So if i was the producer of the show for series 7 i would make the following changes (Jason & Emma are both gone now but this is how i would of changed the show before this became apparent)

- Axe Emma and Jason from the panel, keep Robin bring back Karen and 3 other judges to make up 5 again, 2 of them being ice dance specialists and a previous winner such as Suzanne Shaw
- Put the scores back to out of 6.0
- Cut the cast members down to 12 - 6 males, 6 females
- Keep the same pro's so the audience familarise themselves with them and get to know them like they are known as celebs in their own right ala Strictly
- Have a daily fanzine show returned named Dancing On Ice Daily or something along those lines
- Phil & Holly as presenters
- Axe the skateoff and eliminate the pair with the least amount of 50% judges scores and 50% viewer votes
- Limit the amount of lifts to 3 per routine
- Let the Pro skaters choreograph their own routines for their celebs or on alternate weeks one week Chris & Jayne next week the pro and vice versa
- Pro skates every week of the competition

I like it

So basically it's the same setup as Strictly.

I agree by the way.

I love those ideas, especially the scores out of 6.0, the pro skaters routines every week and the daily show. Why is DOI the only mainstream show without an ITV2 Show of its own?

If Karen is the head coach then she shouldn't be giving opinions on the night on camera - the roles were mixed last year and it didnt' work before the spat with Jason and went even worse after. She works too closely to the skaters to be objective - but she is very supporting and encouraging to all of them and is very good at her job.

Keep 3 judges - 5 didn't allow comments from most of the judges, if you've paid for big names make the most of them.

Have a spin off show - maybe once or twice a week (and please not presented by Coleen Nolan) and have one of the skating judges go through the different moves and what happened and what should have happened like Nicky used to do. This would also be the ideal vehicle for Karen to comment on the skating rather than using her as an unoffical 4th judge.

Let the pros choreograph the routines - the moves are getting quite samey and one of the pro's who made the final last year hadn't done choreography before and it showed and put his partner at a disadvantage.

Starting with just 12 contestants, and having a spin off show are what I want most.

Less contestants means better celebs, and it's more competitive to get on the show in the first place, and a spin off show helps to let us see more of the detail of the skating and get to know the contestants and skaters better.

They need to find ways of preventing the first few shows from lasting all evening. It's just too tedious.

I'd make more of the results show, and have more guest singers and pro-skating routines.

I don't agree, I think Colin's troubles choreographing the bolero last series demonstrated how some of the pro's are just skaters. Many skaters have outsiders choreograph routines and I think if the pros were to do it themselves then the celebrities would never be pushed to do things outside of their comfort zone, this was shown in Sharron Davies who didn't want to do the challenging routines torvill and dean set... Instead for about 3 weeks we saw her do the same moves over and over. I also wonder if the pro's choreographed would we get such a variety of styles on the ice like we do now?

Lastly, the great thing about having torvill and dean on the show is that it keeps the 'dance' element, to my knowledge many of the pros aren't 'ice dancers' and many appear to have trouble learning the dance moves themselves and don't look comfortable doing them... E.g Fred.

Good point - I'd not thought of it that way - but I think that the pro's should perhaps start to help T&D choreograph at a certain point in the series so it's not a completely new skill for them if they make it to the end.

Some awful suggestions to start with there. Yes, cutting to three judges and scoring out of 10 seemed wrong at first - but we soon got used to it and I'd see no reason to return to the old format (indeed scores out of 6.0 were a thing of the past even when the show started!).

My only issue with the judges this year is they've bloody signed Louie Spence - as much as Jason was the show villian he is one of the few judges in all reality shows to actually give a technical appraisal and give people something to work with, and with Katarina joining the Ice/Dance balance would have just been about right.

I'd suggest keeping shows as short as possible - though once again we've got 2 hour shows for just 7-8 routines to kick off the series when really it could be done in 90 minutes. I'd go for a Saturday/Sunday split too with an extra pro-routine on the Sunday to flesh out the show a bit. Axing the skate off would be stupid though - it's there to make the result show worth watching.

I would bring back the weekly required element and keep the solo routine in the semi-final (I've thought they should do that for years). I hope they keep the Showdance in the final too but I think they'll go back to flying now they're back at Elstree - but why not have both and shake up the Bolero a bit by having a Flying Bolero!

And in the first couple of weeks they got it completely wrong last year by not giving the judges any say (both in scoring and the skate off), which saw decent but unknown skaters like Laura at the risk of the axe. I'd say to start with just have the judges score and then the bottom three face the public vote for their place in the competition.

