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Big Deal |
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#1 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Somerset
Posts: 301
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Big Deal
New hours for 32 Big Deal. Currently showing pyscic live.
Also placeholder on 795 saying 'this service has moved. Rescan to continue watching' |
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#2 |
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Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: East Midlands
Posts: 5,204
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Quote:
New hours for 32 Big Deal. Currently showing pyscic live.
Also placeholder on 795 saying 'this service has moved. Rescan to continue watching' The return of the dreaded 795 as well. Big Deal: new multiplex Arq B. I assume post-DSO only. Check anyone in Merdian, London, Tyne Tees or Ulster confirm if you see any changes. |
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#3 |
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Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: East Midlands
Posts: 5,204
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Looks like LCN 795 has now been designated the shunt-off channel. When a channel changes multiplex, some receivers will automatically store the new channel slot and shunt the old channel slot down to 795, with the new channel slot either being added at 8xx or in the correct, original position - depending on receiver.
Any reports from pre-DSO UK? |
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#4 |
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Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Guildford / Crystal Palace
Posts: 13,114
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yup it's a post DSO only day. I'll retire to Freesat and watch the changes there.
![]() No pre DSO changes at all. So are there two new streams on Arq B? Any timings for Big Deal? Will there be something filling Rocks & Cos old slot 1pm-6pm? Or is that Big Deal 2? |
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#5 |
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Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: East Midlands
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Quote:
yup it's a post DSO only day. I'll retire to Freesat and watch the changes there.
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#6 |
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Guest
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 949
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Here from the Emley Moor Transmitter
Big Deal is on air right now showing JCM Direct Channel. The other Bigdeal is on 795. AlJazeera seems to be keeping there 6-11pm hours according to the on-screen graphic. TVX says 12-3am or 1-3am. Rocks and co is airing from 1-11pm but in there rolling text area it also says 1-6pm as well. So these channels seems to compensate the post and pre DSO regions by the looks of it. |
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#7 |
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Guest
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 949
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According to the on screen information
These channels seem to have compensated for both pre and pro regions
Post Regions TVX - 12-3am Rocks and Co - 1-11pm TJC - still 24hrs Big Deal - Extended hrs (24hrs????) Pre Regions TVX 1-3am Rocks and Co 1-6pm TJC = No sure but prosuming its still 24hrs in those areas. Big Deal = From the forums its still 3-6pm but needed more info. Al Jazeera has not changed it seems and no other changes by the looks of it. Only Connect 1-3 HD services with no graphics. |
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#8 |
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Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 949
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This is interesting indeed about big deal tv in Post areas.
My tv guide says its live from 11pm and i think its time sharing with AlJazeera Eng from 6-11pm. So my assumption is that in post areas its live from 11pm till 6pm. |
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#9 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Andover, Hampshire, UK
Posts: 3,624
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Oh, now that is interesting. So, it might turn out that Big Deal and AJE are now timesharing in the new slot, and Rocks & Co have expanded the old slot... meaning there's only one new slot. That would also make sense - Big Deal is usually used as a placeholder channel when Arqiva don't want to waste income; I expect it'll be down to a few hours in the morning again within the coming months. So, I'd expect either AJE to expand to 24 hours, or another channel to launch timesharing with AJE and perhaps the remains of Big Deal.
EDIT: Hang on, it's already gone 6, hasn't it - is Big Deal offair post-DSO, can someone check? |
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#10 |
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Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: London
Posts: 13,404
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Quote:
Oh, now that is interesting. So, it might turn out that Big Deal and AJE are now timesharing in the new slot, and Rocks & Co have expanded the old slot... meaning there's only one new slot. That would also make sense - Big Deal is usually used as a placeholder channel when Arqiva don't want to waste income; I expect it'll be down to a few hours in the morning again within the coming months. So, I'd expect either AJE to expand to 24 hours, or another channel to launch timesharing with AJE and perhaps the remains of Big Deal.
