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Hate for Aliona
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Eugenie
01-11-2011
Originally Posted by Aleksis:
“And if you can actually watch it and apparently identify everything Aliona does "wrong" you can then articulate specifically what it is that proves Aliona "isn't teaching him the dances" or "makes it all about her" or whatever else she's accused of.”

Good response!
petertard
01-11-2011
Aliona is young(ish) and still learning herself. Should she be better than she is, at 27 ?
Alli-F
01-11-2011
Originally Posted by petertard:
“Aliona is young(ish) and still learning herself. Should she be better than she is, at 27 ?”



Artem and Pasha are roughly the same age. Looking at them, without knowing their exact ages, Natalie, Ola and Flavia don't look much older either.
kroshka
01-11-2011
A brief pause in the waltz choreography was a marmite moment, and Halloween week was, it seems, all about entertainment value as opposed to technical prowess.

Viewers are fickle as to whether or not the show is about dance and choreography, or whose pecs are better at any given week. Aliona is doing a great job with Harry, not just dancing around him like other pros with their celebs, and I trust her ability to let him grow.

It's so easy to hate Aliona/her choreography - she's young, attractive and thinks outside of the norm. Torches and pitchforks, everyone!
Xassy
01-11-2011
Originally Posted by kroshka:
“It's so easy to hate Aliona/her choreography - she's young, attractive and thinks outside of the norm. Torches and pitchforks, everyone!”

Yes, that is exactly it. We're jealous! Same old line always trotted out.

Now, Flavia I am actually jealous of!
Alli-F
01-11-2011
Originally Posted by Xassy:
“Yes, that is exactly it. We're jealous! Same old line always trotted out.

Now, Flavia I am actually jealous of! ”



Bingo, I had being called a jellus hatah on Strictly Bingo.

Still waiting for the blinking dead nan though. Bloomin' amateur celebs, get Scott in to show 'em how to do Strictly Bingo properly!
kittles
01-11-2011
Originally Posted by Alli-F:
“Bingo, I had being called a jellus hatah on Strictly Bingo.

Still waiting for the blinking dead nan though. Bloomin' amateur celebs, get Scott in to show 'em how to do Strictly Bingo properly! ”

I must admit we haven't had a jellus hatah accusation for a while

I know frankly bugger all about technique and choreography other than what I've picked up on SCD

all I know is, when harry gets into hold and dances proper tango or waltz steps I absolutely love it because he's very very good and the moment faffing about happens, I'm disappointed.
cymrugirl
01-11-2011
Yay! Someone mentioned jellus hatahs.
TheAuburnEnigma
01-11-2011
Originally Posted by Alli-F:
“Artem and Pasha are roughly the same age. Looking at them, without knowing their exact ages, Natalie, Ola and Flavia don't look much older either. ”

I might be able to slightly help here.

Aliona is the youngest of the current Strictly pros (according to the BBC Strictly website where one of their quizzes asks that very question - I thought it was Katya so I got that wrong).

Pasha is 31, and Ola is 29 I think.
Flavia's 30 (pretty sure there's a 2-3 year age difference between her and Vincent), fairly certain Natalie is in her 30s as well and I think Artem will be 29 now.

I've had a look at Aliona's website where it has her achievements as a professional - she may not have won any competitions but she did usually come in the top 10 for Latin. All but one of her competitions were Latin (the other was a 10 Dance) so I presume she is a specialist there. Maybe she's not as confident with ballroom choreography? (If this were the case though then she should have asked for help when she first started SCD, if not last year).
Alli-F
01-11-2011
Originally Posted by cymrugirl:
“Yay! Someone mentioned jellus hatahs.”




Walks just like me!
Originally Posted by TheAuburnEnigma:
“I might be able to slightly help here.

Aliona is the youngest of the current Strictly pros (according to the BBC Strictly website where one of their quizzes asks that very question - I thought it was Katya so I got that wrong).

Pasha is 31, and Ola is 29 I think.
Flavia's 30 (pretty sure there's a 2-3 year age difference between her and Vincent) and I think Artem will be 29 now.

