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Horse Racing on Terrestrial TV
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mightymillie
25-10-2015
Originally Posted by Glenn A:
“ITV were a big player in racing until World of Sport ended 30 years ago and their Saturday racing moved to Channel 4. Before Channel 4 took over racing, ITV was the home of the flat classics and big flat meetings like The Ebor at York( most national hunt racing was shown by the BBC).
However, I doubt such delights as the ITV 7 and weekday racing from Recar are likely to return as the audience won't be big enough. I think what's likely to happen is ITV, who really need a big sports contract since they've lost most of their football, will probably buy the big rating events such as The Grand National, Cheltenham Festival and Royal Ascot and the other racing will probably go over to subscription channels if Channel 4 decide to quit.”

ITV's issue will be that there are some periods when ITV4 has other commitments already: Glorious Goodwood and the King George VI meeting, for example will clash with the final stages of the Tour de France; the Derby with the French Open tennis; and the Gold Cup with darts.

...so they may be cherry picking meetings to fill gaps, rather than just taking the highest profile ones.
stv viewer
25-10-2015
Originally Posted by mightymillie:
“ITV's issue will be that there are some periods when ITV4 has other commitments already: Glorious Goodwood and the King George VI meeting, for example will clash with the final stages of the Tour de France; the Derby with the French Open tennis; and the Gold Cup with darts.

...so they may be cherry picking meetings to fill gaps, rather than just taking the highest profile ones.”

Itv 3 has been used in the past if there is a clash of two sports at the same time
SteveBentley
25-10-2015
Isn't it the case that all of the racing Channel 4 shows us also on either At The Races or Racing UK, who also show the whole card rather than the feature races and a few either side?

Perhaps the decline of C4 racing is that the more committed viewer will be paying for those services and have no need to watch on C4.

The landscape has changed too since the glory days people are remeniscing about, when broadcasters were the main way to get up to date odds etc. Nowadays you have bookmakers' apps and the like, so perhaps people just want the race and aren't too bothered by the filler between then?
Neil_Harris
25-10-2015
I can't see ITV going for horse racing, they'd get more viewers for back to back game shows.

I actually don't think the beeb has any interest apart from perhaps Royal Ascot, given their obsession with the Royals it must hurt them that they miss out on the social occasion that it is.
They have actually been very negative towards the national since they lost it.

I'm afraid its 4 or nothing.
sparkie70
25-10-2015
Originally Posted by ftakeith:
“But bbctv used to get to better viewing figures for the big race meetings than channel 4

Could ITV buy the whole package
Have the big races/meeting on itv1 and have the rest on itv4”

I can see ITV doing the big meetings with ITV4 doing some say the national on weekdays but remember as a whole the channel is way down even on freeview epg.
Ok they get decent ratings for tennis & the Tour but doubt they get C4 ratings.
swingaleg
25-10-2015
Originally Posted by SteveBentley:
“Isn't it the case that all of the racing Channel 4 shows us also on either At The Races or Racing UK, who also show the whole card rather than the feature races and a few either side?

Perhaps the decline of C4 racing is that the more committed viewer will be paying for those services and have no need to watch on C4.

The landscape has changed too since the glory days people are remeniscing about, when broadcasters were the main way to get up to date odds etc. Nowadays you have bookmakers' apps and the like, so perhaps people just want the race and aren't too bothered by the filler between then?”


that describes me exactly !

I have RUK and ATR and as they show all the meetings every day I feel obligated to stay with them for the big events

It's a bit like the cycling.......Eurosport show all the races all year round and ITV4 come along and cherry pick the Tour de France but I feel Eurosport deserve my support for their coverage of the whole sport not just the one main event
casinoman13
25-10-2015
Originally Posted by sparkie70:
“I can see ITV doing the big meetings with ITV4 doing some say the national on weekdays but remember as a whole the channel is way down even on freeview epg.
Ok they get decent ratings for tennis & the Tour but doubt they get C4 ratings.”

Surely if ITV wanted any racing the Derby and Grand National would fit the bill nicely for them.

Can not see them wanting the big weekday meetings otherwise they may well be forced to split coverage between ITV 4.

Personally I will be very surprised if BBC didn't want some limited coverage of big meetings, like I said before surely they would have enough cash for some if they really wanted.
Shrewn
25-10-2015
Originally Posted by SteveBentley:
“Isn't it the case that all of the racing Channel 4 shows us also on either At The Races or Racing UK, who also show the whole card rather than the feature races and a few either side?

Perhaps the decline of C4 racing is that the more committed viewer will be paying for those services and have no need to watch on C4.

