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Totally wrong decision Andy should have stayed. |
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#76 |
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Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 1,829
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I found Andy's routine had more risk to it, which he pulled off quite well. I was shocked that the judges let him go. He showed better potential than most of the males compared to Heidi and the other remaining female contestants we've seen so far.
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#77 |
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Join Date: Jun 2007
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It's week one - were ITV really going to let arguably their biggest name go over, in comparison, a little known Blue Peter presenter?
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#78 |
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Join Date: Apr 2009
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If your going to argue that Heidi was merely being carried around by Andrei then the same can be applied to Jorgie to as a large part of her routine was lifts as well and that worked in her favour because of her dance background but I don't see the complaints about that. Yes she did skate on her own and it was good but there were a lot of lifts in her routine too so its not fair to single out Heidi on that point. It was also pointed out in her VT that she would have to ensure her basics were strong and not just rely on the lifts etc.
Personally wasn't impressed by either couple really think both routines had faults and if we don't know if Heidi's routine had to be changed after Sylvain got injured which potentially meant getting used to a new partner and potentially a changed or new routine in just a matter of weeks so she was at a bit of a disadvantage. I found Andy's routine to be a bit all over the place and I don't think its some big conspiracy and just because Louie marked him lower hardly means he had it in for him like it was some kind of vendetta and I don't think that Louie would have any major influenece over Robin's vote as some seem to think. Not really offended by who went and who stayed from the bottom two we had although it should have been Mark really who went home tonight. |
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#79 |
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Join Date: May 2008
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Quote:
If your going to argue that Heidi was merely being carried around by Andrei then the same can be applied to Jorgie to as a large part of her routine was lifts as well and that worked in her favour because of her dance background but I don't see the complaints about that. Yes she did skate on her own and it was good but there were a lot of lifts in her routine too so its not fair to single out Heidi on that point. It was also pointed out in her VT that she would have to ensure her basics were strong and not just rely on the lifts etc.
Personally wasn't impressed by either couple really think both routines had faults and if we don't know if Heidi's routine had to be changed after Sylvain got injured which potentially meant getting used to a new partner and potentially a changed or new routine in just a matter of weeks so she was at a bit of a disadvantage. I found Andy's routine to be a bit all over the place and I don't think its some big conspiracy and just because Louie marked him lower hardly means he had it in for him like it was some kind of vendetta and I don't think that Louie would have any major influenece over Robin's vote as some seem to think. Not really offended by who went and who stayed from the bottom two we had although it should have been Mark really who went home tonight. Personally I'd prefer it if lifts were kept out of things in week one. Apart from the odd high, flashy one for the girls, have everyone on the ice for most of the routine. That'll give us a basic idea about who can actually skate. Then, when one of the girls has a mainly aerial display routine we can at least reassure ourselves (or not) that they have previously demonstrated solid skating ability. Won't ever happen of course because I am a freak and everyone else wants to see celebs being thrown about left, right, centre, top, middle, bottom and upside down. |
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#80 |
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Join Date: Apr 2009
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I think this is a difficult one. Personally, I reckon that if a celeb is obviously spending most of the time being carried round and little on the ice there's a reason for it (i.e. they can't skate very well). I have no problem with lifts as long as the celeb also shows good basic skating skill (as Jorgie did but Heidi didn't really). The show's about entertainment so a good female is still going to have to do s fair amount of lift work to ensure the proportion of the spectacular remains high (witness Clare, Suzanne and Hayley). Yet all three of the aforementioned managed to demonstrate fluent on-ice work as well and I don't recall anyone really questioning their high marks.
Personally I'd prefer it if lifts were kept out of things in week one. Apart from the odd high, flashy one for the girls, have everyone on the ice for most of the routine. That'll give us a basic idea about who can actually skate. Then, when one of the girls has a mainly aerial display routine we can at least reassure ourselves (or not) that they have previously demonstrated solid skating ability. Won't ever happen of course because I am a freak and everyone else wants to see celebs being thrown about left, right, centre, top, middle, bottom and upside down. That was why I said I didn't have an issue with Jorgie as such as she did show good basics although she was warned to improve them in the VT whether Heidi's were a bit clunky but there are some who are using the lifts in Heidi's as ammunition to a point because she knocked out Andy but to use the lift/tricks arguement you have to apply that to all the female celebs not just to suit the arguement at hand. I think there has been too much reliance on the major showy stuff and it would be nice to get back to some basics and show real ice dance. |
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#81 |
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Join Date: May 2008
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Thing is ice dance never used to be all about the lifts well I'm talking competitive ice dance anyway and was mostly about on ice work and about working as a pair which is why although its good to see the celebs skate and do things on their own I don't quite understand the obsession with getting them to do lots of things on their own as in traditional ice dance the pair are meant to stay together mostly but thats me being a bit pedantic.
