[Glomper]

To go back to my original OP point, it's not that I need to have the Channels mentioned, (I can already receive them on "SKY Freesat") it's that possibly there could be a better use of some of the "apparently unused" Channels locally !

As quite comprehensively explained early on, posts #2 to #5, this is not possible.

[alanwarwic]

Many people have never and will never want a satellite installed.

It does seem bizarre madness that they get only 2 Mux and thus lose out on Film 4 etc because that 3rd mux has duplicated channels in HD.
Main ones get 6 plus the 1 HD so seemingly Lite gets the HD's ones yet only get 33% in total. No Film 4 etc then.

[Nigel Goodwin]

Originally Posted by alanwarwic

Many people have never and will never want a satellite installed.

Yet many TV aerials are far more obtrusive than a small dish.

Main ones get 6 plus the 1 HD so seemingly Lite gets the HD's ones yet only get 33% in total. No Film 4 etc then.

Main ones only get 5 + the 1 HD.

[alan_m]

Originally Posted by technologist

Use the Postcode finder at www.digitaluk.co.uk
and Tick the "I am in the Aeriel trade" .. this will tell you all the

all the wrong information. In many areas the information on that site isn't even close to being correct.

[alan_m]

Originally Posted by alanwarwic

Many people have never and will never want a satellite installed.

That is their choice and nothing wrong with that. However I'll bet many people don't want a satellite dish because they think it's only Sky and subscription. If you live in an area with only Freeview LITE then Freesat is a valid alternative.

[Muzer]

Originally Posted by alan_m

all the wrong information. In many areas the information on that site isn't even close to being correct.

It's the best you can do, though, aside from local knowledge which requires quite a bit more effort.

[The Dee Man]

I was originally under the impression that relay transmitters that covered “large” population areas would carry all 6 multiplexes. There are 51 main sites in the U.K. and according to OFCOM 80 sites will carry 6 multiplexes.

http://consumers.ofcom.org.uk/files/2010/07/dso2.pdf

There are relays that outwardly seem to have large population coverage but only carry the PSB muxes – in fact there are relays that have quoted bigger population coverage than some main stations that only transmit the PSB services.

[a516]

Originally Posted by The Dee Man

I was originally under the impression that relay transmitters that covered “large” population areas would carry all 6 multiplexes. There are 51 main sites in the U.K. and according to OFCOM 80 sites will carry 6 multiplexes.

http://consumers.ofcom.org.uk/files/2010/07/dso2.pdf

There are relays that outwardly seem to have large population coverage but only carry the PSB muxes – in fact there are relays that have quoted bigger population coverage than some main stations that only transmit the PSB services.

All transmitters (main & relay) that transmitted the full 6 multiplex service before switchover (in fact since On/ITV Digital days) continue to do so after switchover. Wherever there happened to be a) enough frequencies and b) a commercial incentive back in the On/ITV Digital days is where the commercial mux operators remain - albeit on higher signal powers.

Freeview Lite is the service that viewers of relays that didn't carry digital prior to switchover get after switchover.

[Muzer]

Indeed - only the original 80 DTT transmitters will carry COM muxes in the forseeable future. Most of those are main transmitters, but some are relays. The only exception to this is Ferryside in Wales, a small relay which was the first one to switch in the original switchover trial, which has a 4-mux service (BBC A, D3&4, BBC B, SDN - pre-DSO equivalents Mux 1, 2, A, B).

[Winston_1]

Originally Posted by pinkteddyx64

and not everyone can have a satellite dish on their house even if they want one, because their house might be a listed building or they might live in a conservation area.

This has been challenged in the European court and the challenger, a Swede I believe, has won.
Anyway it's only the house that is a problem. They can still have one in the garden.

[Nigel Goodwin]

Originally Posted by Winston_1

This has been challenged in the European court and the challenger, a Swede I believe, has won.

And means absolutely nothing, EU legislation specifically allows local planning consent to be required.

[lundavra]

The "+1" channels always seem a waste of space on Freeview Lite, it's a pity they can't be restricted to main stations and the bandwidth used more productively.

[Sue_Aitch]

The +1 channels are handy for those without recording equipment, though.

[tghe-retford]

Originally Posted by lundavra

The "+1" channels always seem a waste of space on Freeview Lite, it's a pity they can't be restricted to main stations and the bandwidth used more productively.

Commercial interest in a country which operates a free market capitalist approach sadly. +1's keep competitors off and brings in additional advertising revenue to channels for least effort.

As for Freeview Lite, whilst the BBC services, ITV1/STV/UTV, Channel 4/S4C and Channel 5 have to be carried (along with the BBC's HD channels, ITV1 HD and Channel 4 HD/S4C Clirlun) have to be carried as per their PSB licences, all other space on multiplex 2/D3&4 are up for grabs to the highest bidder, and that's a commercial decision for the owner of that multiplex which Ofcom will not interfere with, rather allowing market forces (ie. higher slot price for greater population coverage) to dictate what should go on that multiplex after the PSB's are fitted on.

