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  • TV Shows: UK
Sherlock - New BBC Drama (Part 2)
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MrsGeneHunt
05-01-2014
The thing with 'Sherlock' is that a) you need to give each episode your full attention (I cannot take people seriously when they attempt to critique it AS THEY WATCH, for clearly they are only half-watching!) and b) it's only once the episode is over that the individual plot threads come together and can, therefore, be fully appreciated and understood.

There was more exploration of John and Sherlock's friendship - the stag night scenes were hilarious and there was quite a bit of Johnlock going on (I loved Sherlock's little 'I don't mind' aside when drunk John put his hand on Sherlock's knee and then hastily removed it! Sweet!). Then there were the seemingly unconnected cases (the 'ghost' dater and the 'invisible' stabber) that came together neatly at the end and provided the answer to the wedding murder question.

My only niggle this series is Mary. I can't help but wonder why the show's creators decided to take John down the matrimonial path and away from Sherlock... unless it is to be only a temporary measure. Until tonight I had almost assumed that Mary would die in episode 3 (after all, that's her fictional fate) but now I'm not so sure. Why add a pregnancy to the mix? To make her end even more tragic? Or is Mary here to stay? If so, again, I wonder why. We only get three episodes every two years: do we really need a gooseberry? Even a sweet, well-meaning one? Tonight, despite all Mary's gushing over Sherlock, I couldn't help but wish her miles away every time she made an appearance! More of the boys, please - less of dull domesticity!
Ed Sizzers
05-01-2014
Originally Posted by gurney-slade:
“Oh dear. Sentiment and whimsy. Was this the episode where Sherlock jumped the shark? One last chance, next week, to prove it wasn't.”

No.

And that's not what the phrase means anyway.
platelet
05-01-2014
Originally Posted by Sallysally:
“This series (so far) is much more about the psychology of Gatiss and his relationship with Moffat than actual detecting. .”

fixed it for you
Normandie
05-01-2014
Originally Posted by snork:
“I think she may be working for this series bad guy.”

If so, I think it could only be accidental / unintentional on Mary's part. I don't see the series devastating Watson twice in four episodes. And it (Bad Mary) would be such a departure from the books.
saladfingers81
05-01-2014
Originally Posted by Ed Sizzers:
“No.

And that's not what the phrase means anyway.”

File Jump the Shark next to Deus Ex Machina as the lazy go to phrase for people on internet forums who think it means 'an episode I didn't like'.
FunkyJawa
05-01-2014
Originally Posted by slouchingthatch:
“I can't really provide any pointers without giving the game away. I'll happily point it out after the finale next weekend, but it is a small giveaway clue that really does give a major plot point away.

Sorry, I don't mean to be obtuse, but as a reviewer I'm not supposed to give spoilers away about episodes I've been granted preview privileges to.”

and don't you just wear that privelege so boastfully?!
slouchingthatch
05-01-2014
Originally Posted by Doktor Dances:
“But why have the "wait until next week" thing? It's not a soap.

Moff has strangled Doctor Who half-to-death with his obsession over story arcs and oh-so-clever narrative twisting. It's barely acceptable with tea time sci-fi. It's unforgivable with a detective drama.

Hopefully the growing negativity towards Moff here and elsewhere will be noticed by the BBC, who should get rid of him PDQ.”

Why would the BBC get rid of him? Nearly 10m watched episode 1 live, and Sherlock is a HUGE international success commercially (as is Doctor Who, whether you like it or not - and I do share some of your concerns about that show).

And it's absolutely not a soap. But a sophisticated contemporary drama also lays a trail of breadcrumbs which are all scooped together at a later date. Lots of people rave about The Bridge - the narrative structure there is very similar.

All I can really say for now is watch the finale and then judge the series as one story with three parts. After watching the finale, my view of this episode did change somewhat (although I still don't think it's very good).
Department_S
05-01-2014
The rather overlong scene in the debating chamber with the women was rather over indulgent for me. The whittling down of the women with " not you, not you"" was seemingly a strong reference to "I'm a Celebrity" in which case you could call it brilliantly clever weaving in such popular culture references, or it just misfired as a scene. I don't know which.
Rippa
05-01-2014
Sherlock said the Major had been killed hours before he'd arrived at the wedding - but how did Mayfly Man stab him with the belt when the whole point was he had to use the wedding to draw him out?
saladfingers81
05-01-2014
Originally Posted by slouchingthatch:
“Why would the BBC get rid of him? Nearly 10m watched episode 1 live, and Sherlock is a HUGE international success commercially (as is Doctor Who, whether you like it or not - and I do share some of your concerns about that show).

