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  • Strictly Come Dancing
Is Aliona in the doghouse again ?
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BuddyBontheNet
23-10-2011
Originally Posted by Pasta:
“Did she actually break any rules, though? Craig will usually dock a mark for an illegal lift, say (and has sometimes been given the 'Len stare' treatment by doing so, because it wasn't 'serious'), and, as people say, 'stairwork' is virtually standard on SCD. I just think that looking for consistency on SCD or in Len's responses is an exercise in futility.”

Yes, she did because the Waltz is supposed to be danced all in hold i.e. the couple never breaks the embrace. On the show though they usually get away with a little bit of faffling about at the start and/or the end. You are right though about it being futile looking for Len to be consistent.
Originally Posted by SCD-Observer:
“...But this week, at least 50% of the time they were in hold and they were immaculate when in hold. I agree the break in the second half somewhat ruined the magic, but I can see why she wanted to add that kiss there because it matched the lyrics of the song.

Then again, it can be said if they started off from the stairs (with the same lyrics come away with me, followed by the kiss) and then danced the second half all in hold, Len might just about let her get away with it...”

Sorry but sad person that I am, I timed their dancing and it is just about 50% in hold. And as you and Jan have pointed out, she could have kept the kiss bit on the stairs in the routine, but been in hold longer.
Originally Posted by Jurre:
“...It seems that some here demand that Aliona should only do a traditional dance with no faffing abaht. But Why should we demand that of her, when everyone else is seriously faffing about. Yesterday we had a rumba that took place on the floor, a samba that went all the way up the stairs, an tango that started and ended in bed and a waltz that consisted mainly of dancing out of hold around lamp posts.Aliona and Harry were more in hold than Artem and Holly, yet they were not criticised.”

I'm not asking for her to only do a traditional dance with no faffing. I'm asking her to use her fabulous choreographic skills to produce a routine that pleases both the judges and the viewers. Other pros do it and so can she - she did a good job with the Foxtrot, so she does know what's what. And nobody is singingly out Aliona without criticising the others - comments have been made all over the board about the other couples.

The point is Aliona has the best celeb dancer in the competition and people want to see him do well.
LittleNothing
23-10-2011
Originally Posted by SCD-Observer:
“The point is, Harry is good, EXCELLENT even, so faffing about is a waste.

Chelsee is good too. And did Pasha mess too much with her dance? No, there were pure dance. Yes it took her five weeks to get anywhere close to getting the dance technically, but she got there, because Pasha didn't give up throwing her all the technical difficulty into their choreography.

Aliona must have discovered she discovered a gem again this year. But what did she do? She probably taught Harry to do the basics well (and what vast improvement in Harry's ballroom-hold, from the foxtrot two weeks ago to the waltz last night, it was almost night and day!).

Pasha did break hold mid-way during the QS, but went back to it. They did spend time faffing about, but only in the beginning and the end (and the end they did a little charleston, which is allowed in the QS).

Artem faffed about in the beginning and the end (and a bit out of hold in the middle), but he did a proper VW with Holly, enough for the judges to be less anal about it.

Aliona was very strange. If she did that second half of last night's performance first and the in-hold bits to the end, I actually think they may get two tens instead of one.”

I agree that there was an awful lot of steps in that routine (it is a quickstep) but actually Chelsee and Pasha didn't take hold until after they had "faffed" about for a full 20 seconds they then broke hold and "faffed" about some more about 10 seconds at the end. It doesn't actually add up to all that less than Aliona and Harry who danced pure waltz in hold for the first 50 seconds of their dance and out of hold for the last 40.

Chelsee/Pascha 30 seconds of faff versus Harry/Aliona 40 seconds of faff.
and infact I would argue that at least Aliona faffing was in keeping with the music they were dancing to and interpreted the lyrics beautifuly. Why Pascha based his quickstep around Britney Spears Toxic video remains a mystery to me
not that I didn't love it cause I did
SCD-Observer
23-10-2011
Originally Posted by LittleNothing:
“I agree that there was an awful lot of steps in that routine (it is a quickstep) but actually Chelsee and Pasha didn't take hold until after they had "faffed" about for a full 20 seconds they then broke hold and "faffed" about some more about 10 seconds at the end. It doesn't actually add up to all that less than Aliona and Harry who danced pure waltz in hold for the first 50 seconds of their dance and out of hold for the last 40.

Chelsee/Pascha 30 seconds of faff versus Harry/Aliona 40 seconds of faff.
and infact I would argue that at least Aliona faffing was in keeping with the music they were dancing to and interpreted the lyrics beautifuly. Why Pascha based his quickstep around Britney Spears Toxic video remains a mystery to me
not that I didn't love it cause I did”

You are allowed to faff in the beginning and the end. But once you are in hold, traditionally in SCD (save last series and this one) you are supposed to be in hold.

