Fair enough, the design was crap. But if he'd listened to the team at the 'brainstorming' session, the design team would have had a clear concept in mind and packaged the product accordingly. They lost because of the incoherence of the campaign, and that was entirely because they hadn't a clear idea of what they were selling.
HarryM should have gone
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I think it was a very close call between Harry and Ghembi TBH.
Ghembi has such a bad attitude that I think SAS used the fact that the product design was absolutely dire which certainly did'nt help the task.
She was adamant that it was'nt going to be pink or red as requested by the PM.
Also Harry has other skills that Ghembi has'nt shown hence the firing IMHO.
Ghembi has such a bad attitude that I think SAS used the fact that the product design was absolutely dire which certainly did'nt help the task.
She was adamant that it was'nt going to be pink or red as requested by the PM.
Also Harry has other skills that Ghembi has'nt shown hence the firing IMHO.
Lord sugar got that wrong, Harry m I wouldn't send to get a coffee because he would come back with a coffin
Maybe if she just did what Harry M told her and did the bottle red/pink and it would have looked even worse, then she could bury him and she would still be there.
He's a shifty bugger that Harry M
He's a shifty bugger that Harry M
Right decision, IMO.
Gbemi's attitude has been appalling throughout - at least Harry M, with all his faults, actually puts a lot of effort into the tasks.
Gbemi's attitude has been appalling throughout - at least Harry M, with all his faults, actually puts a lot of effort into the tasks.
Originally Posted by marvola45:
“Right decision, IMO.
Gbemi's attitude has been appalling throughout - at least Harry M, with all his faults, actually puts a lot of effort into the tasks.”
“Right decision, IMO.
Gbemi's attitude has been appalling throughout - at least Harry M, with all his faults, actually puts a lot of effort into the tasks.”
Agreed.
Originally Posted by marvola45:
“Right decision, IMO.
Gbemi's attitude has been appalling throughout - at least Harry M, with all his faults, actually puts a lot of effort into the tasks.”
“Right decision, IMO.
Gbemi's attitude has been appalling throughout - at least Harry M, with all his faults, actually puts a lot of effort into the tasks.”
Agreed.
Gbemi has been such a sulky madam from the word go, no matter what the task, and she has contributed little.
Lord sugar got that completely wrong, Harry M is useless and has been most weeks
He doesn't listen, in today's task he only did the video and even got that simple task wrong lol
He doesn't listen, in today's task he only did the video and even got that simple task wrong lol
Originally Posted by BBWorldWideFan:
“Maybe if she just did what Harry M told her and did the bottle red/pink and it would have looked even worse, then she could bury him and she would still be there.
He's a shifty bugger that Harry M”
“Maybe if she just did what Harry M told her and did the bottle red/pink and it would have looked even worse, then she could bury him and she would still be there.
He's a shifty bugger that Harry M
”
I think Harry was relying on the two young Girls to use colouring that would appeal to young girls Light colours pink white red etc.,
Not Black with a gold antique mirror.
She did'nt listen to him or would'nt listen to him..She had a negative attitude all the way through the task and other tasks
That was her downfall and rightly so she was fired.
Harry M should have gone, he's been given the benefit of the doubt with everybody disliking him several times. He now had the chance to be PM and show that he can lead well and form a cohesive team and he failed. The other sub-team got on fine because they were already friends, he surpressed James completely in his own sub-team and because of his lack of leadership qualities each team had different ideas of what was supposed to be their brand.
The bottle was terrible but Gbemi deserved another chance much more than Harry,
The bottle was terrible but Gbemi deserved another chance much more than Harry,
Originally Posted by MrsWatermelon:
“Harry M should have gone, he's been given the benefit of the doubt with everybody disliking him several times. He now had the chance to be PM and show that he can lead well and form a cohesive team and he failed. The other sub-team got on fine because they were already friends, he surpressed James completely in his own sub-team and because of his lack of leadership qualities each team had different ideas of what was supposed to be their brand.
The bottle was terrible but Gbemi deserved another chance much more than Harry,”
“Harry M should have gone, he's been given the benefit of the doubt with everybody disliking him several times. He now had the chance to be PM and show that he can lead well and form a cohesive team and he failed. The other sub-team got on fine because they were already friends, he surpressed James completely in his own sub-team and because of his lack of leadership qualities each team had different ideas of what was supposed to be their brand.
The bottle was terrible but Gbemi deserved another chance much more than Harry,”
What has Gbemi Done throughout the series that has shown any form of business sense or salesmanship?
For a Leader to Lead, he must have Followers who will Follow.