EDIT: Hang on, it's already gone 6, hasn't it - is Big Deal offair post-DSO, can someone check? |
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#11 |
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Join Date: May 2002
Location: Beds (Sandy Heath TX)
Posts: 8,852
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Quote:
EDIT: Hang on, it's already gone 6, hasn't it - is Big Deal offair post-DSO, can someone check?
(also mentions a Twitter account that hasn't been updated since Big Deal stopped showing gambling) |
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#12 |
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Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Andover, Hampshire, UK
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Ah, brilliant! So, we can properly confirm what happened:
* A new stream has been created post-DSO, with Big Deal and Al Jazeera English moving from their current slots into it. Al Jazeera has kept its current timing, and Big Deal expanded to fill the big gaps. So, Rocks & Co. 1 and TVX have moved into Al Jazeera English's and Big Deal's old space respectively. |
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#13 |
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Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: North Wales Coast
Posts: 311
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Quote:
Ah, brilliant! So, we can properly confirm what happened:
* A new stream has been created post-DSO, with Big Deal and Al Jazeera English moving from their current slots into it. Al Jazeera has kept its current timing, and Big Deal expanded to fill the big gaps. So, Rocks & Co. 1 and TVX have moved into Al Jazeera English's and Big Deal's old space respectively. |
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#14 |
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Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Andover, Hampshire, UK
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No, it's just moved onto another stream on Arq B - and since streams aren't actually things, just neat ways to visualise timesharing arrangements, it will not require a rescan.
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#15 |
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Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: North Wales Coast
Posts: 311
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Quote:
No, it's just moved onto another stream on Arq B - and since streams aren't actually things, just neat ways to visualise timesharing arrangements, it will not require a rescan.
![]() ![]() Slightly off topic-ish. I take it that red hot is no longer as it says it has moved to channel 93......or TVX no more? |
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#16 |
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 749
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Quote:
Yes, sorry, mis-read what you wrote.
![]() ![]() Slightly off topic-ish. I take it that red hot is no longer as it says it has moved to channel 93......or TVX no more? |
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#17 |
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Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: East Midlands
Posts: 5,204
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This is how I see it at the moment, following the change to the Big Deal service. If anyone can correct/update, I'd be grateful: Quote:
Pre DSO Mux C So what happens to Big Deal's old slot on Arqiva A, I wonder?No change. Post DSO Arqiva A Stream 1-6 no change (Pick TV, Sky News, Challenge, Dave, E4+1, Really/Dave Ja Vu) Stream 7: Price Drop (8am - midnight), ADULT Party (midnight - 3am), Former Big Deal slot (3am - 5am), Community Channel (5-8am) Stream 8: no change (Create & Craft/Food Network/Adult Smile TV2/Babestn2) Stream 9 not in existance - the post-DSO matched capacity with pre-DSO mux B. Stream 10 not in existance - additional capacity not yet used Stream 11 not in existance - additional capacity as a result of the FEC change. Pre DSO Mux D Streams 1-7 No change (Yesterday, 4 Music, Ideal World, VIVA, Film 4, ITV4, Russia Today) Stream 8 No change - existing timeshare QVC Beauty, Rocks and Co, Al Jazeera & ADULT Babestn. Post DSO Arqiva B Streams 1-7 no change (Yesterday, 4 Music, Ideal World, VIVA, Film 4, ITV4, Russia Today) Stream 8: Vacant (no change 5-8 am), QVC Beauty (no change 8am - 1pm), Rocks and Co (changed to 1pm -11pm), ADULT Babestn (no change 11pm -5 am) Stream 9/10 no change (Sky Sports 1/2) Stream 11 new Big Deal (11pm-6pm), Al Jazeera English (6pm-11pm) Radio: no change Retune required only if you want Big Deal (Psychic TV) (Changes to TVX/Redhot as discussed in the TVX moving thread relate to Mux A/SDN and therefore probably not relevant to the discussion here). |
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#18 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Andover, Hampshire, UK
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Mmm... I don't know why, I had it confused with TVX, no idea why I thought it would be expanding...
