There was a gap when the horses moved into the final run in-several horses went through and the camera shot remained static missing the ongoing action. Not for long but noticeable given that it was the business end of the race.

I felt sorry for Simon Holt today, he himself did an excellent job as always, but he was let down by the producers/directors. They had him in shot right before the start (something which they never normally do) and then at the end Alice Plunkett cut him off to interview the winning jockey while he was still talking.

That was really the theme of the day, the 'talent' were very good, Brian Gleeson in particular was excellent across the meeting, but it was the production/directing that let things down somewhat. The normal shot of the start from behind didn't work with the new start position and they clearly weren't prepared for the big screen on the course that blocked out the fence before The Chair and as others have mentioned the angle was too far away. I'm presuming it was a different camera that they used today as the distance wasn't that great for the other races over the National fences?

Are you sure. I thought the picture quality was very flat, my wife even commented on how poor the picture was (CH4 HD via SAT).

On another point imagine the fuss if the BBC had missed the start of the race, I have never understand why people have such a rose tinted view of Ch4 sport coverage.

Piss poor from C4. Okay the BBC's coverage was noware near perfect but they actually got the basics right!

It was a total mess at the start. Poor Holt was totaly messed up there and it took him a moment to recover.

Hoiles to me was just poor and conveyed absolutely no emotion over what so ever. He just reeled of the names like a machine. Holt and Bartlett were good. Bartlett was slightly slow on the handover but he picked up and was good. He was underused though.

Holt did a solid job.

The camera work on the race sucked all of the action out of the race. We got a long shot and ended up missing a whole jump! I don't care if it was there new bit of tech I wasn't to see the race a the BBC's Old fashioned came on the coarse was fine.

The re-run was a shambles with Luck just radomly shouting STOP and the fences were the wrong way around at one point!

Accept for Luck, Hoiles the rest of the on screen team were fine. I find the whole studio thing bland an useless though. It's a far cry from francome and McGrath in the analysis box. They worked brilliantly together. The studio doesn't work.

Overall I preferred the BBC coverage. And I never in a million years (apart from nostalgia) would have thought that. Old C4 racing may have been getting a tad stale and was in need of a few new faces but it was great and they got the basics right as well.

We have sadly ended up with this horrid mish mash coverage. There is stunning talent in that team but they are being wasted in this fails format.

Shame

Ken

Well certainly the BBC's coverage of racing was very sparse in recent years with only a few days covered now compared to what they used to cover. At least Channel 4 have racing every Saturday and regularly 2 meetings and quite alot of midweek racing covered as well. So far better coverage by Channel 4 in the number of meetings covered.
Ian

It was HD but the quality isn't quite as good as the BBC's is. And I am told Sky's is really really good.

But yes . Imagine if the BBC would have missed the start! They would have had the entire world come down on them.

The only step up for me is Holt. I really liked Aussie Jim. He had a great voice and really conveyed emotion across (last year's national was a stunning commentary). But sadly for Jim he faded big time and he was making to many errors in the end. But I will remember his commentary fondly. But I now agree Holt is the best caller.

That doesn't exempt him from criticism though. I thought he sounded restrained on the big race today. It didn't help the poor man was buggered at the start.

Ken

Was that on the second circuit? To me it sounded like the pause was because they forgot to turn Bartlett's mic up as when you heard him he was half way through a word.

For me

Pluses - Simon Holt ( as ever )
Alice Plunkett ( should be host )
Mick Fitzgerald ( certainly adds a jockeys perspective )

Minuses - Not enough Fat Al ( he added humour to preoceedings )
Jim and Graham ( don't seem to gel at all )
The studio set up ( very flat and hate the big screen table )

C4's coverage was abysmal. The start and its drama was complete missed while the actual camera shots of the race made me wish I was actually there so I could get a better view.

On the meeting the BBC covered properly I believe we have gone nowhere. The BBC's coverage just before it was cut in 2007 was actually really good for the big meetings.

There coverage of day to day racing was always poor compared to C4 and that's where C4 deserve a lot of credit.

I still think loosing the BBC is a bad thing for racing. The BBC showed only 13 days in the last few years which was too little. If C4 didn't throw there toys out of there pram (which they are entitled to do so) The BBC would have regained The Cheltenham Festival and maybe Glorious Goodwood. But C4's commitment to the minor meeting meant they and a bigger leg to stand on and it made the BBC look like they didn't care. I believe they did care but they were cornered. They couldn't show as much as C4 because I it would be unfair on the majority of licence fee payers to go spending money like that on what is let's face it a niche sport.