That was why I said I didn't have an issue with Jorgie as such as she did show good basics although she was warned to improve them in the VT whether Heidi's were a bit clunky but there are some who are using the lifts in Heidi's as ammunition to a point because she knocked out Andy but to use the lift/tricks arguement you have to apply that to all the female celebs not just to suit the arguement at hand. I think there has been too much reliance on the major showy stuff and it would be nice to get back to some basics and show real ice dance. This may simply be first week nerves and I may be completely wrong as to Heidi's ability on the ice. However, she's kind of on a yellow card now. If she doesn't show some on-ice confidence soon I fear she'll be out. |
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#82 |
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Join Date: Jul 2003
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What on earth do you do on ice if you don't skate? I'm not saying being picked up is easy, but its a lot easier than skating on your own trying to put your own moves on the ice. Don't you agree? Andi may not be a natural dancer, but Heidi didn't make her own moves at all unless she was being dragged around or being picked up by her partner. It isn't just about being marked on doing the routine perfect. It's the technicalities witnessed and presented of how they skate also. If you can barely skate on your own, of course you deserve a low mark; regardless how good it is. That's why I rated Andi above Heidi. No way was Andi's routine perfect, but he had much more potential in his ability.
I dare you to watch the finals of each of the series again. If this ain't a skating competition, then you and ITV have got me fooled. ![]() |
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#83 |
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Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 34,226
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Quote:
I think this is a difficult one. Personally, I reckon that if a celeb is obviously spending most of the time being carried round and little on the ice there's a reason for it (i.e. they can't skate very well). I have no problem with lifts as long as the celeb also shows good basic skating skill (as Jorgie did but Heidi didn't really). The show's about entertainment so a good female is still going to have to do s fair amount of lift work to ensure the proportion of the spectacular remains high (witness Clare, Suzanne and Hayley). Yet all three of the aforementioned managed to demonstrate fluent on-ice work as well and I don't recall anyone really questioning their high marks.
Personally I'd prefer it if lifts were kept out of things in week one. Apart from the odd high, flashy one for the girls, have everyone on the ice for most of the routine. That'll give us a basic idea about who can actually skate. Then, when one of the girls has a mainly aerial display routine we can at least reassure ourselves (or not) that they have previously demonstrated solid skating ability. Won't ever happen of course because I am a freak and everyone else wants to see celebs being thrown about left, right, centre, top, middle, bottom and upside down. The idea that the girls shouldn't be lifted, as you imply, doesn't make much sense - as thats precisely what the pro girls will be doing and the celeb girls have the job of matching the most visible element of the male celebs routines. Indeed, the poorer the boy celebs can skate or dance, the more lifts and distractions the pro girls will be doing if their man can get them airborne. Not sure why Heidi got that routine. It could be a new easier routine with a new partner, or one shaped back to her ability, or just a stock routine. It may reflect her ability, but its also the same sort of routine thats turned up for many people who have been seen as middle field contenders like Melinda or Denise. Even Hayley got a lot of the same types of moves- though she often got more to act and had spins and things instead of the missing lifts.Chemmy and Jorgi got good routines - perhaps they can only come up with so many a week. |
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#84 |
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Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Yorkshire
Posts: 1,443
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I don't think any of them should have gone last night - one performance isn't enough to judge. Even the two skating experts disagreed on their choice so that much is clear.
Likeability is obviously the key at the moment and Mark is very likeable. However, I thought Andy was lovely too and, if anyone had to go, for me, it should have been Heidi. |
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#85 |
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Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 400
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I wish they could find a way to milk money from the audience with phone-ins, but leave it to the judges to decide who stays and who goes.
