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Old 10-03-2014, 15:46
irishfeen
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He penalised Italy 10 times whilst only giving 2 penalties against Ireland...both against Sexton. He gave Ireland the perfect platform. All they had to do then was touch the ball down for 7 tries.

Owens has a history of being a bit lenient on Munster in particular, but also Ireland. He's not called O'wens for nothing
And are you saying there weren't penalties or what?
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Old 10-03-2014, 17:51
Nick2008
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And are you saying there weren't penalties or what?
They most probably were penalties...what I am implying is that he didn't apply those laws to Ireland.
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Old 11-03-2014, 11:25
Kierenj
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Loved the match on Sunday... especially how the petulant Farrell was rattled once again... still failing to see where this has ever actually happened and caused a problem. From memory he was yellow carded against Italy last year but that's been about it... people just love to hate him, thankfully for England he loves to play his best when under the most pressure.
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Old 11-03-2014, 12:54
platelet
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The shocking thing is even though France have been as awful as you say they are still on the same points as 2 other teams at the top going into the final game.
yeah but what is bizarre is they've won 3/4 games yet their overall points difference is +3
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Old 11-03-2014, 15:52
Nick2008
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Loved the match on Sunday... especially how the petulant Farrell was rattled once again... still failing to see where this has ever actually happened and caused a problem. From memory he was yellow carded against Italy last year but that's been about it... people just love to hate him, thankfully for England he loves to play his best when under the most pressure.
Who is suggesting that Farrell was petulant/rattled on Sunday?

He was a model of composure and has been rightly commended for it. The lad had one of, if not his best game in an England shirt.

However, this has not always been the case with young Owen. He has got involved in quite a few silly altercations so far in his career. I don't mind him being abrasive in defence as long as it is legal but the off the ball stuff isn't very clever. Anything that risks 10 minutes in the bin for the fly half really isn't very sensible. I'm seriously hoping that he has turned a corner after showing that he is a far better player when he concentrates on game management first and foremost.

Also, he doesn't always play his best under pressure. This is a common misconception. He has done some braindead things when under the spotlight and I'm not referring to any niggle. His passing has crumbled, he has missed kicks (both from ground and hand) and his decision making has been suspect. All these things are showing signs of improvement though and he may just make a top quality 10 if he continues to progress as he is.
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Old 11-03-2014, 19:03
Mark F
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Who is suggesting that Farrell was petulant/rattled on Sunday?

He was a model of composure and has been rightly commended for it. The lad had one of, if not his best game in an England shirt.
is.
I think that was his point - Farrell went against what the critics believe.
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Old 11-03-2014, 19:20
tealady
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I think that was his point - Farrell went against what the critics believe.
I'm not sure believe is the right word, may be fear? Fear that he would end up like Mike Philips!!
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Old 13-03-2014, 10:04
Mike Teevee
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same starting XV for England

England: M Brown (Harlequins); J Nowell (Exeter), L Burrell (Northampton), B Twelvetrees (Gloucester), J May (Gloucester); O Farrell (Saracens), D Care (Harlequins); J Marler (Harlequins), D Hartley (Northampton), D Wilson (Bath), J Launchbury (Wasps), C Lawes (Northampton), T Wood (Northampton), C Robshaw (Harlequins, capt), B Morgan (Gloucester).

Replacements: T Youngs (Leicester), M Vunipola (Saracens), H Thomas (Sale), D Attwood (Bath), T Johnson (Exeter), L Dickson (Northampton), G Ford (Bath), M Tuilagi (Leicester).
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Old 13-03-2014, 11:38
Nick2008
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same starting XV for England

England: M Brown (Harlequins); J Nowell (Exeter), L Burrell (Northampton), B Twelvetrees (Gloucester), J May (Gloucester); O Farrell (Saracens), D Care (Harlequins); J Marler (Harlequins), D Hartley (Northampton), D Wilson (Bath), J Launchbury (Wasps), C Lawes (Northampton), T Wood (Northampton), C Robshaw (Harlequins, capt), B Morgan (Gloucester).

Replacements: T Youngs (Leicester), M Vunipola (Saracens), H Thomas (Sale), D Attwood (Bath), T Johnson (Exeter), L Dickson (Northampton), G Ford (Bath), M Tuilagi (Leicester).
No surprises there...well apart from Tuilagi on the bench. Nice to have him back and I hope he is ready for test rugby after not much game time under his belt. One of our best ball carriers when in form. Very destructive in getting over the gain line.

I still think this is going to be a difficult game for us. We may/hopefully be able to pull away a little bit as the Italians hopefully tire but it won't be a landslide.
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Old 13-03-2014, 12:38
Mike Teevee
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I agree it will be tough, I'm not expecting a try-fest cricket score result.

