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UK attitude toward success or people with educated backgrounds


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Old 22-11-2011, 09:24
squadge
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When I first moved to this country over 20 years ago, I was prepared to perhaps believe my other half that the more well off/better educated folk of this land were snobs and looked down upon everyone else.

I have found this to be far from the case, indeed, almost the exact opposite and many comments about the Young Apprentice participants typify this attitude.

What is it that people find so annoying about others who have had the benefit of a better education or who have educated themselves to a higher standard than that provided by a bog standard secondary school (or even my local which has a tremendous reputation)? Why do people automatically assume that because a person comes from a family that lives one financial step above them that they are snots? Why is it, that unless you are in the lower finanancial realm with not particular ambition to improve your lot (which is fine) that you tear down others who strive to improve their lot (whether they have the same background as you or not). I find that there are far to many people in this country with major chips on their shoulders towards those that actually make a success of themselves. Yes you may be born into an advantage but you do have to work to keep it. Not everyone has done that in their lives as history will tell you.
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Old 22-11-2011, 09:40
PorkSausage
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Jealousy.

I think there is a lot of inverted snobbery in this country. Some of it is justified by pompous rich people with inherited wealth behaving like idiots. But some people work hard to get what they've got.
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Old 22-11-2011, 10:33
spannerandpony
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Jealousy.

I think there is a lot of inverted snobbery in this country. Some of it is justified by pompous rich people with inherited wealth behaving like idiots. But some people work hard to get what they've got.
Like any issue though, it isn't as clear cut as you suggest, OP. of course there is an element of inverted snobbery in society, just as there is an element of snobbery, racism, homophobia, anti-Police, you name it.

I suspect with some adults though, they may have money worries which could be alleviated with a tiny fraction of what Tamara Ecclestone spends on a bathtub - in which case, seeing moneyed youngsters who have a massive superiority complex purely based on Daddy's money and the school tie is somewhat galling.

If people have worked hard for their money, or even inherited it, I for one don't begrudge them a penny IF they don't automatically assume that they are more important than a cleaner, or a Police Constable, or anyone else.

Actually, WRT the Apprentice, it's not their Financial status which bothers me, or even the fact that Harry M is a Rugbeian. It's anyone who is supercilious and who has an ego problem which makes them shout others down without really listening to them.

Harry M has it, but so do Zara, Gbemi and Mahamed. It's not limited to which school you attended or how much money your family has. It's purely a state of mind and it's that which rubs me up the wrong way.
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Old 22-11-2011, 10:41
squadge
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Well said. Pomposity knows no socio-economic bounds

There are pompous people behaving like idiots the world over.

However, listening to people who get their back up over an accent cracks me up.
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Old 22-11-2011, 11:06
whedon247
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im working class and find myself hating likes of gbemi more than harry m
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Old 22-11-2011, 12:22
dizzyrascal
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It is not so much that people are jealous of the wealth but I do think that (particularly at the moment) it is not helpful when people see extreme and obscene wealth being paraded about. Nobody likes to see greed.
I think the Ecclestone girls are guilty of this (12 million quid for a wedding??)
I get very annoyed when wealthy people say that they got there because of their own hard work/genius etc. I know people who work equally hard but will never be wealthy, either because of the job they do or because they are in difficult financial circumstances.
In my opinion, a great many wealthy people have got there through a combination of luck and/or exploitation of people or resources.
Not everyone actually wants to be wealthy but it is insulting to suggest that by working hard you will get to be rich. The slum children in India work hard but they will never be rich!!
There are a lot of wealthy people out there who do a lot for the less well off. I’m thinking of Peter Jones from Dragon’s Den and the people off Secret Millionaire to name a few. Now those people earn my respect and admiration.
Even Bill Gates realised that he was never going to be able to spend all his money so he put it into a fund/foundation to help the less well off. Apparently Steve Jobs thought he was mad to do this. That tells me a lot about Steve Jobs.
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Old 22-11-2011, 12:25
ChristmasCake
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On the whole, I think you tend to get treated the way you treat other people.
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Old 28-11-2011, 22:23
Cookie Crusher
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It is not so much that people are jealous of the wealth but I do think that (particularly at the moment) it is not helpful when people see extreme and obscene wealth being paraded about. Nobody likes to see greed.
I think the Ecclestone girls are guilty of this (12 million quid for a wedding??)
I get very annoyed when wealthy people say that they got there because of their own hard work/genius etc. I know people who work equally hard but will never be wealthy, either because of the job they do or because they are in difficult financial circumstances.
In my opinion, a great many wealthy people have got there through a combination of luck and/or exploitation of people or resources.
Not everyone actually wants to be wealthy but it is insulting to suggest that by working hard you will get to be rich. The slum children in India work hard but they will never be rich!!
There are a lot of wealthy people out there who do a lot for the less well off. I’m thinking of Peter Jones from Dragon’s Den and the people off Secret Millionaire to name a few. Now those people earn my respect and admiration.
Even Bill Gates realised that he was never going to be able to spend all his money so he put it into a fund/foundation to help the less well off. Apparently Steve Jobs thought he was mad to do this. That tells me a lot about Steve Jobs.

