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Spiral (Engrenages) Series Four


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Old 17-02-2013, 12:53
KennyT
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overnights are a bit disappointing:

21:00 - ep 1/12: 594k (2.65%)
21:55 - ep 2/12: 433k (2.2%)

i don't think there was an HD simulcast, so these are the totals...

K
21:00 - Spiral (ep 3/12): 454k (2.0%)
21:55 - Spiral (ep 4/12): 408k (2.1%)

...
So it's down in the overnights and now well below the slot average. Last week's episodes consolidated to 823k (3.3%) and 653k (3.1%), each adding over 200k.
(thanks to NeilVW in the ratings thread)

K
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Old 17-02-2013, 14:25
the_lostprophet
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For some reason nobody here seems to have got the subtext from the Josephine-Pierre sexual scene that they have over at the Guardian - or if they have they haven't commented on it.

*Edit* - Just seen that Cadence has briefly addressed it but not a lot about it otherwise.

Anyway that wasn't just some 'normal' sex scene - it was supposed to be sad and disturbing. We're encouraged to see the significance of it coming directly after the confrontation with her father and Josephine being in tears. We now know just how damaged Josephine is due to her childhood; the low self-esteem resulting from that somewhat explains why she engages in reckless sexual acts. Clearly she doesn't think she's worth much more than a fumble in the bushes. In that particular scene she was using aggressive sexual tactics (including saying: "Regarde-moi!") as a way of avoiding emotional intimacy with Pierre. Did you notice the way she said "Don't touch me!" at first when he tried to comfort her? She isn't comfortable at all with emotion in relationships.
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Old 17-02-2013, 16:07
Cadence
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Blimey - last night was a bit dramatic wasn't it? Tintin! Poor Tintin, nobody's mentioned him yet!
And I have to say, having watched the end of the episode again, it doesn't look good. He was laying there with his eyes open, not moving. Of course, at first we thought it was Amina who'd been hit as she was calling out and bending over, then the camera went to Tin Tin.
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Old 17-02-2013, 16:11
Killary45
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And I have to say, having watched the end of the episode again, it doesn't look good. He was laying there with his eyes open, not moving.
No spoiler because I have no information, but I cannot believe that they would kill off Tintin in episode 4.

I am loving this series of Spiral. Great to see all the main cast back in business. I even enjoy the part of Marianne, the judge's secretary, who sees everything but says almost nothing.
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Old 17-02-2013, 16:13
peaches41
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I couldn't make out who it was, until I read this thread
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Old 17-02-2013, 16:31
Cadence
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For some reason nobody here seems to have got the subtext from the Josephine-Pierre sexual scene that they have over at the Guardian - or if they have they haven't commented on it.

*Edit* - Just seen that Cadence has briefly addressed it but not a lot about it otherwise.

Anyway that wasn't just some 'normal' sex scene - it was supposed to be sad and disturbing. We're encouraged to see the significance of it coming directly after the confrontation with her father and Josephine being in tears. We now know just how damaged Josephine is due to her childhood; the low self-esteem resulting from that somewhat explains why she engages in reckless sexual acts. Clearly she doesn't think she's worth much more than a fumble in the bushes. In that particular scene she was using aggressive sexual tactics (including saying: "Regarde-moi!") as a way of avoiding emotional intimacy with Pierre. Did you notice the way she said "Don't touch me!" at first when he tried to comfort her? She isn't comfortable at all with emotion in relationships.
I wonder, too, why she had sex when feeling angry and upset, almost as a way of getting the attention, response or acknowledgment she'd just been denied by her father but as you say, in a way where she was in control and wasn't letting the other person (Pierre) close emotionally. I wonder if sex diverted from her own confused feelings and despair, triggered by the encounter with her father, which she wouldn't have been able to tolerate if she acknowledged them in full force. It was perhaps a way of distancing from her own feelings as well as controlling a man.

It made me think, after the episode, if her relationship with her father might explain why she'd twice teamed up with older, dodgy male lawyers, putting herself in situations that most women would avoid, and exploiting the older men.
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Old 17-02-2013, 16:42
Cadence
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but she states "it's him - he's got THE badge", not "a badge" (while his shoulder badge is in view) and later, she says to the boss "there's no proof, but I saw the badge on his arm"...

K
When I saw the car park scene, I too thought that Laure had realised that they had a police badge and thus could exit the car park using the pass. However if she realised at that stage that they had a police pass, it makes no sense that they were later able to access the building and vandalise it and set it alight - you'd think that if it was known they had a pass for the building, the building would be guarded and they'd be searching the data base to try and find out whose pass had been used in the car park. So I think your interpretation is correct, Laure spotted the badge on his jacket.
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Old 17-02-2013, 16:43
Cadence
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No spoiler because I have no information, but I cannot believe that they would kill off Tintin in episode 4.