Can someone tell me, though, why TVX's times are apparently different pre/post-DSO? Or is that not actually the case? (It's been posted a few times that they are...) |
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#19 |
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Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: East Midlands
Posts: 5,204
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Quote:
Mmm... I don't know why, I had it confused with TVX, no idea why I thought it would be expanding...
Can someone tell me, though, why TVX's times are apparently different pre/post-DSO? Or is that not actually the case? (It's been posted a few times that they are...) It appears TVX will be 0000-0400 on the 5☆ stream on SDN/Mux A, which is the same everywhere. In effect, two different things are at hand here: 1. Changes on Arqiva A/B post DSO following the activation of an additional stream using extra 3Mbps capacity created by the FEC change with what appears to be temporary channels. This is what has resulted in the changes to Big Deal as discussed here. Also resulting in the changes to Rocks and Co (see thread) 2. Changes on SDN/Mux A as a result of a stream being cleared for the launch of C5+1 next Tuesday. Three things have/are happening because of this a.) GOLD/ Home getting revised hours and being slotted in before ESPN (See Top Up TV threads) b.) Top Up TV Anytime 3 being slotted in overnights possibly during the times when C5+1 wouldn't be able to broadcast due to gambling. c.) TVX moving to the 5* stream, content from 191 being merged together with 93 into one channel (see the thread linked to above). |
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#20 |
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Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: East Midlands
Posts: 5,204
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Quote:
Yep, Big Deal showing an MHEG "programmes back at 11pm"
(also mentions a Twitter account that hasn't been updated since Big Deal stopped showing gambling) |
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#21 |
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Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Winter Hill
Posts: 1,830
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Quote:
The 6pm-11pm slot extending Rocks & Co on Arq B is using therefore the extra capacity created by the FEC change. On Big Deal (LCN 32), it had teleshopping upto 5.59pm. Then the stream switched to Psychic Today. But a minute later, the stream switched to a MHEG with the EPG stating that Psychic Today is back @ 11pm. This implies that Psychic Today have sublet their primetime hours to Rocks & Co. during the Xmas sales period. Rocks & Co. live auctions end @ 11pm so no benefit broadcasting past 11pm on DTT. So it is coincidential that Al Jazeera and Rocks & Co, both end their DTT broadcast hours @11pm. IMHO LCN 40 (Rocks & Co) switches from Stream 8 to Stream 11 @ 6pm...I'd be surprised if its not temporary for the Xmas shopping period. Perhaps come late January/early February another channel will be ready to fill the slot full time (or April when London switches). pre-DSO (Mux D) and post-DSO (Arqiva B) Streams 1-7 No change (Yesterday, 4 Music, Ideal World, VIVA, Film 4, ITV4, Russia Today) Stream 8 No change - existing timeshare QVC Beauty, Rocks & Co, Al Jazeera & ADULT Babestn. post-DSO (Arqiva B) only Stream 9/10 no change (Sky Sports 1/2) Stream 11 launched today 0300-1800 Big Deal's teleshopping 1800-2300 Psychic Today sublet to Rocks & Co. 2300-0300 Psychic Today I doubt the completion of the DSO will make any major change of the calibre of channels timesharing this stream. ITVplc has "The Zone" between 6pm-6am in pre-DSO and post-DSO regions except in Wales. And they have only been able to attract Jackpot 247 and teleshopping. |
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#22 |
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Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: East Midlands
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Quote:
On Big Deal (LCN 32), it had teleshopping upto 5.59pm. Then the stream switched to Psychic Today. But a minute later, the stream switched to a MHEG with the EPG stating that Psychic Today is back @ 11pm. This implies that Psychic Today have sublet their primetime hours to Rocks & Co. during the Xmas sales period. Rocks & Co. live auctions end @ 11pm so no benefit broadcasting past 11pm on DTT. So it is coincidential that Al Jazeera and Rocks & Co, both end their DTT broadcast hours @11pm. IMHO LCN 40 (Rocks & Co) switches from Stream 8 to Stream 11 @ 6pm...
