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Nick certainly has changed his tune about Jim....


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Old 15-06-2011, 22:06
Socha
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Why has Nicks opinion of Jim changed so much, what is it based on?

From "Jim saved the deal" to "It's like nailing jelly to a wall as he never isolates himself".

Isn't it a good sign of a pm NOT to isolate themselves? Of course I can see it's also strategy to get everyone on board, but he wasn't afraid to take decisions as was suggested by NIck.
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Old 15-06-2011, 23:21
Sylvia
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Nick has really got it in for Jim now. I have never seen him take such a dislike to anyone to this extent - ever.
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Old 15-06-2011, 23:35
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Nick has really got it in for Jim now. I have never seen him take such a dislike to anyone to this extent - ever.
It may be because Nick has been watching Jim work for weeks now and he has seen his true colours.
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Old 16-06-2011, 02:08
Miriam_R
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It may be because Nick has been watching Jim work for weeks now and he has seen his true colours.
Most likely.

Actually someone here on this forum wrote that they thought Jim was passive aggressive which didn't really occur to me at the time. I think they commented this during either the first or second boardroom occasion where we saw Jedi Jim at in action. When Karen said it outloud in the boardroom for todays task that Jim was passive aggressive I kind of saw if for the first time (but hadn't really believed before).
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Old 16-06-2011, 03:25
Tourista
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Nick really did lay one on Jim this week.

Good for Nick.
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Old 16-06-2011, 03:30
Jimmy_McNulty
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lol he was really animated. Think he detested what the team had been saying during the task about the over 60s and he was wound up. When Sugar commented on him not being able to use a phone that was hilarious.
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Old 16-06-2011, 03:33
Tourista
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I agree JM.

Why Nick just didnt say to Jim to stop lying and tell the truth without 10 minutes of bullsh!t, is a wonder of restraint.

How many times did Jim get caught out?.

He lied about being a good pitcher, about Susan, and about the font used on the cover. Have I missed anything?.
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Old 16-06-2011, 04:09
totalwise
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Nick's always been objective and gives credit where credit is due, he'll like someone one week, and no like them the next, dependong on that week, on balance I think it's fair to say that nick likes the fact that he commands respect amogst the others. There's something there, even when failing tasks, it's a leadership quality that not many people posess.
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Old 16-06-2011, 09:36
Socha
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Nick's always been objective and gives credit where credit is due, he'll like someone one week, and no like them the next, dependong on that week, on balance I think it's fair to say that nick likes the fact that he commands respect amogst the others. There's something there, even when failing tasks, it's a leadership quality that not many people posess.

But Nick isn't correct in his assessment of Jim when he says he doesn't make decisions on his own. He does it all of the time: the choice of the cover photo, the not negotiating on the rates etc.
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Old 16-06-2011, 09:45
UnrealityTV
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But Nick isn't correct in his assessment of Jim when he says he doesn't make decisions on his own. He does it all of the time: the choice of the cover photo, the not negotiating on the rates etc.
Maybe he means that he never makes GOOD decisions on his own
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Old 16-06-2011, 09:51
Sun Tzu.
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Jim is great. People should leave him alone. Keep going jim.
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Old 17-06-2011, 01:41
totalwise
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But Nick isn't correct in his assessment of Jim when he says he doesn't make decisions on his own. He does it all of the time: the choice of the cover photo, the not negotiating on the rates etc.
I think you forgot that Nick is human, and not God, so he's not going to be impervious to errors.
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Old 17-06-2011, 02:19
sveknu
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Nick clearly has his favourites, and people he dislikes. I like Karen better, because in my opinion she is more objective.
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Old 17-06-2011, 06:33
sheff71
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I think Nick has a soft spot for Susan too, and seeing the way Jim was belittling her wound him up even further. Certainly the most animated i've seen Nick so far though!

