It didn't work for me I'm afraid. It failed as an AS because I wouldn't have known it was supposed to be one if I hadn't heard the intro, and it failed as a ballet routine as it seemed a tad clumsy and soulless imo - although it probably didn't help that I watched a dvd of the Bolshoi performing the Nutcracker in the afternoon

I liked it well enough but it just wasn't an AS for me .

The American Smooth is one of my favorite dances and I really like Holly, I would have liked to see something more traditional.

But saying that it was brave to do the dance that they did and it was a pretty dance, it was one of my favs of the night. The thing that made it so good for me was also what made it bad.

I normally love Artem's choreography and I adore the AS but I didn't like this at all. I didn't recognise it as an AS and to my untrained eye Holly looked very awkward in it.

Also, I didn't see how it fitted into the theme of the evening!

Trust me, there isn't. Look at the Kartem threads for yourself and you'll find support for Holly - and for other pairings too. Kartemites are a supportive and positive bunch (most of the time ) and I don't know why peeps think there is any Holly-hatred going on. *scratches head*

i loved it, more-so for the idea than the actual performance, once the music started it was quite chilling, should of got tens

'Fraid I can't control what thoughts run through my mind when I'm watching a dance Ignazio. So in a way, it is unavoidabe (for me).

I know you've listed other examples where comparisons weren't made from one year to the next (although I'd argue Christine did suffer a little), but this situation just feels different.

Artem's choreography is so unique and we got very used to Kara pulling it off time after time. Artem's bravely been putting together creative and challenging routines for Holly in the hope of repeating that success, but she hasn't quite done them justice (although she came close last night).

If Artem was trotting out bog standard choreography week in week out, I doubt the comparions would crop up. But he's an artist and a risk taker so he can't help but get carried away. The trouble is, it takes a really special dancer to make his routines work. Holly's getting there though. And I do like the girl.

I guess we'll agree to disagree on this one - you see whilst I can see that the choreo is excellent there are other elements to a partnership. It's necessary to reate confidence in a partner and bring some spark to the relationship and I just don't see Artem doing that. As I said it wasn't too difficult for him to portray passion and ardour etc. when dancing with the woman he'd fallen for - and perhaps therein lies a problem. His routines are superb, his dancing exciting but maybe his acting skills are a little lacking. He should be able to emote when necessary even though he's not partnering Kara. The sooner he realises that Holly isn't Kara but an individual with positive characteristics of her own the sooner they might start moving closer to the top of the leader board.

I can think of only two past winners who have become romantically involved with their parters - Brendan in series 1 and Artem last year. In all other instances the pro has had to draw a performance out of his celeb. Darren Bennett did this with Jill Halfpenny to the degree where not only did they win the trophy but their jive is still considered by most to be the best example of the dance in any series and the most iconic routine of any SCD series. Remembering that Darren, though married to the beautiful and talented Lilia, managed to get the best from Jill I think Artem should be able to do the same for Holly and I actually think it's Artem who's falling short more than his partner.

Series 4 saw Darren dancing with Emma Bunton - considered by many to be a serious contender. Didn't hear anyone saying "Imagine what Jill would have done with that." And similarly no one drew comparisons when he partnered Letitia Dean.

The pairing of Vincent and Louisa was excellent and some of their routines superb - Vincent managed to draw the best out of Louisa despite the fact that at the time he was happily ensconced with his long term partner Flavia. In series 6 he took Rachel to 2nd place (they were robbed) but when he was paired with Natalie Cassidy not even her fiercest critics compared her to Rachel or Louisa.

Lilia didn't let her marriage to Darren get in the way of drawing the necessary emotion from her partners. She won with Darren Gough and was runner up with Matt Dawson - both of whom had early problems 'acting' the dance.

So tbh I don't think this situation is any different - Artem is the professional and should be able put on an act of love - after all it's only 90 seconds.

xxx

It's healthy to disagree from time to time Ignazio, it keeps the passion alive!

Kara & Artem have nothing on us

X

Sorry, noone, no offence meant. I don't normally take what I'm told as gospel truth without finding out for myself, so apologies for that! I don't have a lot of time to come on here and tend to just dip into a few threads when I can!

I absolutely loved it, artem once again shows us why he's a genius at choreography. And to all those saying it was not an AS, well it was a themed week and there so many dances that were not true to the type of dance on the night. Holly and artem were given the theme swan lake and a very difficult piece of music, so i think considering those things, i thought they pulled it off pretty well,

Totally agree. OK as a dance - but NOT an American Smooth.

Really beautiful, I think Artem is so talented and very handsome.

I adore Artem's choreography and he is a great dancer, so the Artem-loving part of me has been having a stand-up row with the 'dahnce purist' part of me that, erm, wanted to see an American Smooth, not a cod-ballet.

I'm not worried about what percentage of the dance was in hold, yada, yada (Artem's AS last year was utterly brilliant despite not being in hold), but Swan Lake is ballet music, not a foxtrot, so, for me, the routine encapsulated what I dislike most about themed weeks - that the dances are shoehorned into fitting the chosen tracks, rather than the music being chosen to fit a particular dance style.