pre-DSO (Mux D) and post-DSO (Arqiva B) Streams 1-7 No change (Yesterday, 4 Music, Ideal World, VIVA, Film 4, ITV4, Russia Today) Stream 8 No change - existing timeshare QVC Beauty, Rocks & Co, Al Jazeera & ADULT Babestn. post-DSO (Arqiva B) only Stream 9/10 no change (Sky Sports 1/2) Stream 11 launched today 0300-1800 Big Deal's teleshopping 1800-2300 Psychic Today sublet to Rocks & Co. 2300-0300 Psychic Today I doubt the completion of the DSO will make any major change of the calibre of channels timesharing this stream. ITVplc has "The Zone" between 6pm-6am in pre-DSO and post-DSO regions except in Wales. And they have only been able to attract Jackpot 247 and teleshopping. It is unlikely that the Psychic TV service sublet any capacity to Rocks and Co - Psychic TV themselves are subletting capacity via a third party to Arqiva. I'm not sure if Canis Media or another organisation is behind this arrangement on this occasion. Services like TJC have benefited from subletting temporary capacity under the "Big Deal" channel banner. I also do not think there is any literal stream swapping going on - it could be all "on paper". At the moment this extra stream is restricted in UK coverage. No commercial broadcaster of any calibre would accept part UK coverage - certainly not without London and the South East given the high costs of accessing DTT and the loss of a substantial audiance (with connected commercial revenue). Some stations like Virgin 1/Channel One/Challenge put up with no full Wales coverage, but in time this was corrected to regain full UK service, and Virgin 1+1 tried to temporarily fill the gap showing that the station did not consider the situation to be ideal. With some services from UKTV evidently LCN hogging, I suspect we will see changes once London switches and a new EPG reshuffle takes place. I also don't think a channel like Al Jazeera would accept extended hours but not in London (an issue raised by others), as for international channels, London viewers are the key audiance. You highlight "The Zone", which highlights the point that broadcasters don't neccessarily want a time-crippled, coverage crippled service, hence we get teleshopping. Last edited by a516 : 02-12-2011 at 00:08. Reason: to make more sense |
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#23 |
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Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Guildford / Crystal Palace
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Regarding Mux A / SDN, because several large post DSO transmitters will not switch Mux A to SDN, until later, with the last in late June 2012, (Sandy, Heathfield, Sudbury), there is no danger of a FEC change stream appearing until then. So pre DSO == post DSO.
With Arq B, all post DSO have had the FEC change and presumably Arq A is in between somewhere, with nearly all transmitters having had it. Question for post DSO Arq A Big Deal. Will LCN795 be a simulcast of LCN32 between 3am & 5am? Or is it just vacant space? |
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#24 |
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Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Guildford / Crystal Palace
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I think post 17 is right and the Big Deal stream sharing with Al Jazeera means that Al Jazeera will go 24/7 when it's ready and Big Deal will fade away again.
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#25 |
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Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Andover, Hampshire, UK
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As far as streams go, as long as the times are correct, there is no right and wrong answer, at least, not one that we'll ever know unless another change occurs - but there is a sensible and non-sensible answer. A sensible answer keeps things nice and simple, with channels "jumping" between streams kept to a minimum - a non-sensible one has lots of jumps. Of course, both of these are right, because as I have said in the past, streams don't actually exist - they're just a nice way of visualising how the timesharing fits together. The encoders/muxers don't care whether or not the slots fit together into nice, discreet streams, they just care that no more than x channels (where x is a number that has been set up, depending on the mux and the quality of the encoder) are broadcasting at once, so you could have all sorts of crazy combinations that you won't fit into a nice set of discreet streams. The reason they do mostly fall into discreet streams is probably because that's how they're sold, mostly, as slots on a stream - but since we'll never no the exact contractual arrangements, it just makes the most sense to put it in the simplest terms possible.
So, the simplest terms possible in this case are the ones in post #17. |
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