[Muzer]

The main +1 channels are on Mux 2 because they have to be regionalised for advertising purposes. Mux A has only two regions (Wales and not Wales), and Muxes C and D are not regionalised at all. Mux 2, on the other hand, is regionalised very finely for the ITV micro regions.

[Eston Bleu]

Ah, Freeview Lite - Freeview's subnormal cousin, that they keep locked up in the attic and never talk about.

Funny how they never mention it in the adverts and press releases.

A new digital age, with many more channels and choice - for some - but where some people will be 'second-class citizens'.

Is there actually a technological issue that prevents these relay stations broadcasting the full spectrum of channels? OR is it to do with money and those in a position to make these decisions not really giving a damn?

[DragonQ]

Good question. Is it technology or just money that prevents the full Freeview line-up being broadcast at every transmitter/relay?

[Ray Cathode]

Originally Posted by DragonQ

Good question. Is it technology or just money that prevents the full Freeview line-up being broadcast at every transmitter/relay?

Ofcon has made it clear that it was willing to license any extra use of commercial muxes at more sites, but neither Arqiva nor SDN (ITV) have made any application to do so. In SDN's case, they even declined to take over an existing site at Whitehaven where Channel 5 had paid for the engineering to bring Mux A there.

[Muzer]

In some places, there simply aren't enough frequencies available - but I believe that in many, it would be possible, but it's the high cost for comparatively low gain. Although it must obviously suck for those in the Freeview Lite areas, I sort of see the point - I mean, who's going to pay for it? If the government paid for it, well, that's even more money coming from the licence fee most likely rather than going to the BBC, so everyone's programming choice will suffer so that the Freeview Lite viewers can watch ITV4 and Dave. But if Arqiva and SDN were forced to pay for it, they would probably put the price up for carriage on the muxes, and the various other things that Arqiva control, and so many channels may no longer be able to afford to broadcast, and the commercial muxes would probably become not worth watching. Whichever way you look at it, everybody loses.

May I remind you that few, if any, countries have as good a terrestrial service as we do. We have more coverage, and more channels, than other countries.

[Winston_1]

The frequencies are available at most sites. It could be solved by the government mandating that all services are available everywhere. They did that in the 4 channel analogue days. The commercial operators might complain, TOUGH, they got into broadcasting, it's up to them to make it pay,

[ds_reader]

Originally Posted by Winston_1

TOUGH, they got into broadcasting, it's up to them to make it pay,

Your demand would only be valid for new entries under the rule you propose. The current situation followed considered review of the proposals for the transmitter system.

[kasg]

Originally Posted by Winston_1

The commercial operators might complain, TOUGH, they got into broadcasting, it's up to them to make it pay,

But forcing them to spend large sums of money for very little return is exactly what would make it not pay.

[TelevisionUser]

Originally Posted by Glomper

My local Freeview relay transmitter, who can I ask to change the choice of transmitted channels ?


We are Limited to just a few Freeview "Lite" channels.

But including 102 Rabbit, 103 Gay Rabbit, 105 BBC Red Button, 301 Interactive BBC.

These mostly seem to be inactive anyway.

I would like these amended to more useful Channels, like 5*, 5USA, SKY News, Film 4

Also, an email contact for Freeview, they seem reticent to publish it.

I've found
webmaster@freeview.co.uk
but not sure if this is a good one for such a query.

Originally Posted by Eston Bleu

Ah, Freeview Lite - Freeview's subnormal cousin, that they keep locked up in the attic and never talk about.

Funny how they never mention it in the adverts and press releases.

A new digital age, with many more channels and choice - for some - but where some people will be 'second-class citizens'.

Is there actually a technological issue that prevents these relay stations broadcasting the full spectrum of channels? OR is it to do with money and those in a position to make these decisions not really giving a damn?

As has been mentioned above, in the unfortunate Freeview-lite areas, Freesat is a subscription-free alternative.

It'll provide 150+ channels, including the big 4 of the BBC, ITV, C4 & C4 plus other quite good channels too such as the CBS ones and there's more here: http://www.freesat.co.uk/what-you-get/our-channels

[BMR]

I know this is a bit of a bump, but I do think a strong case could be made for swapping 4+1 and Film 4 around. While 4+1 is undoubtedly useful, in the days of PVRs and 4OD I think Film 4 would be a better use of the bandwidth.

[Muzer]

The issue is, the advertisers wouldn't like that - C4 is regionalised for advertising, and ARQ B which Film4 is on isn't.