Now you may think that just as they touch each other, they are in hold? No, it's ballroom hold, where their two pelvises touch each other, and their shoulders with that traditional t-shape in respect to their spine. That's what it's meant to be 'in hold'.
LittleNothing
23-10-2011
Originally Posted by SCD-Observer:
“You are allowed to faff in the beginning and the end. But once you are in hold, traditionally in SCD (save last series and this one) you are supposed to be in hold.

Now you may think that just as they touch each other, they are in hold? No, it's ballroom hold, where their two pelvises touch each other, and their shoulders with that traditional t-shape in respect to their spine. That's what it's meant to be 'in hold'.”

oh may I??

I don't count the beautiful bit at the beginning where Harry and Aliona hesitated before melting into a beautiful 40 seconds of waltz as "faffing around"
SCD-Observer
23-10-2011
Originally Posted by LittleNothing:
“oh may I??

I don't count the beautiful bit at the beginning where Harry and Aliona hesitated before melting into a beautiful 40 seconds of waltz as "faffing around"”

I didn't spend my life trying to time him, dear.

Look, I did say in several places now that I think Aliona's choreography, considering how atrocious she was before (esp. with Matt Baker last year, and that ridiculous jive last week) her waltz was a jaw-dropper by comparision, in that at least 50% of it was in hold (didn't count the seconds, just by gut feeling, apparently Buddy did the timing, see above).

Since the 'come away with me' was sung right at the beginning of the routine, she could have chosen to faff on the stairs, asking Harry to whisper to her sweet nothing and kiss her, heck even if he dry hump her I wouldn't have minded. Just when she gets in hold, if she remained in hold till near the very end, Len might have also given Harry the ten, as well as Alesha, who's already determined not to 'punish' Harry with her ten.

Happy now?
LittleNothing
23-10-2011
Originally Posted by SCD-Observer:
“I didn't spend my life trying to time him, dear.

Look, I did say in several places now that I think Aliona's choreography, considering how atrocious she was before (esp. with Matt Baker last year, and that ridiculous jive last week) her waltz was a jaw-dropper by comparision, in that at least 50% of it was in hold (didn't count the seconds, just by gut feeling, apparently Buddy did the timing, see above).

Since the 'come away with me' was sung right at the beginning of the routine, she could have chosen to faff on the stairs, asking Harry to whisper to her sweet nothing and kiss her, heck even if he dry hump her I wouldn't have minded. Just when she gets in hold, if she remained in hold till near the very end, Len might have also given Harry the ten, as well as Alesha, who's already determined not to 'punish' Harry with her ten.

Happy now?”

I'm sorry, thank you for explaining the ballroom hold to me like I was a simpleton. Because in the 7 years I have religiously watched Strictly I had never quite figured it out

And I know their timings because I loved both Chelsee and Harry's dances so much I have re watched them both about 20 times today and will probably watch them a further 40 times in the week......dear.

Len hated Aliona's choreography. Craig loved it. I happen to agree with Craig it was a beautiful interpretation of a beautiful song, stunningly danced.

SCD-Observer
23-10-2011
Originally Posted by LittleNothing:
“I'm sorry, thank you for explaining the ballroom hold to me like I was a simpleton. Because in the 7 years I have religiously watched Strictly I had never quite figured it out

And I know their timings because I loved both Chelsee and Harry's dances so much I have re watched them both about 20 times today and will probably watch them a further 40 times in the week......dear.

Len hated Aliona's choreography. Craig loved it. I happen to agree with Craig it was a beautiful interpretation of a beautiful song, stunningly danced.

”

And even if Len 'hated' it, he scored the same with Craig, who supposedly didn't mind the whispering and kissing.

Wow, you watched them so many times! You are proper crazy!
LittleNothing
23-10-2011
Originally Posted by SCD-Observer:
“And even if Len 'hated' it, he scored the same with Craig, who supposedly didn't mind the whispering and kissing.

Wow, you watched them so many times! You are proper crazy! ”

I am indeed proper cookoo

(20 was maybe an exaggeration..... Harry's probably more like 15 )
SCD-Observer
23-10-2011
Originally Posted by LittleNothing:
“I am indeed proper cookoo

(20 was maybe an exaggeration..... Harry's probably more like 15 )”

It's alright that you watched Harry many times, seeing that you are already his fan (am I right)?

I hope those two go to the final. Don't mind which one wins.
Damahepa
23-10-2011
Originally Posted by SCD-Observer:
“It's alright that you watched Harry many times, seeing that you are already his fan (am I right)?