The last two times England have played Italy were difficult hard fought matches. I think we should do enough to win the match, but not by enough to worry Ireland ahead of their title deciding match against France.
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Old 13-03-2014, 13:20
apaul
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Hope Joe Marler becomes a dad before Saturday as he's been a lot better than Vunipola in the scrums this Six Nations.
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Old 13-03-2014, 13:24
Kierenj
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Agree, with the way France have been going I can't see anything more than Ireland winning the championship.

Which over the course of the 5 games is probably about right; England did well to overpower them and close them out at home but in Ireland I'm not sure we'd have managed it.

Slightly frustrating but for 2 lucky/unlucky bounces we'd have beaten the French but who knows how that would have effected us going forward.
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Old 13-03-2014, 13:48
sensoria
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Agree, with the way France have been going I can't see anything more than Ireland winning the championship.

Which over the course of the 5 games is probably about right; England did well to overpower them and close them out at home but in Ireland I'm not sure we'd have managed it.

Slightly frustrating but for 2 lucky/unlucky bounces we'd have beaten the French but who knows how that would have effected us going forward.
I wouldn't right the French off. The French were one penalty off of wining the world cup when they had been pretty awful for most of the tournament.

The French are lethal when they have no one believing in them. If Ireland think they only have to turn up in Paris to win they are mad and I don't think for a second their coaches would allow them to believe that.

Would I put a bet on Ireland winning in Paris. Not on your life.
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Old 13-03-2014, 14:24
Mike Teevee
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I guess history is also against the Irish, with only one win in 40 year away to France.

It's hard to know which France will turn up, but I'm slightly siding with Ireland
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Old 13-03-2014, 14:53
Mike Teevee
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more team news

Wales: Liam Williams (Scarlets); Alex Cuthbert (Cardiff Blues), Jonathan Davies (Scarlets), Jamie Roberts (Racing Metro), George North (Northampton Saints); Dan Biggar (Ospreys), Mike Phillips (Racing Metro); Gethin Jenkins (Cardiff Blues), Ken Owens (Scarlets), Rhodri Jones (Scarlets), Luke Charteris (Perpignan), Alun Wyn Jones (Ospreys), Dan Lydiate (Racing Metro), Sam Warburton (Cardiff Blues, capt), Taulupe Faletau (Newport Gwent Dragons).

Replacements: Richard Hibbard (Ospreys), Paul James (Bath Rugby), Adam Jones (Ospreys), Jake Ball (Scarlets), Justin Tipuric (Ospreys), Rhodri Williams (Scarlets), Rhys Priestland (Scarlets), James Hook (Perpignan).

France: B Dulin; Y Huget, M Bastareaud, G Fickou, M Medard; R Tales, M Machenaud; T Domingo, D Szarzewski, N Mas, P Pape (cpt), Y Maestri, L Picamoles, A Lapandry, D Chouly.

Replacements: G Guirado, V Debaty, R Slimani, A Flanquart, S Vahaamahina, W Lauret, JM Doussain, M Mermoz.

Ireland: R Kearney (Leinster); A Trimble (Ulster), B O'Driscoll (Leinster), G D'Arcy (Leinster), D Kearney (Leinster); J Sexton (Racing Metro 92), C Murray (Munster); C Healy (Leinster), R Best (Ulster), M Ross (Leinster); D Toner (Leinster), P O'Connell (Munster); P O'Mahony (Munster), C Henry (Ulster), J Heaslip (Leinster).

Replacements: S Cronin (Leinster), J McGrath (Leinster), M Moore (Leinster), I Henderson (Ulster), J Murphy (Leinster), E Reddan (Leinster), I Madigan (Leinster), F McFadden (Leinster)

Scotland: S Hogg (Glasgow Warriors); D Fife (Edinburgh), A Dunbar (Glasgow Warriors), M Scott (Edinburgh), M Evans (Castres); D Weir (Glasgow Warriors); G Laidlaw (Edinburgh); R Grant (Glasgow Warriors), S Lawson (Newcastle), G Cross (Edinburgh), R Gray (Castres), J Hamilton (Montpellier), R Wilson (Glasgow Warriors), K Brown (Saracens, capt), D Denton (Edinburgh).