When Jim took the credit a few weeks ago for thinking of Everydog, and then as soon as it was shown to be an error he couldn't wait to share the blame - that turned Nick's opinion of him.

The only reason Jim's still there is clearly to keep him in until the interview round, so Sugar's pack can rip his words apart...
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Old 17-06-2011, 07:34
Handers
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I agree JM.

Why Nick just didnt say to Jim to stop lying and tell the truth without 10 minutes of bullsh!t, is a wonder of restraint.How many times did Jim get caught out?.

He lied about being a good pitcher, about Susan, and about the font used on the cover. Have I missed anything?.
They want to see if Jim can figure this out himself, and so far, he doesn't seem to get it - think that's what has shifted the like factor for him, not just from Nick, but viewers as well. It's not all about doing tasks well, it's the other aspects such as integrity, honesty, etc, that they are being judged on. Last week LS flat out said to Jim he doesn't like liars, but Jim still tried to spin everything in his favour - I am certain they see something in Jim they like, which is why they have held on to him, but if he doesn't suss out what he is being spoon fed, he'll see the end come very soon!
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Old 17-06-2011, 11:08
nomad2king
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I think Nick has a soft spot for Susan too, and seeing the way Jim was belittling her wound him up even further. Certainly the most animated i've seen Nick so far though!

When Jim took the credit a few weeks ago for thinking of Everydog, and then as soon as it was shown to be an error he couldn't wait to share the blame - that turned Nick's opinion of him.

The only reason Jim's still there is clearly to keep him in until the interview round, so Sugar's pack can rip his words apart...
They were asked about who came up with the name. Jim correctly said that he did. Then LS incorrectly and very unfairly, blamed Jim for the concept behind 'Everydog'. This was unfair, as the concept came first and wasn't chosen by Jim. He just came up with the name for the chosen brand concept. Whatever name he or somebody else came up with, the brand concept of a food for all dogs would have still been there. The person responsible for the concept should have owned up.
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Old 17-06-2011, 11:18
Jepson
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They were asked about who came up with the name. Jim correctly said that he did. Then LS incorrectly and very unfairly, blamed Jim for the concept behind 'Everydog'. This was unfair, as the concept came first and wasn't chosen by Jim. He just came up with the name for the chosen brand concept. Whatever name he or somebody else came up with, the brand concept of a food for all dogs would have still been there. The person responsible for the concept should have owned up.
It's been said before, Jim's problem was his backtracking on the genesis of the name when he'd been extremely keen to claim credit for it before it was known that they'd lost.

He should have kept ownership of the name and pointed out:

1) No one came up with a better name.
2) He only picked a name to fit the concept he was given.
3) Everyone was happy to go along with it.

It was his attempt to backtrack, tied in with his extreme determination to take credit previously that was a major turning point in the attitudes of a lot of people.

I tend to cut people a lot of slack for their boardroom behaviour because of the stress, tiredness, and ambiguous team mate/competitor relationships, but Jim has demonstrated this tendency more than once.
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Old 17-06-2011, 11:20
marvola45
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But Nick isn't correct in his assessment of Jim when he says he doesn't make decisions on his own. He does it all of the time: the choice of the cover photo, the not negotiating on the rates etc.
Even then, he pretends they were a group decision! He tried to say Zoe had a hand in the cover.
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Old 17-06-2011, 11:47
haphash
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Jim is one of the most manipulative people ever seen on this show. Fascinating to watch, he's as slippery as an eel. Don't think he will win the apprentice but he'll do well for himself.
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Old 17-06-2011, 22:16
brangdon
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The person responsible for the concept should have owned up.
Vincent was responsible for the concept, and he did own up. Jim never claimed credit for the concept. At worst he left it open at the start, but Vince was there to claim it so fair enough.

Jim didn't backtrack. He didn't need to. Lord Sugar got the wrong end of the stick.
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Old 18-06-2011, 07:46
Jepson
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Vincent was responsible for the concept, and he did own up. Jim never claimed credit for the concept. At worst he left it open at the start, but Vince was there to claim it so fair enough.