I've had a look at Aliona's website where it has her achievements as a professional - she may not have won any competitions but she did usually come in the top 10 for Latin. All but one of her competitions were Latin (the other was a 10 Dance) so I presume she is a specialist there. Maybe she's not as confident with ballroom choreography? (If this were the case though then she should have asked for help when she first started SCD, if not last year).”


Thanks for the info hun!
olivej
01-11-2011
Aliona is like marmite

You either love her or you hate her

I love her!!

Personally I think she is a breath of fresh air to Strictly, I love her choreography and she is the loveliest person I have met in a long time - shy, but perfectly lovely
kassieq
01-11-2011
Originally Posted by Xassy:
“Yes, that is exactly it. We're jealous! Same old line always trotted out.

Now, Flavia I am actually jealous of! ”

Me too, that figure, sighs, she has the perfect figure I never got
perdiedumpling
01-11-2011
Originally Posted by TheAuburnEnigma:
“I might be able to slightly help here.

Aliona is the youngest of the current Strictly pros (according to the BBC Strictly website where one of their quizzes asks that very question - I thought it was Katya so I got that wrong).

Pasha is 31, and Ola is 29 I think.
Flavia's 30 (pretty sure there's a 2-3 year age difference between her and Vincent), fairly certain Natalie is in her 30s as well and I think Artem will be 29 now.

I've had a look at Aliona's website where it has her achievements as a professional - she may not have won any competitions but she did usually come in the top 10 for Latin. All but one of her competitions were Latin (the other was a 10 Dance) so I presume she is a specialist there. Maybe she's not as confident with ballroom choreography? (If this were the case though then she should have asked for help when she first started SCD, if not last year).”

I think most of the pros are Latin specialists, barring Erin, Anton & Natalie who are ballroom, and Vincent & Flavia who are/were 10 dancers. So being less confident with ballroom choreography would be relatively common amongst the pros.
petertard
01-11-2011
I think her choreography has improved from last year; so she will get more experience again this year but may not be able to create the perfect mix of crowd and judge pleasing dances until maybe another year or two. If you bear her age in mind, the way she does things makes more sense.
Azla Axe
01-11-2011
Originally Posted by RichmondBlue:
“Fair enough. I'll say straight away that I'm no dance expert, just an enthusiastic follower of Strictly.
But didn't Artem and Aliona both have blank canvases with Holly and Harry ? If anything. Holly had (slightly) more experience, a pop singer/actress should adapt easier to the disciplines of dance, as opposed to a drummer in a group ?
I know that's a wild generalisation.but I bet it's what many people thought. So. I think there's a lot of credit due to Aliona..Harry has turned out to be very good, but it's no accident of nature, as far as I know he wasn't a "born dancer"..he's been taught.”

I don't agree that because Holly gyrated and posed for pop video clips should be considered to have dancing experience. Harry did the paso, but also as a drummer he's got an advantage because drumming requires great body co-ordination.

Originally Posted by -Sid-:
“Personally, I'd like to see whoever the celebrity in question is, to do a routine full of content - whether it's Harry, Holly or Edwina. Isn't that what they used to do in the early days of Strictly before faffing became fashionable?”

To be honest Sid, I'd rather watch a lot of faffing about on a Saturday night, over badly executed full of content routines. Ideally, I would have liked to watch good quality full of content routines, but could only happen if the contestants were allowed to take ballroom lessons prior to the show. In the timeframe they are given, i don't believe they can produce a routine that is enjoyable to watch AND full of content. Well, at least that's the case with most of the contestants.

Originally Posted by Aleksis:
“I get that people don't like her choreography choices and I'm not saying no one is allowed to dislike them; in this thread I'm more concerned with people bringing up the old statements about her making the routines more about her than her partner and not being a good teacher, but not backing it up with anything.”

Ok, I'll try a bit of backing up for you. The main been about her choreography is the lack of content. For example, her tango with Harry had 18% tango, and 82% faffing. That is 17 secs of tango in a 94 sec routine. That's just not enough tango for a tango routine, especially when the faffing is not particularly clever or spectacular. I can't "prove" that last bit to you, because it's personal taste.