I am loving this series of Spiral. Great to see all the main cast back in business. I even enjoy the part of Marianne, the judge's secretary, who sees everything but says almost nothing.
I know, me too - there's such a deep satisfaction in recognising the characters we've come to know through previous series, even the minor ones! Except the frog faced man of course. Whenever he appears on screen he makes me uneasy.
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Old 17-02-2013, 16:50
Cadence
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innit...he really doesn't work for me in Mr Selfridge but I can't imagine Spiral without him..............
Mr. Selfridge on again tonight. I suspect this was meant to be Gregory Fitoussi's entrée into english-speaking films and TV, especially as I think Mr. Selfridge is also aimed at the US market. However I really don't think it does him any credit - but I don't think that's his fault, more the part he's been given and how it's written. I wish he'd been given a better vehicle. I wonder if we'll see other Spiral characters crop up in english-speaking shows.
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Old 17-02-2013, 18:27
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Old 17-02-2013, 20:19
Verence
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I know, me too - there's such a deep satisfaction in recognising the characters we've come to know through previous series, even the minor ones! Except the frog faced man of course. Whenever he appears on screen he makes me uneasy.
I thought it was interesting that Prosecutor Marchard and Judge Roban came back in the same episode, two men who display two completely different sides of the justice system

Oh BTW the beardy Judge who Roban had a meeting with was played by Gilbert Thiel who in real life is a anti-terrorist judge

]
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Old 17-02-2013, 23:08
LucyKay18
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I just LOVE this show. Glad it's back. I've been invested in all the characters since S1.
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Old 18-02-2013, 11:19
Sanguinius
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Don't think it has hit the heights of season three yet but it's still pretty decent viewing.

I wonder if they are setting it up for Roban to come out fighting, finally get Machard and rid the corruption that is going on? It would be a sort of redemption for him after the previous season where he strayed in a legal sense when he was consumed by that Villedieu case.

Josephine clearly has emotional/relationship issues but we didn't really get an insight why until episode four. Pierre could be good for her but only if she breaks down those barriers.

Tintin is the glue that binds the team and it's morale compass. Without him that team is going to go off the rails. I think he will survive but if he doesn't or if he is absent for a while it's going to be interesting to see what happens.
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Old 18-02-2013, 15:19
Cadence
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I thought it was interesting that Prosecutor Marchard and Judge Roban came back in the same episode, two men who display two completely different sides of the justice system
Indeed, and immediately you see Prosecutor Marchand, you suspect some calumny's afoot. It was rewarding to see both of them return though, as you say, like opposites.

If Roban's deliberately been given trivial cases however, I'm surprised that he was given the rape case if there 'was' some kind of cover up involved - he's exactly the sort of person who'd get to the bottom of it and make people's lives difficult! I like the line, when he was confronted with the cases being boring, which went something like "Then I shall have to make them interesting"

Oh BTW the beardy Judge who Roban had a meeting with was played by Gilbert Thiel who in real life is a anti-terrorist judge
That's interesting. I couldn't spot that he was in any way an inexperienced actor - playing to type, obviously! I wonder if French audiences would recognise him - probably not as we don't exactly recognise the judiciary. I wonder how appearing in Spiral affects his day job!

I had a thought after the episodes aired - how did the Kurd in the detention centre get enough fuel to pour over himself to commit suicide considering the inmates' belongings are taken away from them and kept in a locker? And there was mention of others having set themselves alight previously. If this was a hazard, you'd think the authorities would have devised ways to attempt its prevention.

I wonder, also, if Moussa will take the Kurd's money to the criminal the Kurd named to stop him killing his family and if the place Moussa turns up at is the cafe that's under surveillance where the Kurd had his last coffee and where there's a people smuggling racket operating. Then he'll get taken back into custody and be in even deeper trouble. I wonder too, if the video of the Kurd climbing over the wall and inadvertently into a police raid is him having hidden the money somewhere on the other side of the wall. If Moussa goes to retrieve it, the security cameras will pick him up as well and the area's of interest to the police.
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Old 18-02-2013, 15:34
Cadence
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Don't think it has hit the heights of season three yet but it's still pretty decent viewing.
It does take a while for all the threads to come together though with Spiral. But yes, Season 3 was brilliant, totally compelling towards the end, which hopefully Season 4 will also be.