I agree about the extremes, but isn't one of the most know sayings about business that sucess is 40% hard work and 60% luck?
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Old 28-11-2011, 23:47
Neda_Turk
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With me I don't care how educated or uneducated someone is, or how much money they have or don't have.

What I don't like with SOME (please read the some) people from upper class backgrounds is that they are snobs and do look down on people. An attitude of it doesn't matter how they treat other people as long as it benefits and promotes themselves.

There are of course many many upper class people who are absolutely nothing like that and are successful under their own steam and not at the expense of other. They also do not look down on people they consider beneath them as just people to abuse for their own gains.

And of course some lower class uneducated people behave disgustingly and some are the very salt of the earth.

So basically the sort of upper class ambitious people who I don't like are the ones with the attitude that their bettering themselves comes above everyone else like they have some God given right.
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Old 29-11-2011, 00:23
Vol
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Like the first response said, it's mostly jealousy based, encouraged by the fact that a large % of wealthy people don't do themselves any favours in terms of endearing themselves to the poor.
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Old 29-11-2011, 01:28
rwebster
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There is prejudice, absolutely, but I also think there's a difference between disliking a privileged person because of a stereotype of them being haughty and arrogant, and disliking a privileged person because he or she is actually haughty and arrogant.

This mob's got a mix. Hayley, for instance, is quite well-spoken, but also quite humble. That doesn't apply to all of them, though, and just as it's important not to discriminate against any of the candidates for being quite well-to-do, it's also important to recognise that's not necessarily why people on the internet don't like them.
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Old 29-11-2011, 01:44
Idacyder
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OP - I don`t think its `education` that people are jealous of at all - its the nasty attitude of some of them which, as someone else has said, is not just limited to the educated classes. Harry Hitchens is educated but remains a decent fellow and I`m sure liked by all; the same goes for Hayley. I can`t see anyone begrudging them anything. What people do resent are cocky upstarts who think they`re superior whatever their education.
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Old 29-11-2011, 11:13
madetomeasure
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Unless you're going into careers such as law, I don't think social class plays as much a part these days. It's more to do with nepitism. How many times do you see people on the TV getting their jobs because of who their parents are. Sadly, it seems to be no longer what you know but who you know and that's in all jobs now. I have a first degree and a masters and couldn't get into law. That area's very shallow and definitely the one career route that puts your social class/uni attended over any other characteristics/attributes that you might posses.
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Old 29-11-2011, 13:29
Jenkins123
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I agree with the OP, although this exists in every country, its just unfortunate that Britain has a neutral accent that poor people automatically associate with rich and arrogant people, which is wrong.
Speaking correctly should be seen as a positive not negative regardless of who you are. But you will find millions of people up and down the country who speak with a neutral accent. I personally find regional accents awful, and I cringe with embarassment when I hear my own regional accent on TV!

But I do think things are changing regarding accents in the UK. But a pompous attitude will still grate on people. Its all about attitude with the British. We are a bunch of miserable sods when it comes down to it, island people are wierd anyway lol
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Old 29-11-2011, 14:16
NorfolkPoppy
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I do think there can be an attitude towards posher accents but to me it's all about how people treat others that counts not what they sound like.

Also, despite having a private education, there seemed to be a general lack of common sense with all of them this week. If we are talking cheap suits why wouldn't they go to a market or even Asda? Pocket watches are in every jewellery store. I believe that intelligence isn't knowing every fact but being able to find out facts....and they clearly failed at that.
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Old 29-11-2011, 15:41
oulandy
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I don't object to people who speak well or have posh or educated accents.

I suppose that attitude of sneering at toffs strikes you more when you arrive in this country from elsewhere. What country did you come from to the UK and what are the social attitudes and class attributes there?
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Old 29-11-2011, 16:31
Stone Free
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What I don't like with SOME (please read the some) people from upper class backgrounds is that they are snobs and do look down on people. An attitude of it doesn't matter how they treat other people as long as it benefits and promotes themselves.
I agree, however I don't think there are any upper class people in the apprentice anyway.

Upper class refers to the Aristocracy - Lords, Ladies etc. Most of the people being referred to as upper class are just posh/Upper Middle Class.
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Old 29-11-2011, 17:43
Jenkins123
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I agree, however I don't think there are any upper class people in the apprentice anyway.

Upper class refers to the Aristocracy - Lords, Ladies etc. Most of the people being referred to as upper class are just posh/Upper Middle Class.
True, Princes Diana is someone who came from an upper class background. The spencer family. The "posh" peeps in the Apprentice are miidleclasss or just speak with a neutral accent. .
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Old 29-11-2011, 18:50
madetomeasure
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Both Zara and Harry M come across as right snobs - it doesn't mean I dislike them though. Having said that, Zara last night was a right stuck up madam so have gone right off her. Posh accents automatically draw their own pre-conceptions but it doesn't mean somebody can help the way they speak. What they can do though is to curb their arrogance if that's coupled with their accent and last night Zara was incapable of doing that, no matter how many times she said she exhibited humility. She comes across as being very aggressive in her manner and will walk over anybody to get what she wants. In a way, yes being determined is good but to have humility you need to show it not just talk about it and assuming somebody else's idea, which she did last night, didn't illustrate her case.
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