I hope those two go to the final. Don't mind which one wins.”

If Aliona bucks up her ideas- I think Harry deserves victory- but otherwise, Chelsee Holly Jason will steal what should be his crown- or, heaven forbid, Russell! That would be the most oxymoronic hilariously joyous travesty haha xx
SCD-Observer
23-10-2011
Originally Posted by Damahepa:
“If Aliona bucks up her ideas- I think Harry deserves victory- but otherwise, Chelsee Holly Jason will steal what should be his crown- or, heaven forbid, Russell! That would be the most oxymoronic hilariously joyous travesty haha xx”

Oh, how can I forget Aliona? *slaps own wrist*
Damahepa
23-10-2011
Originally Posted by SCD-Observer:
“Oh, how can I forget Aliona? *slaps own wrist*”

I wish the rest of us could Maybe, just maybe, she'll pull a corker for next week and Harry takes the dance world by storm!
petertard
23-10-2011
She is definitely improving as a choreographer. Last season a lot of her dances were too idiosyncratic to work, but now she is half-mainstream half-quirky; by the end of the series, she might be slightly more mainstream than quirky, good enough to win with Harry.
SCD-Observer
23-10-2011
Originally Posted by Damahepa:
“I wish the rest of us could Maybe, just maybe, she'll pull a corker for next week and Harry takes the dance world by storm!”

If that happens, then it'll be more frightfully unbelievable than the Halloween Night!
BuddyBontheNet
23-10-2011
Originally Posted by LittleNothing:
“oh may I??

I don't count the beautiful bit at the beginning where Harry and Aliona hesitated before melting into a beautiful 40 seconds of waltz as "faffing around"”

The fact that you think 40 seconds of waltz is acceptable means it is pointless arguing with you. I don't think anybody is disputing that the routine was not a beautiful and romantic dance, but it was not a Waltz according to the rules of the show.

Just think about it for a minute. If all the pros did what Aliona does, don't you think we'd see the most a_maz_ing routines week in week out? All the pros know the rules and some break them more than others for one reason or another. Aliona's choreography is alienating people who want to support her and her partner. That cannot be a good thing.
Damahepa
23-10-2011
Originally Posted by SCD-Observer:
“If that happens, then it'll be more frightfully unbelievable than the Halloween Night!”

Which will be scarier, Aliona doing some proper choreography for Harry (if...we can only hope...), or Anton and Nancy's performance in general?
petertard
29-10-2011
I was expecting a bit more in hold - even Craig said he would have liked more.
edy10
29-10-2011
She is so stubborn.
Mrs BBV
29-10-2011
Originally Posted by petertard:
“I was expecting a bit more in hold - even Craig said he would have liked more.”

It left me cold.....much preferred Anita's despite it's faults. I want a Tango to look like a Tango and a Jive to look like a Jive.

TBH Aliona is proving to be a bit of a liability when one compares her with Natalie and Kristina and their choreography.
beaky29
29-10-2011
It's a shame that Aliona doesn't seem to listen. Len's comments were spot on tonight and she is letting Harry down.
primer
29-10-2011
its starting to look like a vendetta on len's part.

sure, its nothing personal. thats why he can't stop going on and on and on and on and on about it.

it was the best routine of the night, regardless.
Hello.
29-10-2011
I loved the story of Harry's dance this week. However, I do understand that they were out of hold for a long time. But that didn't mean I enjoyed it any less - I loved everything that they did anyhow.

I've never really watched Strictly as closely as I have so far this year, so could someone answer me this?

As the show goes on do the dances become longer? I think if there was an extra 30 seconds of time Aliona would have chucked more Tango into the routine and it would have been perfect. I don't think it needed to lose what was there, it just would have suited a longer time.
CaroUK
29-10-2011
She needs to do more dancing the proper steps of the allocatrd dance - and less faffing!

That tango had less tango in it than the can in my daughter's bedroom!
Frank Mag
29-10-2011
Originally Posted by primer:
“its starting to look like a vendetta on len's part.

sure, its nothing personal. thats why he can't stop going on and on and on and on and on about it.

it was the best routine of the night, regardless.”

Couldn't agree more, he said to Harry and Aliona that he has nothing aginst them then later in the show he had another 'dig' commenting on the Tango that wasn't but got a 10 from Alesa.......double standards Mr Goodman......take Audley's jive, The amount of 'faffin about' by Audley, for Christ sakes he played the piano for half the routine, yet no mention of this in his critique of the dance, if that had been choreographed by Aliona I know the first words out of his mouth would be...'too much faffin about'.

Grow a pair Mr Goodman.
ESPIONdansant
29-10-2011
In the doghouse? You betcha.
The guy can dance, woman! Let him dance!
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