Far too often we get robbed of seeing someone with real talent go out early. Let's be honest...whatsherface from Eastenders (the old girl....don't watch the show so can't recall her name. Mo?) is not going to be very good - but there is a real chance viewers will keep voting her in, and stuff like that ruins the show for me. I love seeing the best skaters make real progress throughout the series. |
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#86 |
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Join Date: Jun 2010
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I thought Andy shouldn't have been in the bottom two but I think the same about Heidi too.
Heidi didn't do well in the poll nor did Andy considering there are so many people rooting for him. I don't understand why they let someone go home last night, it should only be the case when we have seen all the skaters. There could be some next week that just about manage to stand on the ice never mind dance. That's the unfair part of this show for me. |
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#87 |
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Join Date: Nov 2008
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Quote:
I thought Andy shouldn't have been in the bottom two but I think the same about Heidi too.
Heidi didn't do well in the poll nor did Andy considering there are so many people rooting for him. I don't understand why they let someone go home last night, it should only be the case when we have seen all the skaters. There could be some next week that just about manage to stand on the ice never mind dance. That's the unfair part of this show for me. |
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#88 |
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Join Date: Jun 2011
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Heidi's feet barely touched the ice. It seemed unfair that Andy was booted off.
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#89 |
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Join Date: Dec 2004
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Heidi didn't do well in the poll nor did Andy considering there are so many people rooting for him.
Heidi wasn't very high in the leaderboard, but she got good comments, and being on first, people didn't really notice. |
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#90 |
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Join Date: Dec 2011
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I usually watch DOI every year and love it but I cannot watch while that Louie is on.
I tuned in to watch the result hoping he would not be on it much (big mistake 'cos they only seemed to be interested in his comments not Robin's or Katerina's) so I only saw the skate off but I thought Andy was in a totally different class and could not believe Robin's comment - I like a bit of sugar with my babe - if this wasn't proof that they intended to keep the Sugababe in no matter what I don't know what is. A total travesty. I doubt if I'll tune in again at all. |
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#91 |
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Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 884
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Shocked by Robins decision.
I thought Andy was by far the more natural skater - Heidi was stiff and slow - Andy had flair over the ice and great potential. Such a shame he is out - I was looking forward to more from him.
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#92 |
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Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 400
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There is every possibility they based the decision over what they have been seeing during the last few weeks off screen.
Torvill and Dean were on Daybreak or This Morning (I can't recall which) and I'm sure they were bigging up Heidi as a dark horse. Perhaps nerves got to her and they know that she does genuinely have more potential based on rehearsals so far. |
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#93 |
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Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,249
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Quote:
If your going to argue that Heidi was merely being carried around by Andrei then the same can be applied to Jorgie to as a large part of her routine was lifts as well and that worked in her favour because of her dance background but I don't see the complaints about that. Yes she did skate on her own and it was good but there were a lot of lifts in her routine too so its not fair to single out Heidi on that point. It was also pointed out in her VT that she would have to ensure her basics were strong and not just rely on the lifts etc.
Personally wasn't impressed by either couple really think both routines had faults and if we don't know if Heidi's routine had to be changed after Sylvain got injured which potentially meant getting used to a new partner and potentially a changed or new routine in just a matter of weeks so she was at a bit of a disadvantage. I found Andy's routine to be a bit all over the place and I don't think its some big conspiracy and just because Louie marked him lower hardly means he had it in for him like it was some kind of vendetta and I don't think that Louie would have any major influenece over Robin's vote as some seem to think. Not really offended by who went and who stayed from the bottom two we had although it should have been Mark really who went home tonight. There was a world of difference between Heidi's stiff, clunky lifts at arthritic snail speed and Jorgie's smooth elegant beautiful, soft, ballet inspired lifts with gorgeous extensions at a good speed. On the ice Jorgie looked smooth and skated into the ice, where Heidi was very much on top of the ice and looking terrified, was held up by her partner at all times and off ice appeared to have no personality to speak of whereas at least Jorgie seemed enthusiastic and excitable (though this may become irritating perhaps). i didn't know either girl before the show but Heidi just seemed incredibly dull both in the routine and off ice. The partner change thing was a bit of a red herring since the basic skills are individual and not partner dependent and you can be sure the pro's are chosen because they are easy to skate with. If it was a beginner having to adjust to another beginner then there is some validity but really not a great deal when it is beginner with a pro skater. Andy at least had a personality and his independent skating showed promise - just needing a bit of finessing but his knee bend was good and he had rhythm and spirit. Heidi was like a wooden doll being carefully posed and placed and dragged. I thought the comments after the skates were pretty telling. Heidi saying she wasn't as good and T & D rushing to say she was better and Robin's rather strange reasoning - have to wonder if it wasn't more about 'product placement' this week ('celebs' being the product). |
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#94 |
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Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Cambridgeshire
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I felt sorry for Andy as well, but im a big Andrei fan and was thinking not again out in the 1st round, so glad Heidi stayed.