So The BBC due to budget cut's and wanting to hold on to a wide range of sports had to make cut's and sadly the pricey and niche event's to cover had to go. I know it's painful and annoying but they do have to think about everyone and that's why I think racing died on the BBC.

C4 is what we have now and we should be thankful really.

Sorry for the big rambling post's

Ken

Your right on that one. Sorry to Ian there. So yet again it's a silly error from the producers!

Shocking.

Thank's for pointing that out because actually every time they handed to him it sounded like they always had to turn the volume up.

But the whole thing felt unusually flat to me. Was the race crap or was it the coverage? I think it was the coverage.

Ken

I agree with that. Bring Fat Al back because we entertain's and brings gravitas that was missing.

Ken

On the second circuit Hoiles didn't hand over to Bartlett.

ie Hoiles just stopped talking - he didn't say "here's Ian Bartlett".

The fact Simon was looking away from the start when Balding spoke to him was even worse as he clearly was working on the noise of the crowd that made him aware that the start was very very close, hence why the race was off before the poor guy got into full flow.
He did really well considering but surely you should always have a camera down at the start.
Have to agree about Hoyles, very monotone and one paced just didn't seem to up his commentary at all considering it was the Grand National.
Not sure how the main horse racing critics will see it but for me very disappointing but can only hope next year a vast improvement will occur.

Absolutely!!! Couldn't agree more!!!

I don't mind the Grand National and all racing going to C4 if they can provide 100% commitment.

I also don't mind bringing in Balding for the big races.

But it is an absolute travesty to lose Alastair Down - one of the absolute highest class acts of TV sport in this country.

They should have kept him as main presenter for other meets and then have him as a sort of "joint number 1" with Balding on the days Balding comes in - ie sharing the presentation even if they let Balding do the most high profile bits.

You just can't replace quality like Alistair Down with someone like Nick Luck. Luck is OK but he's a bog standard middle of the road presenter. Alistair Down is a class operator.

Hoiles was the weak link. Darren Owen back next year I reckon.

Who else is there?

Ken

John Hunt matey, clear second for me behind Simon Holt and knows his stuff well, good passionate commentator would of been ideal for todays big race.

I'd even prefer mike cattermole over luck!

The BBC team towards the end was very weak but there redeeming fa actor was they worked very well together. This is the opposite problem I think. You have talent but they don't jell and they are slightly flat on there own.

Alastair Down is a huge loss not to have him there. Derek Thompson I would welcome back as well.

Ken

He is on 5live at the moment. And yes he is very good. I always thought he would take over from McGrath at the BBC TV meetings.

Good call. But would he wan't to play second fiddle on C4 when you can be top dog on 5live.

Ken

Hoiles didn't hand over to Ian Bartlett on the second circuit, but it was an issue with the mic as having just watched it again the first you hear from Bartlett is him saying 'jacket leading up to' so he must have been in mid sentence.

I think it showed with Hoiles that it was his first National on television and he commentated on it in a similar style to how he would have done that section on-course in the past few years. If you look back at other National commentaries that's how the commentator on that part of the course (whether it be Cattermole, Machin, Johnson etc) does it and they don't always hand over with a name check either. If you watch previous Nationals where he's been on the start/finish Hoiles far from monotone or one paced

Weird Question time. What was the music the BBC used when there were shot's of the course introducing the program? They always used it. It was quite cheesy but it was all part of there "bigging up the event tactic".

They played it every meeting last year.

Ken

The course commentary team (Darren Owen, Mark Johnson and Stuart Machin) and the Five Live commentary team (John Hunt, Malcolm Tomlinson, Matt Jones and Gareth O'Brien) were both very good.

As Hoiles is C4 number 2 to Holt I think it is a certainty he will be there next year. Bit harsh to bin him based on one race. I don't mind Richard Hoiles but I agree, there are better.

I was going to ask who the course commentators were, sounds a very good team I would certainly of swapped two of those in place of Hoyles and Bartlett today.
Who called the final stages?

That's a fair point.

I'm just really disappointed with C4. Maybe I was expecting to much. It was more C4 athletics 2011 than C4 racing.

Ken