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Our phone - but they won't stop blocking it!


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Old 22-02-2012, 15:28
dcv
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My son found an Iphone 3gs. It had obviously fallen from a great height but had been lucky enough to hit mud and embed all but a corner of it. My son has eyes like a cat and spotted it. There was also no SIM in it.
Ok me being Mr honest and all for good Karma made sure we handed it in to the police and I assured my son that if we were honest we would get the phone back if the owner could not be traced and possible get a reward if the owner was traced. Whatever happened it would all be good karma for us.
Well it appears that Vodafone was blocking the phone via the IMEI but they only track customers via SIM. The remaining IMEI blocking database record had no owner information on it either because Vodafone did not add it or the IMEI blocking system cannot record it.
So the end result is the owner cannot be traced. So I believe in English law the phone now becomes my property as my son is under 16 and therefore cannot own anything. I also obtained a letter from the local police when the phone was returned stating that they could not trace the owner.
As the phone was now my legal property I asked Vodafone to remove the block so we could use it. I asked several times and tried various routes to get past the normal call centre operator. The answer I got was always the same “The phone will belong to a person or an insurance company – we can’t trace who it is – it is an unknown person – we will not remove the block”. I also tried writing to the legal department but got no reply. I can understand why Vodafone would not want to remove this block as it would cause a lot of inconvenience and problems working with the IMEI blocking system. However, as I see it we have been totally honest and the phone is now legally mine. The system should show my son that being honest is the best way to behave.
As I did want to show honesty pays to my son I went a step further and started a small claim at Worcester County Court Case Number 1IR26234 which cost £50. I put forward all the evidence above and also specifically stated that although Vodafone can refuse to serve me, that is enable the phone on their network, I believe they should not actively block the phone to prevent me using another phone network. They should cease and desist from running the block. I also believe in law that as the owner of a phone (not having a contract on it) they would be legally obliged to remove any tie in to their network from the phone (Network Lock not a block). The one sentence answer from District Judge Savage “The claim is struck out because the Claimant discloses no contractual or other basis obliging the Claimant to use it on their network”. This when I stated in the claim “I realise Vodafone have a right to refuse to serve me however they should not block me from other networks”. They want another £50 for me to go back to see the Judge and argue the point.
So from my point of view I am the legal owner of an Iphone 3gs which is unusable because Vodafone is running a blocking service against the IMEI number. They should recognise my rightful ownership and cease-desist from the blocking. This is bad karma on Vodafone and a poor example of honesty to my son.
Is there anything that anybody can think of that will enable my son to use the phone that is now rightfully his?
More info and docs on http://www.davidcvanes.webspace.virg...ml/iphone.html
Facebook http://www.facebook.com/pages/Vodafo...75161612598408
Or Tweet with #vodapirate

Thanks Dave
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Old 22-02-2012, 15:37
toyotacity
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At the end of the day, someone has reported the phone lost/stolen, the imei has been blocked

Vodafone can't unblock it unless they have proof of purchase, usually a receipt or delivery note showing the imei, as you found the phone, yes you can keep it as it wasn't claimed, but why should vodafone unblock it as it wasn't your phone to begin with
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Old 22-02-2012, 15:46
neo_wales
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If an insurance claim was made then the phone is not yours, its the insurance company. Forget about it, its not worth wasting more money.
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Old 22-02-2012, 15:59
Stiggles
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Sorry but your getting tangled up in a mess you created.

You found a phone which didn't belong to you. The original owner has claimed off the insurance and the insurance company has blocked the phone to prevent its use which it standard procedure. Yet you think you have some right to keep this phone?

What a weird way to look at it. Also not a good example to set your kids.
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Old 22-02-2012, 16:23
sahalouise
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You went to all this trouble for a 3GS?

Give it, as others have said, it's not worth it.
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Old 22-02-2012, 16:29
call100
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Hang on a minute people... read the post again.
The guy found a phone and did the right thing. He handed it to the Police. The Police failed to find the legal owner. The phone was then handed back to the OP and became (in law) his property.
So yes, he does have the legal right to keep it.
In Scotland the law differs slightly and the owner can still claim the goods up to one year after they are found, even if the Police hand them over to you. After that year the property becomes yours. and it cannot be claimed by anyone else.

