[blueblade]

Originally Posted by MrsWatermelon

They can't evict you during your fixed term for decorating, having pets or smoking. Once that term is up they can evict you for having two nostrils if they like, it still doesn't mean a no-decorating policy is enforcable.

Just because tenants and landlords can both be woefully ignorant about their rights and responsibilities, it doesn't make entering a tenant's property legal

Surely most landlords would be only too happy for their tenants to decorate the houses free of any charge for them ?

Providing the decorating was not too outlandish, of course.

[shackfan]

Originally Posted by radyag

When you can rent. They pay A MASSIVE % of their income for years and then die. Then their ungrateful relatives get the house and immediately sell it, pocket the money and spend it on a load of shite. I simply ask, what's the point?

I'm guessing you cant afford the deposit and you now feel angry and bitter to anyone sensible enough to buy.
So in 10 years I will be mortgage free. So instead of you paying (lets say, in 10 years time) £1000 a month to borrow someone elses pension fund, which you could be kicked out of at any time, so you cant REALLY call it home, I will probably downsize. Buy a flat, release some cash, buy a fast car, go on holidays and STILL have something to leave my kids.
So what is YOUR point?

EDIT: Oh, and my mortgage is around HALF what I know most are paying rent for a SMALLER house in shittier areas.
So what IS your point?....

[Blondie X]

Originally Posted by Welsh-lad

I think that is one of the secrets as well - buying somewhere and staying put.
Moving is very costly, and all the sweat you put into improving the original house comes to nothing. You get to the new place and have to start over.

I can't foresee us moving anywhere else. A lot of thought went into buying our place, and we're staying here now hopefully.

I think you're right. Quite a few people at work paid their mortgage off before they were 40 and all of those people stayed in their first house and didn't move.

[Blondie X]

Originally Posted by Pixie Queen

If you haven't made a will then the government gets all your estate after costs. That's the top and bottom of it and in the extreme . The laws and legal thingies could make a difference if you live in England, Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland

Make a will.

That's not true. if you haven't made a will then it goes to probate and your relatives put their case for a claim. The government can't just take your estate from you when other people have a legitimate claim. There is a strict criteria of who can claim though and an order of who gets what.

The only time the government would take your estate is if no living relatives come forward

[Andrue]

Originally Posted by Pixie Queen

If you haven't made a will then the government gets all your estate after costs. That's the top and bottom of it and in the extreme . The laws and legal thingies could make a difference if you live in England, Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland

In England and Wales the government has to stand in line..and it's a long way down the line.

http://www.adviceguide.org.uk/englan..._intestacy.htm

So basically the government will only get the estate if no living relatives can be found.

It still makes sense to make a will of course (especially if you have a partner or adopted children). I'm a single adult so my will only really says three things:

* Estate goes to these charities.
* Medical science can have my body.
* I want a Humanist funeral with a nosh/booze up for attendees

[stud u like]

Originally Posted by radyag

When you can rent. They pay A MASSIVE % of their income for years and then die. Then their ungrateful relatives get the house and immediately sell it, pocket the money and spend it on a load of shite. I simply ask, what's the point?

Rental accommodation is damp and nasty. Usually you are stuck in a flat block with people you dislike.

Renting is dead money. It goes to feed greedy landlords and you don't see a penny of it.

Buying a house means it is all yours.

Intelligent relatives would be glad of a house. Only the stupid ones spend it on rubbish.

[YoungAtHeart]

Property prices don't always go up. They sometimes go down. Therefore sometimes it can be better to rent. Japan is a good example of this where property prices have been in decline since 1991.

If you are young and are likely to move cities or countries for work reasons, which looks increasingly likely with globalisation, it is possible that it is better to rent in this situation too.

If you think property prices will increase in the long term and you will be consistently employed in a specific area, then it is good to buy a property.

But sometimes renting is better than a mortgage depending on individual circumstances.

[Cornucopia]

This is basic maths.

A mortgage is 25 years at, say, 4%, then you own the property and get to live there at relatively low cost for as long as you want. You then get to sell it and downsize to get a lump sum for your retirement. The only barriers to doing that are the deposit and whether you want to.

The other option is renting. That will probably start at 6-10% of the property's value, and will increase with inflation. You never get to own it, and never have a lump sum.