Sorry, Artem and Holly, but I guess the dahnce purist won the argument.

I loved it too.

I'm not a Holly or Artem fan particularly, but I had to admit that was a beautiful dance. I think for the first time she did put her all into it, rather than holding back.

No need for apologies. I was aiming the reply to everyone in general really because it's the second time - on various threads - I've read that Kartemites don't like Holly and it's just not true. I wanted to set the record straight and didn't mean to single you out.

I did not suggest that there is any Holly hatred going on but..... I have read a number of comments along the lines of "What would Kara have done with that?" and whilst these are not expressing hatred they are expressing a negativity towards Holly.

Of course this does not apply to all Kartem supporters but there are some who cannot view the Holly/Artem without invoking the ghost of Kara.

No need to apologise for accepting comments I made - I spoke as it is.

There are a number of KA supporters who cannot accept Holly without, as I say above, invoking the ghost of Kara.

Said ghost being an incredible dancer and a lovely young woman.

I blame the stupid themes weeks.

I do know what you mean Peeve I liked it, after getting my eye in , but like you would have much preferred an ordinary AS.

I wonder was it because Artem wanted a contrast from the previous week or perhaps Holly did state a preference for ballet - I think she says something about how much she's loving ballet in the ITT vt. Who knows.

Really, I just wish that we could have really lovely ordinary ballroom dances to proper dance music. It ain't going to happen though, is it.

Like many others I thought it was a very good dance, and could have been an excellent dance had it been kept as a show dance, assuming Holly had reached the final, and thus had two more months of intensive dance training. However, it clearly wasn't an American Smooth, and I was surprised that Len in particular didn't mark it down for that reason as he has consistently penalised dances (especially, it would seem, those choreographed by Aliona) that veer away too much from the standard criteria for the given discipline.

I don't really think this is the case either - although a couple of posters did scream some frustration a while back but quickly got over it.

The Kartem thread has always been critical (not negative) and we were just as opinionated and critical of Kartem, and others last year and this year is no exception. The general tone is one of humour really and perhaps you might have read comments out of context. I've seen precious little negativity, and of course we compare to Kara (who was exceptional, IMO) but everyone on this board compares and contrasts dancers so I don't see why it can't happen in Kartem-world every now and again.

Perhaps you're confusing being critical with being negative. If I say Holly could have more strength of line and more conviction am I being negative? I don't think I am, I'm being critical and wanting Holly to do better because I know she can.

Hiya, Noone! *waves*

I think, had it been, oh I dunno, a lyrical dance on SYTYCD or something, I'd have thought it was great, but I was already grumpy about the whole Halloween theme nonsense. For me, only Jason and Kristina managed a dance that would not have been out of place in an un-themed week, if you know what I mean. By and large, last year's Halloween night managed at least to produce dances that there noticeably the dances they were supposed to be, but this year all that went out of the window, or so it seemed to me.

But you're right - with Strictly raking in the viewers, TPTB are hardly going to change tack. I really, really don't mind it being primarily an entertainment show and not a dance competition; I don't mind props if they are used sparingly and are appropriate to the dance; and I am NOT invoking the ghost of Kara every time Artem dances with A N Other; but I can't help wishing he'd done a classy AS to a proper showtune - Witchcraft, or even Bewitched, Bothered and Bewildered (speeded up a bit) would have fitted the theme, no?

There you have it. A dance to a showtune. That's what was required.

But hey - they probably won't end up bottom 2. No spoilers from ME!

So, as long as Artem doesn't go all 'Aliona' on us they may produce a proper dance next week.

I agree with everything you've said, I posted more or less the same on the Kartem or Hartem thread earlier. The theme and song choices were so forced that as soon as the music for Jason started I was immediately relieved and charmed - the same for Chelsee and Pasha last week.


Eek! Surely, Artem has more talent...I mean sense.

Loved it. And the greatest music ever heard on Strictly.

I assure you I'm fully aware of the definitions of negativity and criticism - and thus the difference between the two.

I do not take comments out of context - if a poster says "what would Kara have done with that," or "Imagine Kara in that routine," that is not a critique it is a hypothetical comparison (by those still living in the glory of the past) to Holly's detriment, The implication is clear - Kara would have turned in a better performance than Holly.

No you are not being negative - that is a comment based on her performance i.e. a critique.

Kara is a lovely young woman; a beauty and yes she was (maybe still is) a fantastic dancer - but this year is about the Holly/Arterm partnership and I'd like to see it being given a fair crack of the whip without invoking the nostalgia of last year.

Of course we compare and contrast dancers - but such comparisons usually relate to the current season; i.e. best celeb ever, best routine ever, best partnership ever etc. I'd like to see the evidence where any celeb, from any series is compared to her partner's previous partner as frequently (and as detrimentally) as Holly.

I'm confident that I've posted positively and sufficiently frequently about Kara and Artem to justify my opinion that it's time even the most ardent K/A supporters recognise that this is 2011 not 2010.