Maybe the summer shows are a separate commission, but Falconer shouldn't expect viewers to realise that, if it's the case.

Just watched the reel for upcoming BBC Natural History shows and Frozen Planet looks very good, Africa looks good as well but I dont expect that until 2012. I wonder if BBC One will schedule FP against Downton Abbey because I imagine they'll appeal to the same audience even though one's a documentary and the other is a drama.

Fair for EastEnders last night. Last night's second episode rating is probably the least of Emmerdale's problems at the moment. I don't watch it, but I know quite a few people who do, and they're all pretty disappointed with the quality at the moment.

They've lost the best producer they've had for quite some time, so it could be a long hard slog for fans over the next few months.

Doesn't The Big Bang Theory do well on E4? I've never really noticed that before.

The Murdoch scandal gave boosts to a lot of news and topical shows last night.

Overnights: 6th-10th July 2009

6.0m (26.4%) …. Torchwood: Children of Earth (21:00) BBC1/BBC HD - Monday
5.7m (24.6%) …. Torchwood: Children of Earth (21:00) BBC1/BBC HD - Tuesday
6.0m (27.7%) …. Torchwood: Children of Earth (21:00) BBC1/BBC HD - Wednesday
6.3m (27.5%) …. Torchwood: Children of Earth (21:00) BBC1/BBC HD - Thursday
5.9m (27.3%) …. Torchwood: Children of Earth (21:00) BBC1/BBC HD - Friday

Average: 5.98m

BARB: (inc HD)

TORCHWOOD: CHILDREN OF EARTH (MON 2100) - 6.60m
TORCHWOOD: CHILDREN OF EARTH (TUE 2100) - 6.25m
TORCHWOOD: CHILDREN OF EARTH (WED 2100) - 6.56m
TORCHWOOD: CHILDREN OF EARTH (THU 2059) - 6.89m
TORCHWOOD: CHILDREN OF EARTH (FRI 2100) - 6.73m

Average: 6.60m

AI's: 88, 90, 90,91 and 90

despite being a poor episode last night, TBBT was a new (much delayed) episode

It's a very solid performer, even for reruns. I think E4 have found their successor to Friends.

Slightly worrying that last night's episode prompted a thread on here saying it had jumped the shark - but I will reserve judgement until I see the episode.

P.S. If you were hoping to see this episode on Channel 4 HD tonight, forget it. They've shelved the second episode in the planned double bill in favour of a Sirens repeat following Monday's ratings slump for the struggling drama series.

I personally thought it was much improved on the first of this new batch from last week. But yes, I agree, it is something of a sleeper hit on E4. It pulls the numbers with such little fuss.

[quote=Pizzatheaction;51280062]Fair for EastEnders last night. Last night's second episode rating is probably the least of Emmerdale's problems at the moment. I don't watch it, but I know quite a few people who do, and they're all pretty disappointed with the quality at the moment.

They've lost the best producer they've had for quite some time, so it could be a long hard slog for fans over the next few months.


The Reason Emmerdale's Rating is Poor is becuase it was on when Eastenders was on. I watch it and to be honest i think it has been quite good. this week though i agree has been a bit boring and nothing much has happened.

Oh dear. I don't think that's a good reason for altering a TV schedule at the last minute.

Would be like ITV postponing Paul O'Grady to repeat last Saturday's Marriage Ref.

LOL! Now there's a scary thought.

Me neither. I was disappointed to say the least when I loaded up the EPG to set my recordings for tonight.

I wouldn't read too much into that one off bad rating for Emmerdale last night, it was stupid scheduling by BBC One that did it, not so much the show starting a long decline. Emmerdale can deliver 7 million viewers normally, excellent in such a competitive market, so it was just a case of it being in the wrong place at the wrong time, same as it would fare being against the opening ceremony of the London Olympics.

Dancc, you are clearly a huge fan of Channel 5 and get very defensive about it on this thread. I'm wondering if there is any point even continuing this discussion as you quite clearly are biased in favor of anything C5.


Cowboy Builders has been a ( comparatively) successful, undemanding returning format for Channel 5 and would already have an established fan base so is it really a surprise that it had a strong result? Really?