The landscape has changed too since the glory days people are remeniscing about, when broadcasters were the main way to get up to date odds etc. Nowadays you have bookmakers' apps and the like, so perhaps people just want the race and aren't too bothered by the filler between then?”

Also I think streaming and other methods play a part. For example with my Paddy Power account iI can have a bet and watch the race on my tablet rather than sit down and watch the coverage on C4.
The times are a changing. ITV would be good as it still has huge viewing figures and a promo for Cheltenham during Monday's Coronation Street will do better than one during Dispatches. As others have said ITV4 could pick up the more routine stuff, do a deal with RUK / ATR to share resources and it might do nicely for them.
Glenn A
25-10-2015
Might the outcome of the new contract, with the big meetings up for renewal next year, that a joint bid between BBC and ITV occurs for the big meetings, If Channel 4 pull out of racing altogether, I can imagine the BBC wanting back the Grand National, Royal Ascot and the Cheltenham Festival, all big features on the BBC for decades, and ITV deciding to buy the Derby, Oaks, St Leger, and Ebor meetings, which were a mainstay of their summer racing until 1985. Possibly something like the Arc and Arlington Millions would be ideal for ITV 4, who like foreign sports events.
tony321
25-10-2015
Originally Posted by Darren Lethem:
“Why ?”

Because it is a declining sport, youngsters prefer FOBT's, football coupons, other sports & poker etc to racing and watching it.

You may as well stick it on the RUK and ATR , make both HD and free to air and not worry about terrestrial coverage.
Neil_Harris
25-10-2015
Originally Posted by tony321:
“
You may as well stick it on the RUK and ATR , make both HD and free to air and not worry about terrestrial coverage.”

Now there's an idea..
Glenn A
25-10-2015
Originally Posted by tony321:
“Because it is a declining sport, youngsters prefer FOBT's, football coupons, other sports & poker etc to racing and watching it.

You may as well stick it on the RUK and ATR , make both HD and free to air and not worry about terrestrial coverage.”

It's still Britain's second biggest sport and attendances at meetings are healthy, although many of these at smaller courses tend to be for big meetings and events like ladies nights. I do think the lesser watched meetings will go to RUK and ATR and ITV and the BBC could big for the biggest meetings.
Shrewn
25-10-2015
Originally Posted by Glenn A:
“It's still Britain's second biggest sport and attendances at meetings are healthy, although many of these at smaller courses tend to be for big meetings and events like ladies nights. I do think the lesser watched meetings will go to RUK and ATR and ITV and the BBC could big for the biggest meetings.”

It is, Cheltenham & Aintree get football sized crowds, and as I'm due to attend Paddy Power day this November I know it will be packed to the rafters. A blank Premier League weekend will also aid this.
Racing is a romantic sport, probably more so than any other. It was a privilege to be at meetings throughout the Kauto Star / Denman period. The BBC tapped into it and it resonated with many non racing people. I just don't think C4 has that ability as it's still see as a bit of a niche channel
Darren_Hayward
25-10-2015
Originally Posted by Glenn A:
“Might the outcome of the new contract, with the big meetings up for renewal next year, that a joint bid between BBC and ITV occurs for the big meetings, If Channel 4 pull out of racing altogether, I can imagine the BBC wanting back the Grand National, Royal Ascot and the Cheltenham Festival, all big features on the BBC for decades, and ITV deciding to buy the Derby, Oaks, St Leger, and Ebor meetings, which were a mainstay of their summer racing until 1985. Possibly something like the Arc and Arlington Millions would be ideal for ITV 4, who like foreign sports events.”

The big overseas G1 meetings would be ideal for ITV4
The Dubai World Cup
The Arlington Million
US Triple Crown
Prix de'l Arc de Triomphe
The Breeders Cup
Australian Spring/Autumn Carnivals
The Canadian International
Some Irish G1s namely Irish 1000/2000 Guineas, Irish Derby/Oaks and Irish Champions Weekend
Grand Prix de Paris (Bastile Day G1)
Some of the Irish races are run on Saturday evenings which i can't see ITV1 clearing their Saturday Night schedules for a horse race same with the US races which are run at 10.00pm/12.30am UK time same applies to the Breeders Cup which takes up a primetime schedule over 2 days.
tony321
26-10-2015
Originally Posted by Glenn A:
“It's still Britain's second biggest sport and attendances at meetings are healthy, although many of these at smaller courses tend to be for big meetings and events like ladies nights. I do think the lesser watched meetings will go to RUK and ATR and ITV and the BBC could big for the biggest meetings.”

You mean they on the music nights etc because they can't get people through the gates for the racing itself.