And it's absolutely not a soap. But a sophisticated contemporary drama also lays a trail of breadcrumbs which are all scooped together at a later date. Lots of people rave about The Bridge - the narrative structure there is very similar.

All I can really say for now is watch the finale and then judge the series as one story with three parts. After watching the finale, my view of this episode did change somewhat (although I still don't think it's very good).”

Yes but massive viewing figures, critical acclaim and worldwide success don't matter. The BBC have already circulated an emergency memo to the top brass letting them know that some people on DS aren't happy. The game is up!
Doktor Dances
05-01-2014
Originally Posted by saladfingers81:
“Dream on. Moffat is one of the jewels in the BBC crown. I think he makes alot of silly decisions. I don't like some of the aspects of his particular style. But if you think the BBC will get rid of him? Delusion.

Yeah. I suppose they'll concentrate on Silent Witness and Atlantis and New Tricks instead and the geniuses running those shows.”

Read the instant feedback coming through here and Twitter, where real people are reacting in real time to what is on screen. They don't like it. They don't understand why it's changed. They don't accept Moff's detached smug explanations. They don't want it.

As has been explained here by other doubters and critics - it's all very well making scenes laugh-a-minute and clever-clever and fit for Tumblr gifs, but away from the Internet echo chamber, real people in living rooms over the country are switching off.

Moff could do well to visit somewhere he can't see from his ivory tower. He may notice a fair amount of commercial breaks and Netflix logos where once his programmes used to be.
Welsh-lad
05-01-2014
Benedict has so much dialogue to learn - I was considering it tonight. It must be reams of script.
And he's so busy with other things too.
Respect!
slouchingthatch
05-01-2014
Originally Posted by hetty_rose:
“I don't want you to give anything away, just you said if we had read the pre show press releases..so I'm guessing they are out there to be read ( or else why mention them and suggest we might have read them) -)nd maybe you could point me to where they are located (in a spoiler tag if necessary) as I wouldn't know where to find them myself..so only asking you to point my to what's already out there, not anything not yet released.”

If I'm too specific, though, it will give it away. If you search through the articles on Sherlock on DS or radiotimes.com, the clue you need is there. In fact, the relevant bit of info was covered by EVERY media outlet. It just requires a little detective work to put the clues together ...
Harris_07
05-01-2014
Did the ending remind anyone else of Derek at Rodney's wedding in Only Fools and Horses?
jiminyjillicker
05-01-2014
Originally Posted by slouchingthatch:
“And yet contained a subtle clue which will become significant in the finale ...”

It's satisfying as a fan to re-watch episodes and with hindsight be able to look for and spot hidden 'clues' and elements of foreshadowing but the fact that there are clues to the mystery of an as yet unknown episode cannot justify such weak and wishy-washy offerings as series 3 has served so far. Despite all the hype episode 1 never delivered a concrete resolution to how Sherlock actually faked his death (which after 2 years of waiting for the writers to go "oh he could've done it several ways" feels like a real cop out) and although there was a crime to solve it was quite jumbled and in the end was sorted by a bomb having an off switch (lazy). Episode two felt equally as confused narrative wise with much jumping about and again although the threads were tied at the end it was weak overall when compared to series 1 and 2 which have clear,stand alone episodes which all contain character, comedy AND crime. I am a real fan but very disappointed with series 3 so far. I can only hope that the finale somehow makes up for eps 1 and 2 but even so the feel of the show has changed immensely and I won't be rushing to buy the dvd.
nethwen
05-01-2014
Originally Posted by Department_S:
“The rather overlong scene in the debating chamber with the women was rather over indulgent for me. The whittling down of the women with " not you, not you"" was seemingly a strong reference to "I'm a Celebrity" in which case you could call it brilliantly clever weaving in such popular culture references, or it just misfired as a scene. I don't know which.”