For a pretty well advertised, brand new show which you admit there is a market for, Candy Bar Girls floundered. Why do you think that is?



The channels recently just had millions of pounds invested into it hasn't it? If it wasn't up year- on -year then I would be pretty shocked! It's worrying that millions of pounds of reinvestment later and we still get/got the likes of- Impossible, The Vanessa Show, OK!TV, Candy Bar Girls that really showcase the quality original commissions of Channel 5. If Channel 5 is "on the up" by continuing to make this tripe, then I despair. Oh, and we have the delights of Big Brother and The Bachelor. Joy!



You seem to have a problem with accepting that some people don't think that the sun shines out of C5's arse. I do watch C5 programmes, however I can't say that "The Gadget Show" or "OK!TV" make me want to.

As for making friends, blind loyalty and a defensive and dismissive attitude probably won't.



Sweeping statement?! I am not saying that Channel 5 cannot have good programmes. I am saying that good programme get lost in among alot of cheap trash. Would you not agree that this can and is the case alot of the time?

As for abysmal- that is a word that I would use to describe Impossible, The Vanessa Show, OK!TV, Candy Bar Girls, Gadget Show, . Let's face it, Channel 5 produces or has produced alot of rubbish recently.



And if it is confirmed? What will you think then?

Bringing back Big Brother is a step back for Channel 5. Why bring back the tired, cheap format? It had it's day on Channel 4.

Why exactly are you so defensive of a channel? I just don't understand how you can be a fan of a channel rather than a fan of a programme? Any chance you could explain why you get so wound up?

I mean come on, you must admit that shows like OKTV and Candy Bar Girls are cheap, poor quality television?

Why are BB fans so defensive? If the show was so good, then Channel 4 would willingly give a large chunk of its revenue to Endemol each year and the show would be being broadcast with the sort of slavish devotion from the redtops they give the Cowell shows now. However, we all know somewhere between 2005 and 2009 the show badly lost its way, ratings fell by two thirds and Channel 4 wanted to axe it but couldn't as they had such an expensive deal to show it. No one is going to carry on paying £ 60 million a year for a fading show that has no repeat potential to pay back its costs.
I wonder also if Channel 4 has binned most of the series now as it would have no use for them.

Both very true points.

I think The Apprentice Final Five did pretty well - IIRC in previous years it's had ratings as low as 3m and beaten by other shows in the slot so it did decently. In terms of regular slot primetime episodes, I'm pretty sure last night was Emmerdale's lowest overnight rating since it became fully networked. The previous low I can remember was 3.5-3.8m during World Cup 2006 but that aired at around 10pm, not a regularly scheduled episode. Wasn't only Emmerdale dented by the extended EastEnders, as Eddie Stobart on C5 was down almost 40% compared to last week. Cowboy Builder's started well in its new slot though with a higher rating than any of its previous episodes this year.

Yeah, it was a good start for The Killing. But the competition, especially in drama terms, gets much tougher from next week onwards so it could potentially drop off a lot. Also the serialised nature of the show makes it less retention-friendly than a bog standard crime produceral which has standalone stories, so I can see this one possibly dropping off eventually to the low 1's.


There are certainly programmes outside of BGT/TXF/Corrie on ITV1 which rate well, I won't name them but it's pretty clear to see in this drama list that they have some strong performers in that department.


Doc Martin airs every couple of years - that's been the case since 2005. It was the most popular weekly drama series in 2009 with a 9.2m consolidated average, so no it wasn't axed. It's returning later this year.


Channel 5's share is indeed up in the most recent week of official data but it must be remembered that the equivalent week last year was up against World Cup football which would've surpressed the 2010 shares. If we're talking about the whole year, Channel 5 as a terrestrial channel has lost share: 4.68% (Jan to May 2010) vs 4.48% (2011) - a decline of 4.3% year-on-year, the second biggest drop for a terrestrial channel behind only C4 (-6.5%). In terms of an organisation, Channel 5 including its digital channels is slightly down too: 6.04% (Jan to May 2010) vs. 5.96% (2011) - which makes it the broadcaster which has lost most share so far this year (BBC and ITV are up, C4's relative drop is smaller).