Jim didn't backtrack. He didn't need to. Lord Sugar got the wrong end of the stick.
Backtracking may be the wrong word (I know I've used it myself).

The problem was that he was very quick and very definite in taking credit for the name.

Then, when he thought that it was being tagged as a major part of the problem he refused to confirm that it was his idea.

Had he not kept refusing to accept that and said: "Yes, it was my idea but I was just matching a name to a concept we were given", all would have been fine.

As it was he gave the impression of being an enormous weasel, even if it was more a matter of emphasis than substance.
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Old 18-06-2011, 21:15
brangdon
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Then, when he thought that it was being tagged as a major part of the problem he refused to confirm that it was his idea.
No, he doesn't. I'm sorry, but I think you are misremembering. It's at around 45:40 on iPlayer. He says, "I came up with the name.... I came up with the name in a brain-storming session... I came up the name and we ran with it. Every single one of us ran with it." This is late in the boardroom, when the name is definitely identified as a problem, and when Sugar is saying "The name is the branding".

He confirms it was his name at least three times in that speech. He also points out that everyone else agreed with it. I think the way Karren then rounds on him is rather ugly, because it is so unjust. She asks him, "But it is your name?" when he's just said it was three times. So he tries a different tack, because he's looking for words that will help her understand, because confirming that it was his name doesn't work. Then she does the rolly-eyes thing and looks smug and patronising, and Lord Sugar lectures him as if he were the one who didn't get it.
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Old 18-06-2011, 21:53
Socha
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No, he doesn't. I'm sorry, but I think you are misremembering. It's at around 45:40 on iPlayer. He says, "I came up with the name.... I came up with the name in a brain-storming session... I came up the name and we ran with it. Every single one of us ran with it." This is late in the boardroom, when the name is definitely identified as a problem, and when Sugar is saying "The name is the branding".

He confirms it was his name at least three times in that speech. He also points out that everyone else agreed with it. I think the way Karren then rounds on him is rather ugly, because it is so unjust. She asks him, "But it is your name?" when he's just said it was three times. So he tries a different tack, because he's looking for words that will help her understand, because confirming that it was his name doesn't work. Then she does the rolly-eyes thing and looks smug and patronising, and Lord Sugar lectures him as if he were the one who didn't get it.
This is how I remember it too.

It looked as if in the preparation for the boardroom LS, Karen and Nick had talked about it and specifically were out to get Jim to claim credit for the name first and then turn it around, saying it was the choosing of the name that was a major factor in losing the task.

If I remember well, initially Vincent claimed the name and when LS asked again, seemingly making it to be an important thing (possibly positive at that point), Jim claimed it.
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Old 19-06-2011, 02:11
ianswaiting
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They were asked about who came up with the name. Jim correctly said that he did. Then LS incorrectly and very unfairly, blamed Jim for the concept behind 'Everydog'. This was unfair, as the concept came first and wasn't chosen by Jim. He just came up with the name for the chosen brand concept. Whatever name he or somebody else came up with, the brand concept of a food for all dogs would have still been there. The person responsible for the concept should have owned up.
I love the fact that with Everydog he said he came up with the name but it wasn't his fault as the whole team went with it but that this week he said that Hip Replacement was Zoe's fault because she thought it up and that the team going with it was of no consequence
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Old 19-06-2011, 17:11
brangdon
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I love the fact that with Everydog he said he came up with the name but it wasn't his fault as the whole team went with it but that this week he said that Hip Replacement was Zoe's fault because she thought it up and that the team going with it was of no consequence
It makes sense. If Lord Sugar made him carry the can for Everydog, to be consistent Zoe should carry the can for Hip Replacement. It's not the rules he expected at the start, but since Everydog established they are the rules Sugar uses, he might as well play by them.
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