[Hicky]

Originally Posted by honeythewitch

I suppose so, but it depends on how the trial is performed.


Not always. There are plenty of examples of people "shopping" their neighbours when there was no punishment or reward for them.
In Germany there were whole groups of people who were never in any danger yet there was very little protest. The regime was not feared at all, in fact an awful lot were very pleased with the government.


Edit...
Sounds familiar.

The ordinary civilian didn't have any idea of what was happening, and they weren't in danger from Hitler because he hadn't asked them to do anything.
If he asked, you did it, end of.

[Gemo52]

Originally Posted by honeythewitch

Thank you for that Gemo, I had missed seeing it. I am not a it surprised that more than half of them were prepared to torture the others because they were told it was ok.

Yes. I wonder if his upbringing had anything to do with it?

I expect you are right. I think capital punishment is not used in Norway.

I can understand Hitler being stark raving bonkers, although i believe there was an element of evil too, but it is difficult to understand how so many went along with it.

Scary to think that in a different time Breivik could have gained a position of power.

[Flora Poste]

Originally Posted by JoJo4

I'm very aware of the 'mob mentality' and how under certain circumstances many thousands of people can be whipped into a frenzy and encouraged to carry out all manner of atrocities. There are countless studies on the subject and as broadly 'a behaviouralist' it's always interested me.

There are still those who are clinically insane and thus deserving of incarceration and treatment, but there are also those who have become proficient in convincing the authorities of insanity where none exists.

Thats the problem isnt it, in Breiviks case we have already had psychiatrists saying he is insane, another lot saying he isnt, its not an exact science so I suppose it depends on the psychiatrists on the case at the time as to whether he is or isnt deemed insane.

[Scots rool]

Originally Posted by Baldrick Phd

Morning Crew

ahhhhhhhhhh


http://www.godvine.com/The-Cutest-Ne...mile-1389.html

note the onset of a flufferesque tuft
James Bolam is Terry, Rodney Bewes is Bob.

I'm more naturally Terry at the pub and match but with a hint of sensible Bob

Awwwwww, that is too too cute.

Originally Posted by Flora Poste

I think we all like to think people who commit such heinous acts are insane but unfortunately there are some truly evil people out there who know exactly what they are doing and take great pleasure from these sort of acts. He will be a constant threat and needs putting down.

I suspect he's the latter.

Originally Posted by Gemo52

’d affernoon.

Breivik seems to have a completely different interpretation of the world to most people, something that some dictators seem to have had. Not sure if that’s insanity or not. Whatever it is, execution is too good for him, I think flaying alive would be more suitable.

Norway's laws are a tad strange, insofar as he could serve a very short sentence.

He says it was in 'self defence', bloody evil git!

Afternoon all.

[Bella Boffin]

Originally Posted by Hicky

The ordinary civilian didn't have any idea of what was happening, and they weren't in danger from Hitler because he hadn't asked them to do anything.
If he asked, you did it, end of.

Would you be so kind as to clarify what you mean, please? You say the ordinary civilian 'didn;t have any idea of what was happening'. What didn't they have any idea of?

[Scots rool]

Originally Posted by Flora Poste

Thats the problem isnt it, in Breiviks case we have already had psychiatrists saying he is insane, another lot saying he isnt, its not an exact science so I suppose it depends on the psychiatrists on the case at the time as to whether he is or isnt deemed insane.

I'm quite sure there will be some people who will blame it all on his upbringing!

[Scots rool]

Originally Posted by Hicky

The ordinary civilian didn't have any idea of what was happening, and they weren't in danger from Hitler because he hadn't asked them to do anything.
If he asked, you did it, end of.

They were certainly fully aware of all the Jews being rounded up!

[JoJo4]

Originally Posted by Flora Poste

Thats the problem isnt it, in Breiviks case we have already had psychiatrists saying he is insane, another lot saying he isnt, its not an exact science so I suppose it depends on the psychiatrists on the case at the time as to whether he is or isnt deemed insane.

