Thanks - answers really don't come much simpler than that.

Could I just ask 2 questions?

What was so seriously wrong with Harry's Charleston as opposed to his other dances that could possibly have meant that Craig could not bring himself to comment in detail and Len, Alesha and Bruno could not bring themselves to comment at all. They seemed to have no problem commenting on his other dances - what heinous crimes were committed within the Charleston that prompted this supposed deliberate timing mishap and omission of comments?

If Harry did receive special treatment - why?

I was singling you out for special treatment. Given that your join date was late Dec 2011 I thought you may not be aware of the DS policy on spamming. That is, more than one thread started all on the same topic. Why didn't I post this on all those threads on Alesha's departure? They were not all started by the same person.

I'm still wondering about your reference to my passing on your regards to the Harry & Aliona appreciation thread. I've posted there as often as you have.

My opinion is immaterial now. People can easily look at those five videos, listen to Craig's comments, and decide for themselves whether Craig would have loved or hated Harry's offering.

It had a lot of Charleston steps in it, but did it convey the spirit of the Charleston? Can you imagine Harry delivering the sort of characterisation we saw from Jason? Aliona had to go a different route with Harry, but did the result even qualify as a Charleston?

I would suggest that both Craig and Len hated it - but didn't want to have to tell blatant lies about it in order to award Harry that 39.

Len: THAT'S the way to ............... start a semi-final.

Either you see it or you don't.

I don't (imo because there's nothing there to see). And it still doesn't explain why nobody commented. Do you think Alesha and Bruno hated it too? The same Alesha and Bruno that (combined) awarded Harry 17 tens for his dances from week 4 onwards out of a possible 26? Suddenly, after 7 performances for which they had no problem scoring highly and giving positive comments (possibly Samba apart) they can't being themselves to do this any longer because he's actually completely rubbish so they have to cut the analysis? Don't you realise how ludicrous this sounds? And you still haven't answered my second question - if (as you claim), the comments from the Charleston were deliberately omitted to protect the judges' integrity (it looks more ridiculous the more I read it) - why? Why on earth should Harry Judd of all people qualify for such questionable, dodgy, favourable treatment? Has he got photos of the judges in compromising positions? Does he hold shocking secrets about the show's producers? What you are claiming makes no logical sense.

It could be simply that by that stage everyone knows Harry is going to win. You don't want to critique your winner and sound negative. It debases the show. Even Chris gets a 40 in his final. The only reason for wanting Harry to win and sound brilliant is that that may sell most tour tickets, but they may not have a problem there anyway and who wins may not matter, it may have crossed no one's mind anyway , and its inconsequential - as Chelsee hasn't done well enough to beat him even in the dancing.

You could also argue that verything about this series of SCD was hyped up - best series ever, best final, best costumes, best contestants, best competition...........best venues. Everyone in the final was hyped up as well as Harry. They made the point Jason deserved to be there and gave him 40 to prove it too. Given that setting, they couldn't very well turn around in the two final stages and tell Harry he couldn't act and was dull, or tell Chelsee she was messy, or tell Artem he had worn Holly out. At some point they may even have started believing the hype.

Is there really any point in me offering reasons, when your response will surely be that it's just my opinion and I can't prove it?

The fact is that the judges' analysis of the Charleston was skipped.

I would suggest that anybody looking at the video can see that they could have found time for the analysis. They could have left Bruce's joke until later. They could have left the introduction of the band until later. They could have left less time for the comparatively meaningless interview with Tess.

They clearly COULD have found time for the judges' analysis. They didn't - therefore they didn't want to.

I've offered a possible reason. A Charleston is supposed to have "bags of character". Harry's personality is such that he was never going to come remotely close to delivering that essential element. So Aliona took liberties with the interpretation, and bombed in the eyes of sticklers like Craig and Len.

I suspect that had Bruno commented he might have described it as being "neither Arthur nor Martha".

I'm still waiting for a single alternative reason for the omission of the analysis part which is in any way believable. As long as there is only one believable explanation then for me it has to be THE explanation.

Yep, this

You seem to know what you're looking at - in what way was Chelsee "messy"?

Clearly there was a learning curve with her just as there was with the others. I can't seem to get a credible answer from anybody here regarding the flaws in her technique by the time we got to the semi-final.

Obviously the slide in her AS where she caught her heel springs to mind, but would you mind highlighting a few more instances in those last six dances of where she was messy?

AS
Paso
Jive
Show dance
Rumba
Quickstep

Post #10 Yesterday 21.43 apenny4them
Yesterday, 21:4

"All I ask is that the judges deliver an honest analysis of the performances, and mark them accordingly. If the Public make its decision on the basis of factors other than expertise then so be it."