I suspect they might do the "Ice Pick" again, but hope they don't. If the Team Challenge returns I'd rather see the winning team get a bonus 10 points rather than doubling scores - I think that's a bit fairer to those getting 25+ but losing the team challenge. I think the Skills Set show worked quite well last year too just to give the show a bit of focus on technique a few weeks in.

Finally I'd axe Karen from the live shows - that was all quite awkward last year and it's down to the pro and Torvill and Dean to defend the celebs IMO. She should keep a presence in the VTs though. And with Holly gone I think Phil really could have hosted the show alone - just tweaking the set a bit so the main presentation area is next to the judges table.

They have so many contestants because ITV want them to fill so many weeks. Its all about money.They also allow for supposedly entertaining gimicks with more people at risk and more importantly allow spare good skaters to be put in in case the public vote throws too many good people out. More judges would cost more - with fewer weeks to cover the cost. The choice of returning winners as judges would be tiny, as most of the good ones are working, several on on theatre tours, next year. Kyran or Hayley might be available, but I doubt it. People would complain about anyone who criticised their favourite still .

Karen as a judge doesn't work- even if she was objective, she may not be thought to be, and she can't be negative about her students . It doesn't work - anymore than having the vocal coaches on fame academy judging too worked. The trend is to make all these shows more about entertainment, and the audience votes on a wide definition of entertainment, or sex appeal, so having more people to comment on their skating technique isn't helpful. Nicky went because he contradicted Robin, diluting the technique message ,his marking was erratic, and his comments didn't shape the vote. At best, technical comments are irrelevant for most of the audience, and, at worst, low marks for technique just build an anti-judge vote. You also would need skaters who understood entertainment and what impact something would have on TV - rather than someone who danced other people's choregraphy and knows nothing about TV. The judges primary purpose is not only to comment, but to be able to manipulate the the vote to follow them - and thats why Emma and Alesha are vastly more successful at keeping better people in and removing weak ones than Arlene or Karen ever could be.

A support show would be a great addition and worked, but I imagine there's no room for it on ITV1 and no audience for the cost on ITV 2. Hayley would be a good equivalent to Zoe on ITT , but some people won't like whoever you pick.

The DOI audience vote often has very little to do with skating or dancing entertainment merit until very near the end. SCD now seems to be doing better, and its vote actually follows the dancing much more than it used to a couple of seasons ago. The DOI vote demonstrably goes to hunks, whoever is top with the judges and joke acts, and people with TV or regional fanbases. DOI, without a skate off, could, on past votes, eliminate all of its best females - apart from the odd exception who dominates her voting, like Hayley - well before the final. Its entirely possible that only Hayley and Suzanne of the top females would have actually made a final if the public vote had decided with no skate off - Bonnie, Clare, Jessica, Laura could all have gone - Laura in week one.

There's nothing wrong with lifts. The problem is that most people can''t do the more difficult ones and they have been casting females who are too tall to do them anyway. Thats produced lots of lifts that are essentially exercises in the pro male carrying his female celeb in his arms - which are pretty pointless. They have a problem because unless the female is a good dancer or can spin (Hayley could do both) you are left with lots of pointless moving around on the ice, or being carried if you can't do lifts. There's far fewer lifts in recent top contestants routines than there were in the best female routines over all the series - Suzanne's best I think had 5 in it - as well as more dancing moves than most routines since.

The lift problem is also partly linked to your issue of who should choregraph. T and D seem to produce the same easier lifts in multiple routines - over and over again, week on week . There's less and less progression in most people's routines. They also seem to be producing fewer memorable new routines - and most people are lucky to get one. Its notable that Hayley's best routine was choregraphed by bringing in outside expertise, Sam's was lifted from an establish Irish dancing style and both Suzanne and Hayley were trained as dancers and could add themselves. Its not clear, though, what the answer to that could be. T and D have too little time with so many contestants, and may have an imagination block too. The pro skaters, though, can't all choregraph, or do it at the same level. If you change between the two, it might improve things, or make progression even less likely with two hands at work developing the skater - and the people with weak choregraphers will be disadvantaged week after week.

They have a week on Battle of the Blades where the routines are choreographed to test how well the celebrities synchronise with their partners. I don't recall that being done in the same way on DOI and it would be a good challenge for about halfway through the series.

I think they've done a shadow sequence here - but only one length of the rink, not a routine.

As for ex winners being judges - I think only Kyran could probably fit into that role comfortably and be accepted in it considering he's kept with it.