Replacements: R Ford (Edinburgh), A Dickinson (Edinburgh), E Murray (Worcester), T Swinson (Warriors), A Strokosch (Perpignan), C Cusiter (Glasgow Warriors), D Taylor (Saracens), J Cuthbert (Edinburgh).
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Old 13-03-2014, 15:16
Mike Teevee
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Hope Joe Marler becomes a dad before Saturday as he's been a lot better than Vunipola in the scrums this Six Nations.
I just got what your post meant, didn't realise his baby was due now

Mako isn't a bad back up
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Old 13-03-2014, 15:29
Mike Teevee
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final bit of team news

Italy: L McLean (Treviso); A Esposito (Treviso), M Campagnaro (Treviso), G Garcia (Zebre), L Sarto (Zebre); L Orquera (Zebre), T Tebaldi (Ospreys); M Aguero (Zebre), L Ghiraldini (Treviso), L Cittadini (Treviso), Q Geldenhuys (Zebre), M Bortolami (Zebre), J Furno (Biarritz), R Barbieri (Treviso), S Parisse (Stade Francais).

Replacements: D Giazzon (Zebre), M Rizzo (Treviso), A De Marchi (Treviso), G Biagi (Zebre), P Derbyshire (Treviso), E Gori (Treviso), T Allan (Perpignan), A Masi (Wasps).
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Old 13-03-2014, 15:57
Nick2008
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I just got what your post meant, didn't realise his baby was due now

Mako isn't a bad back up
Mako is handy in the loose but he isn't a great scrummager as yet. Marler has come on leaps and bounds with the new scrum engage.
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Old 13-03-2014, 16:02
Nick2008
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I guess history is also against the Irish, with only one win in 40 year away to France.

It's hard to know which France will turn up, but I'm slightly siding with Ireland
Ireland are definitely favourites. History may play ever so slightly on their minds but this is a pretty good Irish team and France have been very poor.

If Ireland manage to beat France where we failed to win, then as far as I'm concerned, they're worthy 6Ns winners. If France pull it out of the bag, then that's great news for England...assuming we beat Italy.

Allez les bleus!!
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Old 14-03-2014, 07:21
Kierenj
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Mako is handy in the loose but he isn't a great scrummager as yet. Marler has come on leaps and bounds with the new scrum engage.
Hasn't Mako had one bad game in the scrum and that was against Australia for the Lions when it was mostly reffing anyway...? I don't think Sarries starting props tend be known for being bad scrummagers, and he's against 2nd choice props for Italy anyway so I'm not overly worried.

Interesting moves by Gatland, with Jenkins being under pressure but this cap being a record I think the fact it's Scotland they're playing came into the reckoning.. also, typical of Gatland to take an under pressure player, replace everyone around him as if to tell him that he's confident in him, could be a very astute move.

I can see Wales pumping Scotland but I think it'll be a bandaid and may hide the bigger issues.
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Old 14-03-2014, 09:15
Nick2008
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Hasn't Mako had one bad game in the scrum and that was against Australia for the Lions when it was mostly reffing anyway...? I don't think Sarries starting props tend be known for being bad scrummagers, and he's against 2nd choice props for Italy anyway so I'm not overly worried.

Interesting moves by Gatland, with Jenkins being under pressure but this cap being a record I think the fact it's Scotland they're playing came into the reckoning.. also, typical of Gatland to take an under pressure player, replace everyone around him as if to tell him that he's confident in him, could be a very astute move.

I can see Wales pumping Scotland but I think it'll be a bandaid and may hide the bigger issues.
He's had a few shaky games in the scrum for England. Has given away quite a few penalties but the potential is certainly there. I think Marler is far more suited and successful with the new scrum laws. Corbs first choice, then Marler and Mako is a little way behind but age is certainly on his side.

Also you mention that Sarries props are not bad scrummagers but have you forgotten about Matt Stevens?

I'm not overly worried but a lot of scrum issues are decided on referees interpretations so if Mako can hold his side up legally, we should be ok.

Wales should win...10-15 points at least. Even without 1/2p.
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Old 14-03-2014, 11:44
CGG_12
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I thought I heard Marler was definitely ruled out?

Only heard this week he was due to be a father, he's awful young- though you wouldn't think it looking at him, he'd easily pass for 30
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Old 14-03-2014, 11:50
irishfeen
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Farewell BOD ya legend http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pNG4HdnVrYQ ... Winning the championship tomorrow would be the perfect sendoff.
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Old 14-03-2014, 12:04
Marmite Baby
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I wouldn't right the French off. The French were one penalty off of wining the world cup when they had been pretty awful for most of the tournament.

The French are lethal when they have no one believing in them. If Ireland think they only have to turn up in Paris to win they are mad and I don't think for a second their coaches would allow them to believe that.

Would I put a bet on Ireland winning in Paris. Not on your life.
Totally agree. France still have devastating runners in their back line where if the game becomes a bit loose, could cause serious damage to any team
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Old 14-03-2014, 12:05
CGG_12
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Looks like for once PSA has picked his best side available to him

Finding it harder to call the closer it gets.
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