My final post on here anyway I am sure you will continue to finds things to argue with yourself about and all I say is what ever makes you happy

I am reminded by Richmond blue who wrote on 22/12 11 at 01:11

there's always a feeling of melancholy about the forum as it winds down.
For a few days the arguments rage about the dances in the final, old wounds are re-opened, even poor old Lulu is dragged out for another mauling.
Then it gradually goes quiet on the main board. The "appreciators" (is that a word ? doesn't look right to me) in their log cabins have enough supplies to last the winter, and they continue posting away about their favourite pros and celebs..many of whom have been largely forgotten out in the real world. The rest of us are packing our bags, grabbing a few souvenirs, and hitting the road before the weather breaks for the worse.

My bags are packed I leave with the following words which I am sure you wont consider

DUPLICITY, refer either to practices designed to mislead or to the qualities that produce those practices

Here duplicity passes for wit, and frankness is looked upon as folly

If intricate duplicity is what you like, read on.

As I said, Premier Inns have some cheap offers on. Losing the will to live, here.

Hear Hear

OMG I seem to have entered the Twilight Zone... Will this ever end?

I thought I must have been on the cooking brandy when I realised there was yet ANOTHER thread.....

This is getting totally ridiculous now.

The past can not be changed. Harry won. End of.

What the OP doesnt seem to have grasped is that the judges have to record what score they are going to give the couple as the music finishes, while any applause/standing ovation happens etc and before anything like comments happens .... So what you are saying is that they hated it but gave it 9 10 10 10 anyway?? Get a life....

I would wager money on Bruce taking the whole bus off the rails by forgetting to get comments and just continue on (whether they were already running behind schedule - and that might have been due to the opening jokes and Nice to See you etc gags) is totally immaterial. It happened, and they moved on.

Sorry but this spamming is getting seriously irritating now.

[Mods please merge all the threads on this subject started by the OP.]

You posted on January 4 that you were putting me on your Ignore list. I thought at the time it was too good to be true.

I can't believe that this topic is of such importance to you that you've made as many attempts to muddy the waters as you now have. Can't you come up with something new? Your suggestion that it was actually intended that we hear the judges' analysis of Harry's Charleston is getting really old.

Harry won the competition. Was he the best celebrity dancer? People are free to use the links I've provided to the videos of the dances, so that they can decide for themselves if he was anywhere near as good as the marks awarded by the judges made it appear.

Um really? Just accept it, I loved his Charleston, you didn't, I dont understand why you still need to bitch and moan about it just because you don't agree with him winning

I can't really help you there other than to draw your attention to the following extract from the opening post in this thread -

... if the judges have been deceiving us on the quality of the performances I believe that this should be out in the open. It will certainly cause me to view this year's competition in an entirely different light.

Ha hark at the kettle.

Your suggestion that it was all fixed is getting really old but you should be commended on your efforts on recycling.

The Judges gave him 39 so there would have been no negative comments or would have been I hate but here is a 10.

And if your suggesting that the jewel in the crown of BBC entertainment is fixed don't you think the press, not the biggest fans of the BBC, would be all over them?

PoD nomination..!

Oh, dear, If you just are coming to that conclusion and have been watching Stricly a few series there is only two answers which I am not going to list them because it would offend any ones intelligence by doing so.

Of course the judges deceive us about the quality, anyone in here will agree with that, they often are so OTT in their praise that to think otherwise will be foolish. Part of it is because they need to be encouraging and positive also to those celebrities who are appalling (and I am not revering to the widdy's or sergeants, those are something else) so they have to get OTT when it comes to the better ones. It works like that with everyone.
besides, the important thing as mentioned time and time again, is NOT the judges comments but their scores to create a leader board. You may enjoy the comments above all else in the show, but from what I can see certainly you are on the minority.
Ps: have you watched ITT at all this year?

he gave the dance a 9 - gives the impression to me that he loved it

What was "non-standard" about Harrys Charleston?

Priceless

Now back to the real world - why did they want to skip the judges' analysis of Harry's alleged Charleston?

Are you seriously suggesting it's a coincidence, given Craig's comments to Holly, that Harry's delivery of a non-standard Charleston was waved through for the first time in the history of SCD without a single analysis from the judges?

It's been explained several times about missing the judges comments please do read the comments in all the threads you have created.

Didn't Craig actually like Holly's Charleston and praised Artem for it saying if it wasn't for him we would be stuck in the 1950's.

This suggests that Craig likes "non standard Charleston" as you put so would have enjoyed Harry's. Oh and the fact that he gave it a 9 gave me the impression he enjoyed it?

MontyD - why are you now pretending not to be aware of Craig's "love it or hate it" comment regarding non-standard Charlestons?

Completely agree with your advice to the OP, Monty. Would add to that "stop creating so many posts on the same subjects as well". The mods didn't used to allow that - are they still on holiday?

When a poster bangs on and on, repeating the same point over and over and over again, it kind of kills DISCUSSION of a point.

And gets on people's tits. Including mine.

Lost in translation -

"Non-standard Charleston" - I didn't like it.

"Feel free to use videos of the dances" - Until you agree with me.

"Getting old" - I don't agree with your reasoning.

"Only one believable explanation" - my explanation and I'm sticking to it -lalala I can't hear you...