The Vodafone question would be entirely up to Vodafone I guess.
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Old 22-02-2012, 17:16
Stiggles
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Hang on a minute people... read the post again.
The guy found a phone and did the right thing. He handed it to the Police. The Police failed to find the legal owner. The phone was then handed back to the OP and became (in law) his property.
So yes, he does have the legal right to keep it.
In Scotland the law differs slightly and the owner can still claim the goods up to one year after they are found, even if the Police hand them over to you. After that year the property becomes yours. and it cannot be claimed by anyone else.

The Vodafone question would be entirely up to Vodafone I guess.
Indeed, he has the legal right to keep it as defined by law but, someone has reported the phone stolen or lost and claimed for a new one. The insurance company rightly so blocked the old one.

While he can keep it by law he just cant use the services on it lol
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Old 22-02-2012, 17:58
booie
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The Handset and the connection to a network are 2 different things.
The phone is legally yours so send it off to one of the online mobile phone buyers and get some money for it, might cover your court costs.
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Old 22-02-2012, 18:19
call100
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Indeed, he has the legal right to keep it as defined by law but, someone has reported the phone stolen or lost and claimed for a new one. The insurance company rightly so blocked the old one.

While he can keep it by law he just cant use the services on it lol
OK regarding the service. But the insurance company doesn't own it because they didn't claim it in the time allocated. Also, you questioned the fact that he had the right to keep the phone and you cast aspersions on the example he was setting his kids.
Yet you think you have some right to keep this phone?

What a weird way to look at it. Also not a good example to set your kids.
In fact he set a good example to them.
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Old 22-02-2012, 20:11
Roush
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This is absurd.

You want a service from Vodafone (the unblocking of a handset) which they have refused to provide. You have no contract with Vodafone in relation to this, and Vodafone are under no obligation whatsoever to provide this service. This in turn means you have no legal basis from which to claim damages for breach of contract, as no contract exists.

The notion that Vodafone have damaged you to the amount of £370 as a result of them refusing to carry out the aforementioned service is ridiculous. You are not worse off because of their refusal to carry out a service. If anything, you are better off as a result of fortuitous events (finding the phone and the owner not claiming it). This does not oblige Vodafone to do anything, and does not mean you have suffered harm.

The judge quite rightly stuck off the case without even asking Vodafone to offer a defence as you offered no evidence whatsoever that supports your preposterous claims. Our legal system does not work on the basis of karma.
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Old 22-02-2012, 23:55
lexy_86
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This is absurd.

You want a service from Vodafone (the unblocking of a handset) which they have refused to provide. You have no contract with Vodafone in relation to this, and Vodafone are under no obligation whatsoever to provide this service. This in turn means you have no legal basis from which to claim damages for breach of contract, as no contract exists.

The notion that Vodafone have damaged you to the amount of £370 as a result of them refusing to carry out the aforementioned service is ridiculous. You are not worse off because of their refusal to carry out a service. If anything, you are better off as a result of fortuitous events (finding the phone and the owner not claiming it). This does not oblige Vodafone to do anything, and does not mean you have suffered harm.

The judge quite rightly stuck off the case without even asking Vodafone to offer a defence as you offered no evidence whatsoever that supports your preposterous claims. Our legal system does not work on the basis of karma.
This.

This is literally one of the most absurd threads I have read in a long time.

Echoing Roush, rightly or wrongly the OP now has the legal right to possess the handset but Vodafone are under no legal obligation to release its cellular capabilities to someone with whom they have no contractual relationship.

I'm no fan of Vodafone but I do think it's a shame they didn't send some lawyers to attend the hearing and have a wasted costs order placed against the OP.
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Old 23-02-2012, 00:19
call100
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Just look on it as finding an iPod!!!
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Old 23-02-2012, 00:30
lexy_86
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Just look on it as finding an iPod!!!
Exactly.

This a very good example of that age old adage - 'never look a gifthorse in the mouth', and a better lesson to teach his son than that hilarious display of self-entitlement.
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Old 23-02-2012, 05:26
Stiggles
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In fact he set a good example to them.
What? By telling his son he will have a phone that was more than likely stolen come hell or high water? That's a terrible thing to teach kids!

The fact the phone was found with no sim probably shows the phone was probably stolen in the first place and the owner had reported it stolen hence the block, then the person ditched it once it wasnt working. To then take Vodaphone to court is sheer idiocy and is not a good thing to teach kids either.
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Old 23-02-2012, 10:55
call100
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What? By telling his son he will have a phone that was more than likely stolen come hell or high water? That's a terrible thing to teach kids!

