Originally Posted by peeve:
“On the surface, this sounds good and I can understand why so many other forum members agree with it, but I'm afraid I disagree with your analysis.
If 'deadpan and laidback' is Holly's house style, then what was that Charleston if not deadpan and laidback? It was the epitome of cool, disdaining the gurning, silly Charlestons that Strictly has decided are what the dance should be about. Holly said on ITT during the week that she hated gurning slapstick, so the style was entirely right for her.
Chris Hollins is on record as saying the Charleston was made for him; expecting Holly to be able to deliver a routine like the Team Cola one, given her personality, is more than a bit of a stretch.
How quickly we forget! She could not have had a stronger character than in her dance to Cell Block Tango in Broadway Week, yet failed to deliver any real impact. Personally, I think that was because of her lack of ability. Had she done that routine later in the series, she would have made a better job of it, as she did with the paso.
And yet Artem was repeatedly criticised on this forum for faffing abaht with props and not being in hold, yada, yada, yada (cf the tango, VW, AS, AT)
Well, a cartwheel (if you can do them - I can't and neither, it would seem, can Holly) is easier to do than a dance step if you're not a dancer, so it's as much time-wasting as anything else. I loved their AT, but Holly spent half of it sitting on that stool and didn't have that many complicated steps - I would argue there was far less content than in the AT Artem danced with Kara last year - again, he limited things to her ability.
Thanks to the producers' love of comedy VTs, we actually have no idea how Artem has been teaching Holly and whether this differs from how he worked with Kara, so this is only supposition. He is an experienced teacher, so should be very accustomed to adapting his teaching style.
Getting back to the question posed by the OP - no, I don't think Artem is to blame for the fact that Holly didn't make the final. She got as far as her ability and popularity with the GBP allowed, and I think she would be the first to agree with that. I have voted for them throughout the series, but I didn't vote for them on Saturday, because I didn't think they deserved to go through - based purely on the lack of quality of Holly's dancing. Mind you, I didn't vote for Jason either, even though I think he deserves his place, but that's because he bores me to tears as soon as he opens his mouth. I'm not consistent...”
“On the surface, this sounds good and I can understand why so many other forum members agree with it, but I'm afraid I disagree with your analysis.
If 'deadpan and laidback' is Holly's house style, then what was that Charleston if not deadpan and laidback? It was the epitome of cool, disdaining the gurning, silly Charlestons that Strictly has decided are what the dance should be about. Holly said on ITT during the week that she hated gurning slapstick, so the style was entirely right for her.
Chris Hollins is on record as saying the Charleston was made for him; expecting Holly to be able to deliver a routine like the Team Cola one, given her personality, is more than a bit of a stretch.
How quickly we forget! She could not have had a stronger character than in her dance to Cell Block Tango in Broadway Week, yet failed to deliver any real impact. Personally, I think that was because of her lack of ability. Had she done that routine later in the series, she would have made a better job of it, as she did with the paso.
And yet Artem was repeatedly criticised on this forum for faffing abaht with props and not being in hold, yada, yada, yada (cf the tango, VW, AS, AT)
Well, a cartwheel (if you can do them - I can't and neither, it would seem, can Holly) is easier to do than a dance step if you're not a dancer, so it's as much time-wasting as anything else. I loved their AT, but Holly spent half of it sitting on that stool and didn't have that many complicated steps - I would argue there was far less content than in the AT Artem danced with Kara last year - again, he limited things to her ability.
Thanks to the producers' love of comedy VTs, we actually have no idea how Artem has been teaching Holly and whether this differs from how he worked with Kara, so this is only supposition. He is an experienced teacher, so should be very accustomed to adapting his teaching style.
Getting back to the question posed by the OP - no, I don't think Artem is to blame for the fact that Holly didn't make the final. She got as far as her ability and popularity with the GBP allowed, and I think she would be the first to agree with that. I have voted for them throughout the series, but I didn't vote for them on Saturday, because I didn't think they deserved to go through - based purely on the lack of quality of Holly's dancing. Mind you, I didn't vote for Jason either, even though I think he deserves his place, but that's because he bores me to tears as soon as he opens his mouth. I'm not consistent...”
I agree its not that easy to work out a Holly house style and she does seem to have been against going down the Hollins play it for votes route, but Holly can play funny and a range of roles and there ought to be one there somewhere. There's also the more obvious familar vote winning cinematic route taken by Tom Chambers by the time you get to the Charleston. Her problem is that if you don't work up a style, you are out voted by people who have. Harry has fallen into his destiny of boyband heart throb. Chelsee has run with her imposed tag of ladette to lady- and done a good job of coming from behind and being bubbly but acting ladies well when needed. Jason has been himself - earnest and hardworking - and had the same effect as he has on stage - some people love his acting, others think its terrible and dislike the intensity. Alex got as far on a journey story and the emerging swan theme by doing simpler more traditional dances. Not sure what Holly has been other than Holly and not looking desperate enough and not having a show story may be an issue .
I think cell block tango was the missed opportunity, pre Charleston, of the weeks where Holy could demonstrate she could play other roles . It wasn't the right piece from Chicago except for the word tango in the title. The lyrics are not written for one dancer and n so far as they fitted anything it led to acting coldness in the relationship when we needed more drama or fun or romance - or anything else. Robbing from Vincent's list of suitable music might have been wiser, and if it had to be from Chicago and could be fitted , something from Velma (tall, long legged, high kicking) or Roxie (Holly could play her character as is) might have had more chance of a break out. I agree it might have been risky but it would have been a clearer role to play and more obvious to the voters.
I agree Artem gave her gaps with not enough going on , but they were interspersed with massively complicated bits of high intensity. The result of that is that you risk scoring less when recovering and run more risk of making mistakes in the intense bits.Calmer, steadier with a few really dramatic impressive moments worked for others - although the girls can't hide as easily behind their male celebs as much as Kristina Ola and aliona could take distracting action to shield their celeb.
I agree we know very little as we don't see training any more in VTs or get to see as much of their characters outside ITT - but from what we have heard on air Holly seems to have been working hard and to be tired (although thats been said often too of Jason and Chelsee) The supposedly funny VTs manage not only to conceal whats going on but presumably mean there's even less time to train and more things to do in a week. Its been notable they look more tired doing less dancing this year and even more dances for the Sf and final may show..





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