Or Fifteen to One?

I think that whole best man speech was a play on how interminably long wedding speeches can go on for in real life.
Eira
05-01-2014
Originally Posted by Department_S:
“The rather overlong scene in the debating chamber with the women was rather over indulgent for me. The whittling down of the women with " not you, not you"" was seemingly a strong reference to "I'm a Celebrity" in which case you could call it brilliantly clever weaving in such popular culture references, or it just misfired as a scene. I don't know which.”

I thought it was like a game of Guess Who.
Soupietwist
05-01-2014
Originally Posted by Doktor Dances:
“But why have the "wait until next week" thing? It's not a soap.

Moff has strangled Doctor Who half-to-death with his obsession over story arcs and oh-so-clever narrative twisting. It's barely acceptable with tea time sci-fi. It's unforgivable with a detective drama.

Hopefully the growing negativity towards Moff here and elsewhere will be noticed by the BBC, who should get rid of him PDQ.”

I bet you regret picking that name....
slouchingthatch
05-01-2014
Originally Posted by nethwen:
“I'm not one of those people that thinks Mary is in the way. Nor do I 'hate' her. And I'm certainly NOT into slash fan fiction, thanks.

There's just something not right about how she's being portrayed.

Remember when Sherlock did his deduction cloud on her in the last episode? 'Liar' came up as one of them.

There is also no chemistry between John and Mary IMHO.”

Really? You do realise they are long-term partners and have two children together?
Eater Sundae
05-01-2014
Originally Posted by jack_kerouac:
“Never had to rewatch any classic episode of Sherlock before.

One episode, one crime , one detective work deductions, one solved crime , one reveal.

Job done.

It used to be called Crime Writing before Dr Who in a Deerstalker dragged his sorry butt through a mire of episodes to get to the point ...”

Isn't that pretty much what happened today? He solved a crime.
Doktor Dances
05-01-2014
Originally Posted by gurney-slade:
“Oh dear. Sentiment and whimsy. Was this the episode where Sherlock jumped the shark? One last chance, next week, to prove it wasn't.”

You are feeling the pain of us Doctor Who fans who have watched the dreaded Moffat take the show over the shark so many times the jet-skis are worn out.
saladfingers81
05-01-2014
Originally Posted by Doktor Dances:
“Read the instant feedback coming through here and Twitter, where real people are reacting in real time to what is on screen. They don't like it. They don't understand why it's changed. They don't accept Moff's detached smug explanations. They don't want it.

As has been explained here by other doubters and critics - it's all very well making scenes laugh-a-minute and clever-clever and fit for Tumblr gifs, but away from the Internet echo chamber, real people in living rooms over the country are switching off.

Moff could do well to visit somewhere he can't see from his ivory tower. He may notice a fair amount of commercial breaks and Netflix logos where once his programmes used to be.”

You're actually making things up. Away from the internet echo chamber the first episode got the highest ratings of the series and was almost universally well reviewed. Its pretty desperate if you're having to make things up.
Emma L
05-01-2014
In the books Watson got married and stayed married - I think she brings a great dynamic to the show.
sn_22
05-01-2014
Originally Posted by Unfledged:
“I hadn't thought of them as gifs, but I know what you mean. I was surprised when I read that Moffat hadn't written this episode as it has his hallmarks of a 'clever' episode - I can just imagine the brainstorm where he said "Wouldn't it be great if Shelock gave a best man's speech. I bet we can make an episode out of that!””

I just got to thinking about how differently the episode may have played out if it was written before they knew what the reaction to previous episodes was. I suggest It would have been an entirely different episode, at least in tone. They can't possibly have put in some of the stuff they did tonight without thinking "that one'll go down a storm on Tumblr".

Don't get me wrong, part of the shows appeal is its playful humour and creative visual style - but they seem to be trying to outdo themselves with each passing episode now. Balance is needed.
platelet
05-01-2014
Originally Posted by nethwen:
“There's just something not right about how she's being portrayed.”

She's an obvious weakness for Watson, and something that can be exploited to separate him from Holmes.

What I think we were seeing this week were precient glimmers of next week's impending doom
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