I wonder if they are setting it up for Roban to come out fighting, finally get Machard and rid the corruption that is going on? It would be a sort of redemption for him after the previous season where he strayed in a legal sense when he was consumed by that Villedieu case.
That would be a really good dramatic storyline, if Roban managed to topple Procureur Marchard,

Tintin is the glue that binds the team and it's morale compass. Without him that team is going to go off the rails. I think he will survive but if he doesn't or if he is absent for a while it's going to be interesting to see what happens.
Having watched the end of Episode 4 for a third time, he does look pretty dead I'm afraid, but we can but hope. He's a sympathetic character and I'd miss him. The dynamics in the team will absolutely be thrown into disarray, as well as dealing with the guilt they may feel, or responsibility or blame for the conduct of the operation being apportioned. Spiral may be a show, like Game of Thrones, which is brave enough to kill off its major characters. It does try and strive for some kind of realism and of course, being killed in the line of duty is, unfortunately, a possibility.
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Old 18-02-2013, 15:51
Verence
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That's interesting. I couldn't spot that he was in any way an inexperienced actor - playing to type, obviously! I wonder if French audiences would recognise him - probably not as we don't exactly recognise the judiciary. I wonder how appearing in Spiral affects his day job!
I think the French audience would have recognised as he apparently gets interview quite a lot in the national media

http://translate.google.com/translat...e-et-justicier
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Old 19-02-2013, 02:13
Franglais
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I read about two thirds of that translation then gave up as the "funny" English was doing my head in. Had to laugh at the sentence "I rowed so that I became gallery" <sniggers>
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Old 21-02-2013, 00:38
Starshiny
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I think a few people have been confused by the BBC's scheduling and the fact that there's been such a long time between series 3 and 4. Series 3 was the first I watched, back in 2011 but I enjoyed it so watched series 2 when it was repeated last year. This is why some people thought when this started that they'd missed a series. If you only watched from last year then you will have missed a series!
A repeat of series 3 before this one would have been useful as I, like many, have forgotten some of the details. Perhaps the BBC is thinking of repeating it after this one ??
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Old 21-02-2013, 02:20
vinegar vera
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21:00 - Spiral (ep 3/12): 454k (2.0%)
21:55 - Spiral (ep 4/12): 408k (2.1%)

...
So it's down in the overnights and now well below the slot average. Last week's episodes consolidated to 823k (3.3%) and 653k (3.1%), each adding over 200k.
(thanks to NeilVW in the ratings thread)

K
This simply proves that Spiral is the least popular of all the European imports on BBC4.
I would estimate that in terms of ratings (including BBC HD where necessary) the successes are in the following order

1= The Killing
1= The Bridge
3 Borgen
4 Insp Montalbano
5 Wallander (Lassgard)
6 Wallander (Henriksson)
7 Sebastian Bergman
8 Spiral

The DR shows ARE of a much higher quality than the others.
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Old 22-02-2013, 12:53
The_Time_Being
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I even enjoy the part of Marianne, the judge's secretary, who sees everything but says almost nothing.
Exactly - it's part of what the show is trying to say. "Marianne" describes an embodiment of what France stands for, a sort of equivalent to Britannia. All this is playing out in front of Marianne an allegory for how the descent of the French justice system and the endemic corruption is happening in front of the powerless "Marianne" embodying French society

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marianne
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Old 23-02-2013, 01:47
minkski
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Is nobody watching this with me?
me! (and a few others methinks)

This simply proves that Spiral is the least popular of all the European imports on BBC4.
I would estimate that in terms of ratings (including BBC HD where necessary) the successes are in the following order

1= The Killing
1= The Bridge
3 Borgen
4 Insp Montalbano
5 Wallander (Lassgard)
6 Wallander (Henriksson)
7 Sebastian Bergman
8 Spiral

The DR shows ARE of a much higher quality than the others.
That's interesting, I would put Spiral at number 3 myself
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Old 23-02-2013, 10:47
KennyT
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...


That's interesting, I would put Spiral at number 3 myself
VV was speaking in terms of ratings, I think.

Spiral probably suffered from being one of the first BBC4 euro-subbed dramas, which didn't really take off until TK1, by which time Spiral S2 had already been shown, so the new euro-viewers felt they didn't know the characters well enough to invest their time - possibly!

K
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Old 23-02-2013, 18:13
minkski
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VV was speaking in terms of ratings, I think.

Spiral probably suffered from being one of the first BBC4 euro-subbed dramas, which didn't really take off until TK1, by which time Spiral S2 had already been shown, so the new euro-viewers felt they didn't know the characters well enough to invest their time - possibly!

K
Yes I got that, I was just referring to my preferences

I missed 1 and 3 although am trying to get hold of series 3
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Old 23-02-2013, 21:24
allie4
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Yes I got that, I was just referring to my preferences

I missed 1 and 3 although am trying to get hold of series 3
Amazon??? I think we got all 3-in-1....
My personal favourite for story lines is 1 I think. Am getting a bit fed up with illegal immigrants, drugs, nitty gritty. What I love about Spiral is the brilliantly drawn characters and their private stories.
Borgen is currently my favourite (much to my surprise!)
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Old 24-02-2013, 09:43
Elanor
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Bloody hell, last night was a bit bleak wasn't it? Is there anyone we like that isn't in massive trouble now? Aaargh!
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