But when his Followers will not follow him, no matter what he says, just to spite him, then even the best of Leaders is up excrement creek without a means of propulsion.
Not that Harry is the best of leaders - I think that if his team were not so negatively disposed towards him, he might make a reasonable, perhaps even good, leader, no more.
Perhaps he learned this technique of putting his foot down and make his decisions without reference to his team members from his team leader last week....
Harry was right to bring Gbemi and James in, and Sir Alan was right to fire Gbemi, whilst making it clear that Harry survived by the skin of his teeth.
But when his Followers will not follow him, no matter what he says, just to spite him, then even the best of Leaders is up excrement creek without a means of propulsion.
Not that Harry is the best of leaders - I think that if his team were not so negatively disposed towards him, he might make a reasonable, perhaps even good, leader, no more.
Perhaps he learned this technique of putting his foot down and make his decisions without reference to his team members from his team leader last week....
Harry was right to bring Gbemi and James in, and Sir Alan was right to fire Gbemi, whilst making it clear that Harry survived by the skin of his teeth.
Harry was present last week, when Haya narrowly escaped being fired because of her refusal to listen to team mates. It's one thing to hear ideas, discuss them and then reject them in favour of your own as team leader. It's quite another to refuse to even listen to the reasoning of your team mates. Bottom line, James was right. They should have started with a concept of what they wanted the product to do. The incoherence, the lousy packaging, the mixed message of the campaign was all down to that initial failure, which was Harry's alone. The 'brainstorming' session was probably heavily edited, but the impression was that Harry was simply refusing to listen to other viewpoints.
I take your points about Gbemi, she hasn't come over well at all throughout the competition. But the failure of tonight's task was down to HarryM.
I take your points about Gbemi, she hasn't come over well at all throughout the competition. But the failure of tonight's task was down to HarryM.
Originally Posted by Dogmatix:
“Not that Harry is the best of leaders - I think that if his team were not so negatively disposed towards him, he might make a reasonable, perhaps even good, leader, no more.”
“Not that Harry is the best of leaders - I think that if his team were not so negatively disposed towards him, he might make a reasonable, perhaps even good, leader, no more.”
He was, in their defence, iffy from the first second. Coming up with the name first was a very weird call, and he adamantly stuck to it, demonstrating no intention whatsoever to listen to the others. I can't say I wouldn't be in just as much of a huff as the rest of 'em. He was giving it a bit of the Rory Laing, confirming their expectations straight out of the gate.
But yes, it is a two way street, so I'm not saying James and Lizzie were perfect. If they'd co-operated more then... well, they had the better ad anyway, so I don't know what they could've done better. I guess I just struggled to disagree with the way they reacted.
Originally Posted by Isotope:
“Well, they were as bad as each other, but Harry makes better Tv....”
“Well, they were as bad as each other, but Harry makes better Tv....”
Can't argue with that!
Originally Posted by rwebster:
“He was, in their defence, iffy from the first second. Coming up with the name first was a very weird call, and he adamantly stuck to it, demonstrating no intention whatsoever to listen to the others. I can't say I wouldn't be in just as much of a huff as the rest of 'em. He was giving it a bit of the Rory Laing, confirming their expectations straight out of the gate.
But yes, it is a two way street, so I'm not saying James and Lizzie were perfect. If they'd co-operated more then... well, they had the better ad anyway, so I don't know what they could've done better. I guess I just struggled to disagree with the way they reacted.”
“He was, in their defence, iffy from the first second. Coming up with the name first was a very weird call, and he adamantly stuck to it, demonstrating no intention whatsoever to listen to the others. I can't say I wouldn't be in just as much of a huff as the rest of 'em. He was giving it a bit of the Rory Laing, confirming their expectations straight out of the gate.
But yes, it is a two way street, so I'm not saying James and Lizzie were perfect. If they'd co-operated more then... well, they had the better ad anyway, so I don't know what they could've done better. I guess I just struggled to disagree with the way they reacted.”
You're not wrong. If they'd just decided to make the best of it and ran with his way of doing things rather than arguing and pushing against him at every turn, then the whole thing would have been a lot smoother and they could easily have salvaged a better campaign.
They were overly aggressive in their protests, particularly James.
Originally Posted by RomolaDesLoups:
“Harry was present last week, when Haya narrowly escaped being fired because of her refusal to listen to team mates. It's one thing to hear ideas, discuss them and then reject them in favour of your own as team leader. It's quite another to refuse to even listen to the reasoning of your team mates.”
“Harry was present last week, when Haya narrowly escaped being fired because of her refusal to listen to team mates. It's one thing to hear ideas, discuss them and then reject them in favour of your own as team leader. It's quite another to refuse to even listen to the reasoning of your team mates.”
