then talk (at gunpoint), River talks about translating writing and again Amy (and the viewer) assume she is waiting for the symbols to translate. River points out they won't translate, but that that's not what she was talking about anyway as she meant the prayer leaf (this last bit isn't clearly spelled out but I thought it was understandable).

Amy, and the misguided viewer, then realise their mistake.


[I would say it was similar to the Psycho film. We the viewer hear Norman talking to his mum and we see his mum's shadow sitting in the window. Only later do we realise that we were fooled. If the director had chosen to show Norman talking to himself dressed in his mother's clothes at that point it would have ruined the reveal.]

You're focussing on what was looked at & ignoring all the other dialogue/evidence. What the Dr says and how he behaves (like a child) is pertinent I think.

Assume they were looking in the cot. When River pulls out the material, it's crumpled and she has to flatten it out before she can read any writing. Even if it was flat in the cot, it would only have shown "River" or "Song". The Doctor wasn't told what was written on the cloth - only Amy was told.

Camera misdirection seems a little too subtle...

and you're ignoring the small matter of incest...

See, I just assumed that when the Doctor dug out the crib he wrote Melody's name on the side. It wasn't until he thought about it and looked at what he himself had written that he realized the connection.

But then again, I still think that Rory is a nurse and that Jenny regenerated because she's a timelord. Occam's Razor and all that.

Or you are focussing on everything else and ignoring the dialogue


Umm, no it isn't and no she wasn't.

If you can access the Iplayer then watch from 46.47 onwards. When River reaches in to the cot the leaf is perfectly, clearly and completely flat. This would have been the Doctor's view, he would have been able to read it perfectly clearly. River then places it, flat, in Amy's hand and then clasps Amy's hand in both of hers. This wraps the leaf around Amy's hand but doesn't crumple it. Then after a close up of River's face talking it cuts back to Amy's hand and Amy has (off camera whilst River was talking) closed her hand into a fist. This is what crumpled the leaf and why she has to straighten it out (another piece of direction to prolongue the reveal perhaps).

As it doesn't look as if River fliped it over when handing it to Amy then the uppermost side was "River". On looking down and seeing the leaf saying "River" then thinking of the language it's wriiten in and recalling the TARDIS line of "The only water in the Forrest is a River" doesn't seem too far a leap of logic for the Doctor.


Well given the number of different readings of the scene that seem to exist I can't argue with that

Yuk! He only kisses her you know

I like the idea they are the same person. It is a hugely fun storyline, and brilliant to play with...

Well more accurately she kisses him, rather passionately at that.

And whilst the Doctor could take such an action without knowing who she was, River is in full possession of the facts. So for her to launch into a passionate kiss with full knowledge of a family relationship would be worthy of a Yuk!

How come Doctor Donna was impossible with the timelord/human DNA mix, but Melody Pond is ok?

I didn't think that was a DNA thing, that was Donna gaining all the Doctors vast knowledge and the human brain not being able to cope with that much information?

If not it could be because Melody's DNA was bonded from the very first micro seconds and her body treated it as normal whereas Donna's was joined much later in life and that like a transplant her body was fighting to reject it as foreign matter.

Because Donna got a whole lot more than just a little bit of DNA augmentation. She got half a Timelord mind.

I just thought he asked her "how do I look?",because he had not long been talking to baby melody,who was taking the mickey out of his bowtie,thats just my interpretation though