Getting rid of McCririck, Thommo, Francombe etc ruined C4 racing as it lost it's identity and became a sort of mash up between BBC/C4/ATR/RUK with all the worse bits and none of the good.

I would like to see Cheltenham and the other festivals back on BBC along with the Saturday racing , cut out all the guessers and gravy trainers and concentrate on the sport than all the rubbish they try and put on like fashion etc and it may have a chance.
casinoman13
26-10-2015
Originally Posted by tony321:
“You mean they on the music nights etc because they can't get people through the gates for the racing itself.

Getting rid of McCririck, Thommo, Francombe etc ruined C4 racing as it lost it's identity and became a sort of mash up between BBC/C4/ATR/RUK with all the worse bits and none of the good.

I would like to see Cheltenham and the other festivals back on BBC along with the Saturday racing , cut out all the guessers and gravy trainers and concentrate on the sport than all the rubbish they try and put on like fashion etc and it may have a chance.”

Yes I agree with most of your post, big meetings like you say would be far better off on the BBC and with out any doubt if nothing else the Grand National should be a must.

If racing authorities want to see a rise in tv audience then it dosnt take much to work out but stick them back on the BBC.
Unfortunately as in so many sport nowadays money may well be the deciding factor.
Darren Lethem
26-10-2015
But isn't the whole point of the racing shows to try and attract the casual fan rather than the die hard ? If it was on RUK ( which is £20 a month remember ) then you would obviously lose that. Channel 4's coverage is too similar to RUK and I keep harking back to it but whilst they cater for the aficionado rather than the man in the bookies they will continue to haemorrhage viewing figures.

Quite simply ( and I know I sound like an inverted snob but ) it is too middle class.
Neil_Harris
27-10-2015
Originally Posted by Darren Lethem:
“But isn't the whole point of the racing shows to try and attract the casual fan rather than the die hard ? If it was on RUK ( which is £20 a month remember ) then you would obviously lose that. Channel 4's coverage is too similar to RUK and I keep harking back to it but whilst they cater for the aficionado rather than the man in the bookies they will continue to haemorrhage viewing figures.

Quite simply ( and I know I sound like an inverted snob but ) it is too middle class.”

Darren, I feel you are 100% correct.

Have a read of this - http://sport-onthebox.com/2015/10/22...-horse-racing/

Written by an ex TV producer turned pro punter, the key paragraph is this "The fact is that since 2013 I have watched more racing on Channel 4 than I did previously. The entire presentation package is better than it used to be. IMG transmit via Channel 4 more of the best quality race meetings than was the case prior to 2013"

Now whilst I accept his point that proves to me that channel 4 are looking to reach the hardcore fans, the pros. They have forgot the casual fan who just wants to watch and bet on 8 races on a Saturday afternoon, couldn't give a hoot about time splits and whether a horse likes soft ground. They've most likely already put their bet on in the morning.

Another thing C4 have lost is the Saturday bet, they turned their noses up at the Scoop 6 (I can't recall why) - this would have lost viewers too
cook0891
27-10-2015
Going off topic but hoping someone can help....I have noticed last few times channel 4 have had coverage from Doncaster that the beginning of races are non hd and use different angle (I wonder if take ATR feed) then switch to different angle and in HD for last 2 furlongs. It is really strange and noticed it before and then again last Saturday.

I did tweet channel 4 racing but no reply which doesn't surprise me.
Pizzatheaction
27-10-2015
I think the important thing is not to have all the racing on one main channel. The moment you take a bit of racing away from C4, and put it on BBC or ITV, you bring racing to some people who wouldn't otherwise see it.
tony321
27-10-2015
What would be nice if they did away with all the sycophants and did a Gary Neville type review of the previous weeks racing on the Morning Line starting with Dettori's ride on Foundation on Saturday.

There is so much that could be done with TV presentation of racing and proper criticism of trainers and jockeys would be a good start.

Racing needs to change and drag itself into the 21st century where people don't respect Sir So and So or Lord Whatever and if they talk crap then it should be exposed as such.

Treat people like idiots and they switch off and find Bargain Hunt more interesting.
Chris_Wilson
28-10-2015
Clare Balding just tweeted that she'll be back on c4racing next year for the big meetings
Tony Yeboah
28-10-2015
Hugh McIlvanney's eulogy for Sir Peter O'Sullevan http://www.racingpost.com/horses/hom...=last7DaysNews
Darren Lethem
28-10-2015
Originally Posted by Chris_Wilson:
“Clare Balding just tweeted that she'll be back on c4racing next year for the big meetings”

Yep, returning for the big races and meetings

https://media.info/television/news/c...-race-meetings
mylord
28-10-2015
Pity she,s returning offers little.
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