In terms of peaktime share, which would be equally as important if not more important to a commercial channel as this is the time-period where most ad revenue is, I haven't got data going up until June yet, but Broadcast's roundup of Q1 here shows that Channel 5 lost the most share during the key peaktime period out of any of the terrestrial channels, down -7.5% (all-time share was -3% in those months). In April/May, the all-time share decline of -7%, suggests once again C5 was down in the peaktime shares for Q2 (Broadcast will confirm in due course).

So if anything, the actual ratings %-stats suggests to us that it hasn't been the best first half to the year for the broadcaster and has made no ground up whatsoever on Channel 4 in terms of market shares. They've lost all-time share and crucially, quite a bit of its primetime share so far in 2011. Channel 5 are more profitable this year, but how much of that is due to the fact that the 2008-2010 results were during the economic downturn whilst late 2010/2011 is during a stronger advertising market. ITV and Channel 4, for example, also posted gains in their profits recently too, so it's been an industry-wide trend rather than specifically just a Channel 5 thing.

That is not the case. But by the same token, I could say the opposite is true of you, i.e. quite clearly biased AGAINST anything on C5. (well, except the top trio of imports which you probably namechecked out of necessity more than anything else since time and time again the audience research tells us that these shows are extremely well liked)

Sorry if you were expecting your post to go unchallenged, but this is a discussion forum after all. People generally do reply and occasionally (gasps) disagree!


It was above the official consolidated average for the last series, which not many people predicted. You, to your credit, did. But clearly talking about the poor figures for Candy Bar Girls in isolation only tells half the story of Channel 5's performance last night.


Could be lots of reasons. I for one was going to give it a chance but the big breaking news story of the evening meant my viewing plans were changed and Cowboy Builders was the only thing I watched outside BBC One / the news channels.


Much of the additional investment went on Big Brother and that hasn't made it on screen yet.


I liked Impossible. Others did too. It's one of those where I genuinely don't understand why the audience was so low. I was very disappointed, but Escoffey and all the people that worked on it can hold their heads up high as far as I'm concerned because I thought it was a very enjoyable piece of television. It certainly wasn't a programme without merit.


Not at all. I only have a problem if the criticism is not legitimate, and saying that most of C5's output is tripe and they never make good programmes clearly falls under that category for me. The Gadget Show has gone downhill recently for sure, the last series was crap. But in essence a show about technology on primetime TV is an idea that is right up my street and a good alternative to BBC One/ITV1's soap fest, so hopefully it can find form again soon and bounce back.


Not really. Mostly because I'm not convinced C5 airs as much "cheap trash" as you and others like to portray.


Well, Channel 5 doesn't produce anything period. A couple of programmes have made it to air that I don't feel are right for the channel, but anyone with more than a few brain cells can surely work out why, for example, OK! TV is and continues to be a part of the schedule. The 6:30 slot has always been tricky anyway, I doubt anything would do spectacularly there.


It would be mildly disappointing. But frankly the main consideration for the upcoming series should be casting. That is the key to ratings, not the live feed, despite what the fans might say.


It's not that cheap, that's the only reason Channel 4 dropped it. Channel 5 have negotiated a better deal. And going by the viewing figures for the last series of Celebrity Big Brother, it's not that tired either. Not to mention its audience is very youthful.

Dancc- this is now my reponse to the "worrying position" question!

Come on mate, this is evidence that C5 is not in the best place at the moment, and surely a large part of that must be because it produces *some* trashy, cheap tosh!
Thank you.

No, it was down almost 40% week-on-week because it was a rerun.

Some interesting stats to chew on in the latter part of your post, some of which you've posted before I believe. I was going as you know by the most recent data release, but it's interesting to look at the situation as a whole as well. I doubt they will be too concerned with a 4% drop at this stage- disappointing maybe but it's really going to be August onwards that are crucial. Channel 4 is down the most, clearly suffering post-BB. And ITV1 just posted its joint lowest rated audience share on record, so it could be worse...