Ironically enough, most of the other episodes he was on the other side of the debate.
Originally Posted by RomolaDesLoups:
“Bottom line, James was right. They should have started with a concept of what they wanted the product to do. The incoherence, the lousy packaging, the mixed message of the campaign was all down to that initial failure, which was Harry's alone. The 'brainstorming' session was probably heavily edited, but the impression was that Harry was simply refusing to listen to other viewpoints.”
“Bottom line, James was right. They should have started with a concept of what they wanted the product to do. The incoherence, the lousy packaging, the mixed message of the campaign was all down to that initial failure, which was Harry's alone. The 'brainstorming' session was probably heavily edited, but the impression was that Harry was simply refusing to listen to other viewpoints.”
Well, the mirror was mainly Gbemi´s idea (though was surprised to hear that James wanted a mirror, was that supposed to give support to Gbemi or did that fail to make the edit
).Wonder if Harry M will get the Tom treatment and he will escape again next week (if his team loses, which I would never bet against).
It was a close call. I'm rather fond of Harry M but his leadership was painful to watch at times. What saves him a lot of the time is sheer enthusiasm, and I think ultimately that's very valuable. His management skills are very naive, however, even for a teenager.
But, and this is the important thing I think in this case, as wrong as he gets his manner a lot of the time (and I suspect some of the negative feelings many of the others display for him isn't entirely his fault but as much a reaction to his accent), he's contributed some impressive things to previous tasks. I can't actually remember a single thing Gbemi has contributed previously.
Add to that the fact that she claims she's a designer, yet the design was about as bad as a design can be, and I think she'd dug her own grave unfortunately.
But, and this is the important thing I think in this case, as wrong as he gets his manner a lot of the time (and I suspect some of the negative feelings many of the others display for him isn't entirely his fault but as much a reaction to his accent), he's contributed some impressive things to previous tasks. I can't actually remember a single thing Gbemi has contributed previously.
Add to that the fact that she claims she's a designer, yet the design was about as bad as a design can be, and I think she'd dug her own grave unfortunately.
I cannot believe he got away with that one. Seriously, I know that Gbemi isn't much better, but he was a horrible PM, didn't listen to anyone's ideas, went for women as a target market without even discussing it with his team and he has lost five times! FIVE TIMES! We only have three tasks left! I dislike Gbemi, but she wasn't directed at all.
At the very least, he was smart enough to not bring back Lizzie (which would have been the nail in his coffin).
On the other team, I was disappointed by Hayley's comment on Zara's leadership which was purely based on when they were editing the advert. Zara was the PM and the expert in that area. If there is a difference of opinion and that's the only issue then the PM and expert should go with what she feels is best.
At the very least, he was smart enough to not bring back Lizzie (which would have been the nail in his coffin).
On the other team, I was disappointed by Hayley's comment on Zara's leadership which was purely based on when they were editing the advert. Zara was the PM and the expert in that area. If there is a difference of opinion and that's the only issue then the PM and expert should go with what she feels is best.
Harry is making this show for me. He's hilarious.
"Just save it" - with his hand gestures and facial expressions. Genius. Definitely a legendary Apprentice contestant in my eyes.
"Just save it" - with his hand gestures and facial expressions. Genius. Definitely a legendary Apprentice contestant in my eyes.
Originally Posted by BBWorldWideFan:
“Maybe if she just did what Harry M told her and did the bottle red/pink and it would have looked even worse, then she could bury him and she would still be there.
He's a shifty bugger that Harry M”
“Maybe if she just did what Harry M told her and did the bottle red/pink and it would have looked even worse, then she could bury him and she would still be there.
He's a shifty bugger that Harry M
”
He is everything about the capitalist world I dislike.
Telling everyone what to do when he hasn't got a clue or a personality,
Originally Posted by Dogmatix:
“For a Leader to Lead, he must have Followers who will Follow.
But when his Followers will not follow him, no matter what he says, just to spite him, then even the best of Leaders is up excrement creek without a means of propulsion.
Not that Harry is the best of leaders - I think that if his team were not so negatively disposed towards him, he might make a reasonable, perhaps even good, leader, no more.
Perhaps he learned this technique of putting his foot down and make his decisions without reference to his team members from his team leader last week....
Harry was right to bring Gbemi and James in, and Sir Alan was right to fire Gbemi, whilst making it clear that Harry survived by the skin of his teeth.”
“For a Leader to Lead, he must have Followers who will Follow.
But when his Followers will not follow him, no matter what he says, just to spite him, then even the best of Leaders is up excrement creek without a means of propulsion.
