[malcy30]

I thought Channel 5 turned it down again this year, but said they want it kept for their future use. Bit dog in a manager, but may be because didn't Sky part fund C5HD on their so part of that deal may be exclusivity for a period.

Really OFCOM need to say to Channel 5 if you don't use now we will offer to ITV or C4. Although ITV want pay revenue for their other HD channels.

As others said my preference would be to keep BBCHD along with BBC1HD and BBC2HD.

[Restorer]

Originally Posted by malcy30

I thought Channel 5 turned it down again this year, but said they want it kept for their future use. Bit dog in a manager, but may be because didn't Sky part fund C5HD on their so part of that deal may be exclusivity for a period.

Really OFCOM need to say to Channel 5 if you don't use now we will offer to ITV or C4. Although ITV want pay revenue for their other HD channels.

As others said my preference would be to keep BBCHD along with BBC1HD and BBC2HD.

Yep, I think this would be a popular use but the BBC are adamant they have no need for it which is quite a surprise really since it's over a year now since they required all of their programme providers to deliver their shows in HD and we are now only 6 months or so away from the new Broadcasting House becoming fully operational.

[mossy2103]

Maybe they have no use for it due to the issue of cost (paying for it/running it with money that they don't have at the moment thanks to the LF freeze imposed upon it).

[derek500]

Originally Posted by mossy2103

Maybe they have no use for it due to the issue of cost (paying for it/running it with money that they don't have at the moment thanks to the LF freeze imposed upon it).

But dear old mikw is always telling us that TV channels cost nothing and it's the programming that's expensive!!

We're now at the point that the BBC are paying more to produce everything in HD, yet have nowhere to show the majority of it.

[mpk81]

Originally Posted by derek500

We're now at the point that the BBC are paying more to produce everything in HD, yet have nowhere to show the majority of it.

Don't know where you get that idea from BBC HD is always having to repeat old stuff.

They'll soon have 5 HD channels once the four BBC1 HDs are launched.

[chrisy]

Originally Posted by figrin_dan

4 are currently using it for the Superhumans.

This is pretty much the only correct factual information posted in this thread today.

Beyond that it depends if the BBC have had any takers on a commercial basis.

[technologist]

Originally Posted by derek500

But dear old mikw is always telling us that TV channels cost nothing and it's the programming that's expensive!!

the problem is that the BBC has not much money - and is putting it into programmes
- and of course if someone else uses the slot the BBC gets income...

We're now at the point that the BBC are paying more to produce everything in HD, yet have nowhere to show the majority of it.

Now a days it is almost costing more for SD delivery - as it is an extra stage to Grade and down convert onto Digibeta....
....

[mossy2103]

Originally Posted by derek500

But dear old mikw is always telling us that TV channels cost nothing and it's the programming that's expensive!!

Money to support a new channel when budgets are squeezed, or money to go into programming when budgets are squeezed. Hmmmmm .....

We're now at the point that the BBC are paying more to produce everything in HD, yet have nowhere to show the majority of it.

Which is probably why BBC Two HD will take over BBC HD. Now if the Government had not imposed that 6-year LF freeze, things might be a little different.

[Dansky+HD]

Originally Posted by mossy2103

Money to support a new channel when budgets are squeezed, or money to go into programming when budgets are squeezed. Hmmmmm .....

Which is probably why BBC Two HD will take over BBC HD. Now if the Government had not imposed that 6-year LF freeze, things might be a little different.

What is the current licence fee?

How much extra estimated would it cost to add

BBC One HD England, Scotland, Wales & Northern Ireland.

BBC Two HD, 4 National reg vars (UK wide with opt outs)

BBC Three HD / CBeebies HD (Timeshare)

BBC Four HD / CBBC (Timeshare)

BBC NEWS HD

[technologist]

not direct pricing - but put the BBC ones to one side - these will happen within the existing plans - but means doing new play out for the Nations and some way of feeding BBC ONE HD to them - and the back haul to code and mux onto existing Transponder.

But the other require an extra 2 transponders - and the BBC cut their transponders from 7 to 6 as a cost saving ...... so not V likely.

News HD is fairly simple - but all the others require playout - but some of this may be happening in any case as Red Bee modernise - but the nations is a totally new build.... (As well as being the second txpder.) Then there are issues of stat muxing identical services!!
If you assume that code mux uplink and space segment is the same in SD and HD (not quite true - there is a third more spend required...for DSAT .... and no simple way for DTT....
but then there is 24 oct .

[DragonQ]

Originally Posted by Dansky+HD

What is the current licence fee?

How much extra estimated would it cost to add

BBC One HD England, Scotland, Wales & Northern Ireland.

BBC Two HD, 4 National reg vars (UK wide with opt outs)

BBC Three HD / CBeebies HD (Timeshare)

BBC Four HD / CBBC (Timeshare)

BBC NEWS HD

Cost is irrelevant, there is no space in the DTT spectrum for these to appear on Freeview right now.

They could appear on satellite easily but that does depend on cost. I'm sure BBC Three/CBBC and BBC Four/CBeebies will go HD eventually but maybe not until they find the money from somewhere.

[Restorer]

Originally Posted by DragonQ

Cost is irrelevant, there is no space in the DTT spectrum for these to appear on Freeview right now.
.

Well there could be if you got rid of all the porn and shopping channels!

I've only recently - since getting a new TV with T2 tuner - taken much interest in the Freeview EPG. I am astonished how these other channels (not to mention top-up TV) have been allowed to take over the service's limited bandwidth . Was there no debate or consultation over all this stuff? Surely most are in direct contradiction of the whole ethos of such a service.