I think last night ratings proved what working for Channel 5 and what isn't. Candy Bar Girls was a flop while Cowboy Builders did well. It's clear that the tacky shows like CBG, Josie etc are flopping while the factual shows like Eddie Stobart, Restaraunt Inspector etc are hits.

Speaking of Eddie Stobart, was the episode at 8pm a repeat? It rated lower than it usually does.

Do you really believe that? From your posts, you seem to be incredibly defensive of the channel and very keen to promote it. Clearly you are a big supporter. Notihing wrong with that at all.


.

Based on what? A couple of posts? Just because I don't think C5 is a particularly quality channel doesn't mean I am blindly biased against it. I would say from what I see of you on this thread, you are blindly in support of Channel 5.


And this is why I think this. You can tell posters are blindly loyal when they start attacking and dismissing others who dont agree with them. with no proof at all.


Theres disagreeing and there is blind loyalty. I have no problem with disagreement, but it's hard to take it seriously when it comes form the poster who constantly defends and promotes C5.


I'm talking about the poor figures for that show solely because it was well advertised and new. The fact that it floundered most probably tells a bigger story about what viewers expect from Channel 5 and the quality of it's original commissions.



This is true for some viewers, but is there much crossover between those who are inetrested in that news and those who watch shows such as Candy Bar Girls? I would be surprised if there were. But I do take your point.



Shame. It could have gone on better, higher quality things.



I am a fan of Derren Brown and make a point of watching all his shows and so was expecting something more in accordance with his style. I was disappointed with what I watched, but this could have been down with my own high expectations.


Looking at RZT's post, the criticism most probably is legitimate.


.

Where did I say that they never make good programmes? It is true that quality commisions get lost in lots of cheap tosh.


[/quote]

The Gadget Show has been pretty crap for some time now. A show about technology is only up my street if it is actually any good, and currently it another show which really doesn't help C5 reputation.


Fair enough, but how much of that is down to your own bias in favour of C5?


It is still a bad sign that C5 are cutting something that alot of fans enjoy about the show. I agree with casting being key, but what is the chance of getting the same old stereotypes that we always get?



Do you not think that because it was being promoted as the last ever Big Brother that more people watched? I certinatley do. Ratings had been declining before and only being named as the last ever bucked this trend I believe. That would suggest that it is a tired format.

They are showing series 1 again on Thursday nights. Series 2 concluded on Friday. At this stage a third series has not been commissioned, but given its extremely solid ratings even during the onslaught from the Tennis, it really ought to be.

Fair point above by the way.

Would have thought they would put The Digger series on Thursday and have the repeats of ES on Fridays but I imagine they want to give Castle a boost.

I do wonder how the 7.30pm shows would do if they were moved to 8pm because they do alright but I think one or two of them would easily break a million.

People weren't that bothered when it was celebrities being hacked and settling out of course, but the developments of the last week have I think made it the big news story it is - not just here but around the world. The hacking into phones of murder, terror and war victims is not only disgusting but incomprehensible - what the **** did they expect to achieve from it?


Although as others have said competition gets a lot tougher next week. I really think C4 should have put it on another night at 10pm.

Someone mentioned Breakout Kings last night and that would be a good C4 show - I think they'd be wise to go for content from the US cable networks such as A&E, TNT etc. rather than the main networks.


As pointed out it does continue this summer, with Ruth/Eamonn from Mon-Thu and Paddy/Jenni on Fridays.


The summer series is always considered a seperate entity - the features change and some of the regular contributers are off for the summer too.


Well Dirty Desmond's first forray into broadcasting off the back of Big Brother - both Vanessa and Something about Josie - absolutely flopped.

This is the newspaper's Sachsgate/TV fakery and quite frankly they deserve the scrunity, bet the BBC are having the field day over this. I do think other newspapers will be affected as I suspect this practice didn't just happen in the NOTW.

Breakout Kings would be better on Channel 5 or 5USA. Leverage I think would quite well on 5* or 5USA given that Bravo closed down, I'm surprised no picked up the rights and the same with The Glades which would be a good companion for Burn Notice.