Absolutely - one psych's insanity is another's perfectly normal - well almost.

There are standard test and approaches for diagnoses, but the interpretation of them is subjective as there is no right or wrong response.

He sounds to me like a guy who knows what to say and how to say it - that's bound to muddy the water. You'd need a long period of time in one to ones to uncover the truth and even then he could go on appealing for decades

[JoJo4]

Originally Posted by Scots rool

I'm quite sure there will be some people who will blame it all on his upbringing!

Bound to have been his mother

[Flora Poste]

Originally Posted by Scots rool

I'm quite sure there will be some people who will blame it all on his upbringing!

Yes I am sure, it will be everyones fault bar his own.

[JoJo4]

Originally Posted by Hicky

The ordinary civilian didn't have any idea of what was happening, and they weren't in danger from Hitler because he hadn't asked them to do anything.
If he asked, you did it, end of.

Hicky given that you don't read books and don't watch films, from where do you cull this information???

There are fully documented accounts of loads of 'ordinary people' who worked against Hitler in many different ways, and they weren't all Jews.

[honeythewitch]

Originally Posted by Hicky

The ordinary civilian didn't have any idea of what was happening, and they weren't in danger from Hitler because he hadn't asked them to do anything.
If he asked, you did it, end of.

This is the "official" line we were fed after the war because continued hostilities with the Germans would not be beneficial but it is generally accepted now that this was not the case and there are many ordinary civilians who confirm it. They/we were simply brainwashed.
"We" were in many cases just as vociferous in outing refugees from Germany, and reporting anyone who was not following the rules regarding rationing, waste, blackouts etc.

[Bella Boffin]

Originally Posted by Hicky

Don't need rain where i live, we have plenty of water.
About the only place in the country that has it.


My whole garden is on automatic watering, in fact i looked at the watering computer earlier and it said watering had been suspended due to the the rain we had earlier.

I've put the Bird Bath on it's own watering computer as well, the birds use an awful lot mainly bathing in the summer so it will fill it up twice a day depending on the program, could set it to more if i wanted.


Morning JoJo.


Morning Honey.

What an awfully good thing it is that not everyone adopts your insular policy.

Does anyone remember those Peter Sellars films...'I'm all right, Jack' etc

[honeythewitch]

Originally Posted by Flora Poste

Thats the problem isnt it, in Breiviks case we have already had psychiatrists saying he is insane, another lot saying he isnt, its not an exact science so I suppose it depends on the psychiatrists on the case at the time as to whether he is or isnt deemed insane.

Or depending on his well rehearsed answers i suspect.

Originally Posted by Scots rool

I'm quite sure there will be some people who will blame it all on his upbringing!

I am not sure that upbringing is not relevant in these cases.
We seem to have a whole group of people who have been raised to think that they can do whatever they want and appear to think they have a right to never have their views challenged.
This way of thinking would surely exacerbate the situation should anyone become psychotic and or evil?

[honeythewitch]

Originally Posted by Bella Boffin

What an awfully good thing it is that not everyone adopts your insular policy.

Does anyone remember those Peter Sellars films...'I'm all right, Jack' etc

The water authorities clearly haven't seen them either because the water is not redistributed to needy areas, I have no idea why not.

[Scots rool]

Originally Posted by honeythewitch

Or depending on his well rehearsed answers i suspect.


I am not sure that upbringing is not relevant in these cases.
We seem to have a whole group of people who have been raised to think that they can do whatever they want and appear to think they have a right to never have their views challenged.
This way of thinking would surely exacerbate the situation should anyone become psychotic and or evil?

IMO, that is used as an excuse most of the time. We've all had things happen to us in our childhood, doesn't turn us all into evil gits!

[Hicky]

Originally Posted by Bella Boffin

Would you be so kind as to clarify what you mean, please? You say the ordinary civilian 'didn;t have any idea of what was happening'. What didn't they have any idea of?