[DragonQ]

Most of the porn is broadcast at night time so it doesn't really take up much space. Shopping channels belong to the already bit-starved COM muxes so removing them wouldn't really make more space, it'd just give breathing room back to the other channels.

What the BBC could do is convert BBC A to an HD DVB-T2 mux. That'd give them room for 5 HD channels (instead of the 7 SD channels they have now), plus the two already on BBC B, which is enough for:

BBC One HD
BBC Two HD
BBC News HD
BBC Three/CBBC HD
BBC Four/CBeebies HD
BBC 301 HD
BBC HD
BBC Parliament (SD)

It won't happen for many years though because there's no way they can leave everyone with non-HD Freeview equipment without BBC channels.

If there ever is a "DSO 2" in the future, the most sensible thing to do (IMO) is to leave one DVB-T mux with BBC One, BBC Two, ITV1, Channel 4, Channel 5, BBC Three/CBBC, BBC Four/CBeebies and BBC News on it, then have all other muxes switch to DVB-T2. One can be for 20 "full resolution" SD channels, the other 4 can house 5 HD channels each. No-one loses the PSB channels, no SD/HD simulcasting is needed for non-PSB channels, and we get 20 total HD channels instead of the 4-5 we have right now.

[Restorer]

Originally Posted by DragonQ

Most of the porn is broadcast at night time so it doesn't really take up much space. Shopping channels belong to the already bit-starved COM muxes so removing them wouldn't really make more space, it'd just give breathing room back to the other channels.

Ah, thanks for the explanation. Was beginning to think the world had gone mad .

Presumably HD via IPTV is now a very viable route for the Freeview HD EPG to take?

[lbear]

Originally Posted by Restorer

Ah, thanks for the explanation. Was beginning to think the world had gone mad .

Presumably HD via IPTV is now a very viable route for the Freeview HD EPG to take?

The limiting factor is broadband speed. HD on BBC iPlayer is 720p and needs about 3.5Gb/s.

You may have noticed that there are some IPTV channel currently on the EPG from 110

[Muzer]

Yeah. Freeview COM muxes are essentially a free market - there are some minimum specifications they have to adhere to that we should at least be thankful for (544x576i is the minimum resolution they're allowed to go to), and obviously services have to have licences, but aside from that, the commercial multiplex operators can do whatever they want, for better or for worse.

You must remember that towards the start of Freeview when all the rules were decided, people were unsure on whether or not a free-to-air digital terrestrial service could even work - as far as I know, few, if any, other countries had tried it, and ONdigital/ITV Digital (the pay-TV predecessor) was an abject failure. So, few channels were comfortable with joining, so the powers that be didn't want to further limit the growth of Freeview by cutting off one of the sources of revenue (shopping channels). The channels that did join were either public service broadcaster-run channels (BBC and ITV ones to start off with) or were people who had a hand in the initial launch of the service, who launched channels specifically to try to ensure that it was a success (UKTV and Sky among a few others). Of course, as we now know, it paid off and became very successful, which means that for better or for worse, we have to keep the shopping channels - many of them have very long-term contracts (QVC springs to mind).

[Restorer]

Originally Posted by lbear

The limiting factor is broadband speed. HD on BBC iPlayer is 720p and needs about 3.5Gb/s.

I'm trusting you meant to say "Mb/s" . UK average now is supposed to be around 9 so that shouldn't be a problem for most.

Originally Posted by lbear

You may have noticed that there are some IPTV channel currently on the EPG from 110

Yes - I see a bunch of God-bothering channels have appeared in the last few weeks too. PQ pretty poor but then that's the case with these specialist channels on DSat too.

[Muzer]

The question is whether that's a mean or a median - I'd expect a median to produce a more accurate result on what the average internet speed actually is, as the fastest speeds would surely massively inflate the figure (as they ARE quite fast).

[figrin_dan]

I would imagine the best way to get more channels out there (and not reducing the quality. . . again) is to get some more SFNs set up.

Although who will actually pay for the channels is anyones guess. If the channels that make the most money are porn and shopping then that's what we'll see more of regardless of whether you or I watch them.

[nvingo]

Originally Posted by Muzer

The question is whether that's a mean or a median - I'd expect a median to produce a more accurate result on what the average internet speed actually is, as the fastest speeds would surely massively inflate the figure (as they ARE quite fast).

Yeah, some of us in the villages struggle to attain 2mb/s as a best figure.

[Restorer]

Originally Posted by nvingo

Yeah, some of us in the villages struggle to attain 2mb/s as a best figure.

Then I'm afraid HD IPTV will not be for you just yet - but then there must be many other attractions of living out in the sticks that will more than compensate .

[Restorer]

Originally Posted by Muzer

The question is whether that's a mean or a median - I'd expect a median to produce a more accurate result on what the average internet speed actually is, as the fastest speeds would surely massively inflate the figure (as they ARE quite fast).

For lay consumption "average" usually refers to the mean.

Here's the article I was quoting from.

[jzee]

Originally Posted by chrisy

The space is up for grabs by any PSB, Ofcom is supposed to be advertising it this year for an expected 2012 launch.

It isn't guaranteed to be C5 HD, they might not even apply for it this time.

Does anyone have a source that only PSBs could apply for the 5th slot? This cable article doesn't seem to mention that.

[chrisy]

Originally Posted by jzee

Does anyone have a source that only PSBs could apply for the 5th slot? This cable article doesn't seem to mention that.

http://stakeholders.ofcom.org.uk/spe...hd_on_dtt/ita/

[XxBlaKOuTZxX]

Originally Posted by andy12345

Big Brother cameras have been upgraded to HD

The heart sinks