The fact the phone was found with no sim probably shows the phone was probably stolen in the first place and the owner had reported it stolen hence the block, then the person ditched it once it wasnt working. To then take Vodaphone to court is sheer idiocy and is not a good thing to teach kids either.
I was referring to the handing it in and obtaining it legally, as you well know.
I stated that the Vodafone thing was a different matter and up to Vodafone.
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Old 23-02-2012, 11:50
Stuart_h
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I was referring to the handing it in and obtaining it legally, as you well know.
I stated that the Vodafone thing was a different matter and up to Vodafone.
on a similar note we found an ipod - one that had obviously been lost by a young female holidaymaker from the far east. i connected it up to try and find a contact address but to no avail.

Having a daughter myself and knowing how gutted she would be if she lost something like that I rung Apple. I spent some time being passed from one person to thte next. They stated they couldnt provide any contact details to me to post the item to the owner - which i can totally understand. I offered to provide my details so the owner could contact me. They refused this also. I even offered to send it to Apple for them to send off but they even rejected this idea. So some poor girl has lost her ipod and holiday snaps because I couldnt post it back.

As a good samaritan i would have sent it back at my own cost !

Apple must 'know' who registered the item. And Apple would surely know that if we started using the iPod that it was registered to someone else. My assumption is that the only option left is to bin the thing...... which is a shame.

I think the OP did the right thing but sadly is probably in the same state as I am. I also agree that Vodaphone have no obligation to unlock it and that legal chasing is pointless. End result in both cases is that a perfectly functional piece of hardware has to be thrown away which is completely daft.
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Old 24-02-2012, 02:08
The Lord Lucan
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He has the right to keep it but thats it. Unlikely Voda will unblock.

Sell it abroad as i believe it could work there.
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Old 24-02-2012, 21:43
Snake_Eater
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You found a phone, the owner who lost it has arranged for it to be blocked, regardless of who has said you can keep it or not, it is still property of the original owner. Voda do not have to unblock it because you have been told you can keep it.
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Old 24-02-2012, 21:51
neo_wales
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He can keep it...until the rightful owners, the insurance company ask for it back, its simply not his phone. Possession ain't nine tenths of the law anymore.
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Old 24-02-2012, 22:33
call100
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He can keep it...until the rightful owners, the insurance company ask for it back, its simply not his phone. Possession ain't nine tenths of the law anymore.
Sorry, but that is incorrect.
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Old 25-02-2012, 04:48
neo_wales
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[quote=call100;56765528]Sorry, but that is incorrect.[/QUOTE

No its not, sorry.]
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Old 25-02-2012, 10:03
call100
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[quote=neo_wales;56769328]
Sorry, but that is incorrect.[/QUOTE

No its not, sorry.]
Don't want to enter into a long protracted argument. You carry on believing that and I'll carry on knowing it's not correct and we can both be happy.
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Old 26-02-2012, 02:45
CapitalLife
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Sorry, but that is incorrect.
No its not, sorry.]
Are you a lawyer? Because if you are you could have a nice little number taking Strathclyde Police to court, as they auction off unclaimed items of lost property. Assuming that what you are asserting is correct. All you'd have to do is lose something in their area and then not claim it wait till it came up for auction and then hit them for selling your unclaimed property.

https://www.strathclyde.police.uk/in...D=911&docID=-1
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Old 26-02-2012, 08:35
Lushness
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Wow I can't believe you went to the small claims court, just use the thing as an iPod!
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Old 26-02-2012, 09:08
call100
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Are you a lawyer? Because if you are you could have a nice little number taking Strathclyde Police to court, as they auction off unclaimed items of lost property. Assuming that what you are asserting is correct. All you'd have to do is lose something in their area and then not claim it wait till it came up for auction and then hit them for selling your unclaimed property.

https://www.strathclyde.police.uk/in...D=911&docID=-1
The law in Scotland is different. You could be required to hand the property back for 12 months after you have been given it by the Police.
Not withstanding that, All UK police forces have sales of unclaimed property. That is property handed in but then not claimed by either owner or finder. When you hand something in, if you wish to claim it, you have to go and physically collect it after the specified time. If you do not, it ends up in one of those sales.
There are rules that determine your rights to keep. The property must be found on public property and must have been lost (not stolen and dumped) to name but two.
Your post doesn't make sense. If you lost something, didn't report it to the Police and did not claim it. You would have no case to hit them with for selling your unclaimed property.
As I said. I'm happy for anyone to disagree and have their own beliefs. However erroneous those beliefs may be..
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