Regarding the routines being more about her than about her partner. Various reasons for that. Firstly, her choreography is more about materialising and showcasing her ideas and inspirations and less about what suits her partner. An example of that is her American Smooth with the contemporary twist she did with Matt. Lots of what one might consider "innovative" ideas, but the whole style and feel of the dance just didn't suite Matt, and she should have picked up on that and adjust her choreography rather than impose it on him.

Secondly, she is using SCD to challenge herself, and that's a bit selfish, and not particularly fair to her partner. An example of that is her showdance with Matt. She tried to do a commercial/street dance routine, and she is just not good enough in these genres. Her dancing was awful, as so was the choreography.

Finally, the decorations she add in her dances are usually about her, and dancing around her partner, although to be fair other pros do that as well, but combined with the above, it's just more prominent from Aliona.

About her being a bad teacher, well, I am not qualified to judge anybody's teaching techniques, but logic detects that if you reduce the training time spent on perfecting the faffing and the theatrical elements of the routine and increase the time spent on practicing technical elements, the your student's dancing should improve. Since we don't have knowledge of the training, it is not possible to form an opinion.
Alli-F
01-11-2011
Originally Posted by Azla Axe:
“I don't agree that because Holly gyrated and posed for pop video clips should be considered to have dancing experience. Harry did the paso, but also as a drummer he's got an advantage because drumming requires great body co-ordination.



To be honest Sid, I'd rather watch a lot of faffing about on a Saturday night, over badly executed full of content routines. Ideally, I would have liked to watch good quality full of content routines, but could only happen if the contestants were allowed to take ballroom lessons prior to the show. In the timeframe they are given, i don't believe they can produce a routine that is enjoyable to watch AND full of content. Well, at least that's the case with most of the contestants.



Ok, I'll try a bit of backing up for you. The main been about her choreography is the lack of content. For example, her tango with Harry had 18% tango, and 82% faffing. That is 17 secs of tango in a 94 sec routine. That's just not enough tango for a tango routine, especially when the faffing is not particularly clever or spectacular. I can't "prove" that last bit to you, because it's personal taste.

Regarding the routines being more about her than about her partner. Various reasons for that. Firstly, her choreography is more about materialising and showcasing her ideas and inspirations and less about what suits her partner. An example of that is her American Smooth with the contemporary twist she did with Matt. Lots of what one might consider "innovative" ideas, but the whole style and feel of the dance just didn't suite Matt, and she should have picked up on that and adjust her choreography rather than impose it on him.

Secondly, she is using SCD to challenge herself, and that's a bit selfish, and not particularly fair to her partner. An example of that is her showdance with Matt. She tried to do a commercial/street dance routine, and she is just not good enough in these genres. Her dancing was awful, as so was the choreography.

Finally, the decorations she add in her dances are usually about her, and dancing around her partner, although to be fair other pros do that as well, but combined with the above, it's just more prominent from Aliona.

About her being a bad teacher, well, I am not qualified to judge anybody's teaching techniques, but logic detects that if you reduce the training time spent on perfecting the faffing and the theatrical elements of the routine and increase the time spent on practicing technical elements, the your student's dancing should improve. Since we don't have knowledge of the training, it is not possible to form an opinion.”

Fabulous post hun, thanks for the breakdown of the tango. I think if Harry's wrapping his legs around the chair had counted as "in hold" they'd have definitely made the time limit for amount in hold.
lynxmale
01-11-2011
You people are all so greedy. She's got legs and twirls in a short skirt every other week, what more do you want?
Alli-F
01-11-2011
Originally Posted by lynxmale:
“You people are all so greedy. She's got legs and twirls in a short skirt every other week, what more do you want?”



I know! Imagine wanting actual tango steps in a tango! We're just poor deluded hatahs though!
Azla Axe
01-11-2011
Originally Posted by Alli-F:
“Fabulous post hun, thanks for the breakdown of the tango.”

My pleasure.