Originally Posted by Scots rool

They were certainly fully aware of all the Jews being rounded up!

I agree, they knew that many people were being moved away by various means of transport but they had no idea what would befall them, like everyone else it was thought they were being taken to another place of safety.

The civilians wouldn't be told what the military are doing, they never are.

[Hicky]

Originally Posted by Bella Boffin

What an awfully good thing it is that not everyone adopts your insular policy.

Does anyone remember those Peter Sellars films...'I'm all right, Jack' etc

We can't choose our parents but we have a choice of who we vote for and were we live,

We can pipe oil and gas from far afield but not water.

All that water in the sea and parts of the country has none.
All you've got to do is boil it, condense it and you can drink it.

[Bella Boffin]

Originally Posted by Hicky

I agree, they knew that many people were being moved away by various means of transport but they had no idea what would befall them, like everyone else it was thought they were being taken to another place of safety.

The civilians wouldn't be told what the military are doing, they never are.

Your reference source, please???

[Gemo52]

Originally Posted by Bella Boffin

Your reference source, please???

Nick Griffin, I think.

[Bella Boffin]

Originally Posted by Hicky

We can't choose our parents but we have a choice of who we vote for and were we live,

We can pipe oil and gas from far afield but not water.

All that water in the sea and parts of the country has none.
All you've got to do is boil it, condense it and you can drink it.

Terrifically funny. Yes, we shall soon all be boiling seawater and condensing it in Goucestershire. I would phone Liz Hurley and warn her but I bet she is naffing about deciding which tyres to put on her car. Come on, Camilla, fill that billie can with sea water and start boiling....and think of our lucky northern friends with their automatic water feeders for birds....

[Gemo52]

Originally Posted by Hicky

We can't choose our parents but we have a choice of who we vote for and were we live,

We can pipe oil and gas from far afield but not water.

All that water in the sea and parts of the country has none.
All you've got to do is boil it, condense it and you can drink it.

Why can’t we pipe water?

A source here suggests otherwise.

[Hicky]

Originally Posted by Bella Boffin

Your reference source, please???

What do you think they told them?
They told them to bring all they could carry, they were just going to be re-sited.
Else they wouldn't have gone.

Originally Posted by Bella Boffin

Terrifically funny. Yes, we shall soon all be boiling seawater and condensing it in Goucestershire. I would phone Liz Hurley and warn her but I bet she is naffing about deciding which tyres to put on her car. Come on, Camilla, fill that billie can with sea water and start boiling....and think of our lucky northern friends with their automatic water feeders for birds....

The amount of heat that comes from the cooling of a Nuclear reactor would turn enough sea water into steam which could be then condensed to supply the whole country with water.

The problem is we only have one water system so we are using drinking water to flush the Loo and wash all the cars in the country, are we mad or what?

[Hicky]

Originally Posted by Gemo52

Why can’t we pipe water?

A source here suggests otherwise.

If it was oil or gas it would be handled by private companies, if it's water, there's no resale value really.
The leakage is the biggest problem, some of the pipes need replacing but noone has the money to do it.

[honeythewitch]

Originally Posted by Scots rool

IMO, that is used as an excuse most of the time. We've all had things happen to us in our childhood, doesn't turn us all into evil gits!

No, it is absolutely no excuse, but throughout history ruthless and biddable soldiers have been created by severing the maternal bond.
Nations who were previously seen as "cold" were the ones that separated children from their parents for long periods and had very rigid schooling. It shows that upbringing can alter the make-up of an entire nation so surely it is feasible to think that perhaps someone's background can affect the likelihood of their becoming insane or evil? If someone is brought up with a strong sense of right and wrong would they perhaps be more likely to resist criminal impulses than someone who is told (in school, i don't just mean parents) that "there are no good or bad choices, just the right choice for you" *pauses to spew*
There are horrible episodes in most peoples childhood but few people have them scrutinised by "experts" unless they become a rapist or criminal so i imagine it is difficult to find out if there is a link.
It does make me wonder though.