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#95 |
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Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Oop North, England, UK
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I'm still confused about the way in which the skate off is/should be judged.
Is it meant to be a) the two couples are in effect rescored/rejudged against each other (this is what they appear to suggest when they say the previous performance is forgotten) OR b) they are each rejudged just against their own previous performance only, and the one who comes out of this more favourably gets the non regardless of relative score to each other? |
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#96 |
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Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 3,756
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Quote:
There was a world of difference between Heidi's stiff, clunky lifts at arthritic snail speed and Jorgie's smooth elegant beautiful, soft, ballet inspired lifts with gorgeous extensions at a good speed. On the ice Jorgie looked smooth and skated into the ice, where Heidi was very much on top of the ice and looking terrified, was held up by her partner at all times and off ice appeared to have no personality to speak of whereas at least Jorgie seemed enthusiastic and excitable (though this may become irritating perhaps). i didn't know either girl before the show but Heidi just seemed incredibly dull both in the routine and off ice.
The partner change thing was a bit of a red herring since the basic skills are individual and not partner dependent and you can be sure the pro's are chosen because they are easy to skate with. If it was a beginner having to adjust to another beginner then there is some validity but really not a great deal when it is beginner with a pro skater. Andy at least had a personality and his independent skating showed promise - just needing a bit of finessing but his knee bend was good and he had rhythm and spirit. Heidi was like a wooden doll being carefully posed and placed and dragged. I thought the comments after the skates were pretty telling. Heidi saying she wasn't as good and T & D rushing to say she was better and Robin's rather strange reasoning - have to wonder if it wasn't more about 'product placement' this week ('celebs' being the product). ![]() I have to say I totally agree. Product placement was exactly how this skate off felt to me, I believe I said something similar earlier on. I felt that as slow as Heidi was, she went into the lifts even slower. She had some nice lines but the transitions weren't very clean. It was very clear she was being set down on the ice when lifts had ended. I'm disappointed that Andy has gone because I felt he would have improved a lot in the coming weeks. Oh well, should be used to it by now I suppose.
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#97 |
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Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: sportyland
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If this is an indication of what is to come I can see a lot of people losing respect for Robin - and katarina becoming the most popular and fairest judge
Robin got it very badly wrong last night. I hope he has had the guts to apologise to Andy |
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#98 |
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Join Date: Sep 2009
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Totally agree with that last part. I think I have said in another thread already that the first couple of weeks should be an introduction to all the skaters, and then once we have seen them all, make a decision. But then ITV would have two weeks with no phone in cash cow to rely on.
It'd make better sense because then we'd have seen them do two routines each and it'll give a clearer picture who should leave. |
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#99 |
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Join Date: Apr 2009
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Well all those complaining Andy shouldn't have been bottom 2 and shouldn't have gone then maybe more people should have voted for him then and he wouldn't have been in the skate off.
Its always the same plently of people on here moan that the wrong person went but how many do actually put in the effort to vote for them to stay. Icedragon it does make a difference with regards to the lifts etc when there is a partner change Suzanne acknowledged it on the tour a few years back when skating with Lucaz instead of Matt that hand holds etc were all different and getting into lifts etc were different and had to be relearned so it will have been the same with Heidi and may have knocked her overall confidence for performing. I prefer to not make snap judgements on the first week and wait till everyone has performed on Week 3 then if its still the same but fair enough but skating out 1st on the first show having had to change partner just a couple of weeks ago would have been enough to knock most peoples confidence. |
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#100 |
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Join Date: Dec 2003
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Shocked by Robins decision.
I thought Andy was by far the more natural skater - Heidi was stiff and slow - Andy had flair over the ice and great potential. Such a shame he is out - I was looking forward to more from him. ![]() |
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