Quote:
“I think if Harry's wrapping his legs around the chair had counted as "in hold" they'd have definitely made the time limit for amount in hold. ”

Quite! And if Aliona having him by the balls counts as "in hold", then they haven't been off hold since day 1!
Jan2555*GG*
01-11-2011
I think one of the things that I get annoyed by...is the 'whatever' eye rolling expression she does when the judges say they want more content...

Anyway Karen Hardy said on ITT tonight that there was only 17 seconds of Tango in that Tango.
lynxmale
01-11-2011
Originally Posted by Jan2555*GG*:
“I think one of the things that I get annoyed by...is the 'whatever' eye rolling expression she does when the judges say they want more content...”

My attitude always stiffens when I see that
lotty27
01-11-2011
Originally Posted by Azla Axe:
“Ok, I'll try a bit of backing up for you. The main been about her choreography is the lack of content. For example, her tango with Harry had 18% tango, and 82% faffing. That is 17 secs of tango in a 94 sec routine. That's just not enough tango for a tango routine, especially when the faffing is not particularly clever or spectacular. I can't "prove" that last bit to you, because it's personal taste.

Regarding the routines being more about her than about her partner. Various reasons for that. Firstly, her choreography is more about materialising and showcasing her ideas and inspirations and less about what suits her partner. An example of that is her American Smooth with the contemporary twist she did with Matt. Lots of what one might consider "innovative" ideas, but the whole style and feel of the dance just didn't suite Matt, and she should have picked up on that and adjust her choreography rather than impose it on him.

Secondly, she is using SCD to challenge herself, and that's a bit selfish, and not particularly fair to her partner. An example of that is her showdance with Matt. She tried to do a commercial/street dance routine, and she is just not good enough in these genres. Her dancing was awful, as so was the choreography.

Finally, the decorations she add in her dances are usually about her, and dancing around her partner, although to be fair other pros do that as well, but combined with the above, it's just more prominent from Aliona.

About her being a bad teacher, well, I am not qualified to judge anybody's teaching techniques, but logic detects that if you reduce the training time spent on perfecting the faffing and the theatrical elements of the routine and increase the time spent on practicing technical elements, the your student's dancing should improve. Since we don't have knowledge of the training, it is not possible to form an opinion.”

Excellent post. Sums up how I feel too

Originally Posted by Jan2555*GG*:
“I think one of the things that I get annoyed by...is the 'whatever' eye rolling expression she does when the judges say they want more content...

Anyway Karen Hardy said on ITT tonight that there was only 17 seconds of Tango in that Tango.”

17 seconds of actual tango? That is absolutely ridiculous. IMO she is going too far now but she just doesn't seem to care which is starting to come across as arrogance. And the roll eyeing doesn't help, it's actually very disrespectful.
ewoodie
01-11-2011
Originally Posted by Jan2555*GG*:
“I think one of the things that I get annoyed by...is the 'whatever' eye rolling expression she does when the judges say they want more content...

Anyway Karen Hardy said on ITT tonight that there was only 17 seconds of Tango in that Tango.”

The eye-rolling just compounds the fact that Aliona doesn't care what the judges' think. She looks terribly smug with it at times. Aliona should stick to the rules and do the dance she is supposed to do.

If the other pros took the same attitude as Brendan with his illegal lifts and Aliona who is even worse, the show would be in chaos. The pros job is to teach celebs the dance they are given.
Tiggywink
02-11-2011
I'm very glad that there is a lot of support for Aliona - I think she is an exciting choreographer and I enjoyed her tango routine with Harry. I also agree that his only serious competitor is Chelsee because, apart from her ability to learn quickly and put on a good show, she has won so many hearts which is very very important if you want to win.

I suspect Aliona may still be carrying around the "stigma" of having somehow spoilt Rav Wilding's chances in her first year because, IIRC, they went out pretty early and in fact he did sometimes look awkward with what she was making him do.. she got the blame for that - there again he was perhaps not the right kind of raw material.
Fatima502
02-11-2011
I think she's doing a pretty good job of pleasing most of the people most of the time. After all she did get a 10 from one judge and I suspect that she is high up the leaderboard with the televoters. The BBC must love her considering the partners she's had in the three seasons so far.
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