Not that Harry is the best of leaders - I think that if his team were not so negatively disposed towards him, he might make a reasonable, perhaps even good, leader, no more.
Perhaps he learned this technique of putting his foot down and make his decisions without reference to his team members from his team leader last week....
Harry was right to bring Gbemi and James in, and Sir Alan was right to fire Gbemi, whilst making it clear that Harry survived by the skin of his teeth.”
This was a perfect post.
It's exactly how I saw it. The fact that Harry has been on the losing team 5 times is irrelavent. Harry M has displayed extreme entrepreneurial skills throughout the process, is eager and full of ideas. He has a pompous way about him and he was never going to be liked by people, who bar a few, are simply inferior to him as would-be business people.
Gbemi is one such person, her arsey negative presence has stymied so much enthuisiasm that others have had that she was screaming out to be fired. LS used the crap can design as an excuse to get rid of her. LS sees a lot of himself in Harry, and Harry will go further in life than Gbemi.
Harry M will ultimately get fired because he will be brought into the BR every time he is on the losing team by his jealous team 'mates' but the guy deserves to go far, he's a nice lad who just doesn't fit the mould. Doesn't make him a bad person, far from it and I felt really sorry for him when Hayley gave him a cursory hug because no-one else did, and the equally smug Harry H beleives himself too popular and cool to acknowledge his namesake
James pointing out that LS nearly fired Harry was amusing, LS was never going to fire Harry, James maybe, but not Harry M. LS likes him, deep down.
Originally Posted by The Rhydler:
“This was a perfect post.
It's exactly how I saw it. The fact that Harry has been on the losing team 5 times is irrelavent. Harry M has displayed extreme entrepreneurial skills throughout the process, is eager and full of ideas. He has a pompous way about him and he was never going to be liked by people, who bar a few, are simply inferior to him as would-be business people.
Gbemi is one such person, her arsey negative presence has stymied so much enthuisiasm that others have had that she was screaming out to be fired. LS used the crap can design as an excuse to get rid of her. LS sees a lot of himself in Harry, and Harry will go further in life than Gbemi.
Harry M will ultimately get fired because he will be brought into the BR every time he is on the losing team by his jealous team 'mates' but the guy deserves to go far, he's a nice lad who just doesn't fit the mould. Doesn't make him a bad person, far from it and I felt really sorry for him when Hayley gave him a cursory hug because no-one else did, and the equally smug Harry H beleives himself too popular and cool to acknowledge his namesake
James pointing out that LS nearly fired Harry was amusing, LS was never going to fire Harry, James maybe, but not Harry M. LS likes him, deep down.”
“This was a perfect post.
It's exactly how I saw it. The fact that Harry has been on the losing team 5 times is irrelavent. Harry M has displayed extreme entrepreneurial skills throughout the process, is eager and full of ideas. He has a pompous way about him and he was never going to be liked by people, who bar a few, are simply inferior to him as would-be business people.
Gbemi is one such person, her arsey negative presence has stymied so much enthuisiasm that others have had that she was screaming out to be fired. LS used the crap can design as an excuse to get rid of her. LS sees a lot of himself in Harry, and Harry will go further in life than Gbemi.
Harry M will ultimately get fired because he will be brought into the BR every time he is on the losing team by his jealous team 'mates' but the guy deserves to go far, he's a nice lad who just doesn't fit the mould. Doesn't make him a bad person, far from it and I felt really sorry for him when Hayley gave him a cursory hug because no-one else did, and the equally smug Harry H beleives himself too popular and cool to acknowledge his namesake
James pointing out that LS nearly fired Harry was amusing, LS was never going to fire Harry, James maybe, but not Harry M. LS likes him, deep down.”
I disagree. Harry M has no clue about working in a team and is put out when his ideas don't get accepted. When made PM he simply decided to have his way on everything, that's poor leadership. In contrast Zara listened to other ideas, some of which she wasn't keen on, but used them in the end without making a fuss.
People go on about Gbemi's bad attitude, and it was poor in the first couple of shows. This week she kept it in check most of the time, though her design was terrible and she ignored the direction she was given, albeit it was Harry M's autocratic but vague direction.
Harry M can sell, but it doesn't matter how good he is at that if he can't get on with his team mates. The other Harry is far more impressive. He's got good business qualities and he gets on with others easily.
On the evidence of the task Harry M was more culpable. It fell apart from the off: no clear concept, no direction, no storyboard. The girls' packaging was a mess, but a good ad might have overcome that. The ad didn't really show the product at all. TBH, both Harry M and Gbemi deserved the sack, I think it came down to which one Sugar was most keen to fire while he had the chance.
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