Hayley and Suzanne are still skating too - sometimes in Kyran's shows. Both are better dancers and actors - though Kyran has learnt about staging a show. Suzanne is touring though next year. Bonnie could do as a skating equivalent of Ruthie and this time the massive career CV would backed by skating ability - but she would upset some people and she's US based.. Clare's also current skatewise and has a wide enough background and could do it, but she didn't win, and she's also on stage early next year.

I think they seriously need to look at last seasons gimicks. The skills test was pointless, and the group mark randomised who was at risk, and the show skate in the final was pretty terrible all around. I thought the old model with one new compulsory element a week was far better than the skills test and associated hype, the group effort was downright dangerous to some of the best skaters, and it would have been better to do a new routine, or modify another old one, for the final than to get people to choregraph dances themselves when they were clearly not up to it. Even flying produced some memorable numbers and looked better all around.

The first week elliminations on a public vote were a terrible idea. They almost lost a finalist, they threw away some decent contestants and they can only be decided at that stage by who has or doesn't have a fanbase in an ITV audience. They should have saved some people for another year and let the judges have a final say on who went in the normal way. Being unknown at the beginning doesn't predict popularity by the end so the early vote doesn't actually tell us anything useful.

Letting the contestants decide who went one week was also a truly bad idea. Either they followed the judges scores and it was a damp squib - or they would have voted for their mates or tactically - which would just distort the competition.

They could bring in a judges' veto. If they don't want to send home either of the bottom 2 then they can let them both through but then it's a double elimination the next week and they're only allowed to do that once per season. Last year that could have saved Jennifer or Vanilla Ice.

They wouldn't get away with that due to the phone votes - even if it was all explained up front they'd still be a scandal over a show where people were asked to vote and votes were ignored.

I don't like the sound of that. You want your votes to count!

I'd drop the twists from last year. Only good one IMO was the Showcase, so if one twist had to be kept I'd choose that one.

It's a tried and tested idea. They do it on Battle of the Blades and also American Idol. You're hardly sticking 2 fingers up to the voters if you're making it a double eviction the next week, just giving them a wake up call.

I disagree strongly - people will feel cheated if they've paid good money to keep their favourite skater(s) in the competition, only to find that no-one gets kicked out that week. A double eviction the following week hardly makes up for it to those people who voted this week, especially if they don't vote every week.

Fair enough if this twist has been done on other shows, but please, please lets not have this rubbish on Dancing On Ice. IMO the show works best when things are kept simple and I hope that this year's mistakes will have made the producers realise that!

I don't know about Canada but votes are free on American Idol (and most if not all US competition shows)

I agree it shouldn't be an issue as long as it's a twist they'd be up front about - rather than suddenly revealing it when two favourites are in the bottom two - but unfortunately thanks to TV companies failing to stand up for themselves in recent years over lesser things they just wouldn't get away with it.

Big Brother is the casing point - back in series 7 when they had a vote for a housemate to return it was always an inevitable twist they could pull out the bag at some point, was a natural development from a BB4 twist, was something fans speculated about and was even hinted towards by Davina in eviction interviews (although never revealed explicitly) but people like nothing more than to complain and in the end OFCOM sides with idiots who moan but when it comes to claiming their 35p back they can't be arsed.

The money from phone votes for Battle of The Blades goes to charity so that's probably why it's not an issue there.

I don't think it would go down well here unless ITV were up front about it and also donated the phone vote profits that week to charity.

They could always carry the votes over to the 2nd week. There are ways to get round these things to make sure they're 100% fair and accountable. I'm not trying to labour the point, it's just disappointing to think an idea that spices up these types of shows elsewhere could be dismissed over here because everyone's scared of people whinging to OFCOM.

Oh well it ain't gonna happen anyway so I've no more to say on the subject.

I think I wouldn't have got everyone's backs up as much if I'd suggested they shoot a puppy! Ha ha!

You're not getting our backs up - we're just pointing out as you say ITV wouldn't even risk it due to so many Daily Mail readers having OFCOM on speed dial.

One twist I'm surprised neither Dancing on Ice or Strictly haven't done yet is giving an ordinary member of the public a chance to be a contestant. Start the series with an audition show and then a special with 4-6 contestants competing for one place on the show (with 4-6 reserve skaters. new to DoI) and then throw them into the main show.

To be honest I'm not a fan of these twists in general, and I don't think the show needs 'spicing up'. Watching minor celebrities learning how to ice skate and performing each week, with some amazing professional routines thrown in for good measure, is enough excitement for me!

It would still be rubbish IMO. If I want to give to charity I'd do that, but I would be voting for my vote to count. I'm sure lots of others feel that way too.