And if there is growth in property values that you can benefit from, then all the better.

I was mortgage-free from 42, and have now given up full time work to be... a private landlord and company director.

[Phil 2804]

Originally Posted by Aneechik

If you're renting, the moment you retire and can't afford the rent anymore, along comes housing benefit to whisk you off to a one bed flat in the middle of the nearest rough estate.

It's hardly something to look forward to in your retirement. And not everyone has ungrateful relatives.

If your a homeowner and you become infirm in your old age you local authority will sell your house and place you in a nursing home where you can be abused by staff with low morals and little grasp of english.

It isn't a very appealing prospect either.

[gdjman68wasdigi]

Originally Posted by irishguy

Has everyone on DS paid of their mortgage relatively quickly??? Whats the secret??

i should be done by the time im fifty, im 43..
i had a big deposit

[gulliverfoyle]

Originally Posted by Cornucopia

This is basic maths.

A mortgage is 25 years at, say, 4%, then you own the property and get to live there at relatively low cost for as long as you want. You then get to sell it and downsize to get a lump sum for your retirement. The only barriers to doing that are the deposit and whether you want to.

The other option is renting. That will probably start at 6-10% of the property's value, and will increase with inflation. You never get to own it, and never have a lump sum.

And if there is growth in property values that you can benefit from, then all the better.

I was mortgage-free from 42, and have now given up full time work to be... a private landlord and company director.

your assuming interest rate of 4% thats very low a historic low they wont stay that way over 25years

the avg is about 7%

interest rates have been 15% in the past

also we have had more or less continuous price increases for the last 50 years they will not continue they could easily drop 20%

say on a £100k mortage at 4% youd pay £500 mth

but on 15% youd pay £1200 mth

whilst interest rates are low then a mortgage is a good bet but if they rise suddenly maybe not

[Moony]

Originally Posted by gulliverfoyle

whilst interest rates are low then a mortgage is a good bet but if they rise suddenly maybe not

But - if interest rates do rise, it also affects the cost to the landlord (assuming their property is mortgaged). This cost will have to be passed onto the tenant. Also as rental becomes more attractive due to the rise in mortgage payments, the law of supply and demand dictates that rent prices will go up.

[YoungAtHeart]

Originally Posted by Moony

But - if interest rates do rise, it also affects the cost to the landlord (assuming their property is mortgaged). This cost will have to be passed onto the tenant. Also as rental becomes more attractive due to the rise in mortgage payments, the law of supply and demand dictates that rent prices will go up.

With high interest rates, people will not want mortgages or people will loose their homes. Therefore, the housing market will correct itself along with rental prices.

I can't see our property prices continuously increasing now. This is because interest rates will go up at some point and also, we all compete economically on a global level now. How can we compete with countries like America where property prices are now low or Germany where they tend to rent so avoid the property bubbles altogether? We can't.

Therefore, eventually our housing market will need to rectify itself to bring us in-line with other countries.

[Cornucopia]

Originally Posted by gulliverfoyle

your assuming interest rate of 4% thats very low a historic low they wont stay that way over 25years

the avg is about 7%

interest rates have been 15% in the past

also we have had more or less continuous price increases for the last 50 years they will not continue they could easily drop 20%

say on a £100k mortage at 4% youd pay £500 mth

but on 15% youd pay £1200 mth

whilst interest rates are low then a mortgage is a good bet but if they rise suddenly maybe not

We'd expect rental prices to increase with mortgage rates, too, of course.

And whilst a fixed rate is an option for a home-buyer, it isn't for a renter.

Anyone who thinks they will be in the home for a long while, would be well-advised to look at a long-term fixed rate, preferably one with good over-payment windows. As an example, HSBC presently have a 7-year fixed rate of 3.99% available.

Obviously the concerns about rising interest rates apply mainly to people in their first few years of a mortgage. After that, you'd be unlucky not to have increased your income to compensate.

Finally, whilst local/temporary fluctuations in price are guaranteed, the long-term trend for an ownership period of, say, 50 years is positive. Probably by quite a large margin.

[YoungAtHeart]

Originally Posted by Cornucopia

We'd expect rental prices to increase with mortgage rates, too, of course.

And whilst a fixed rate is an option for a home-buyer, it isn't for a renter.

Anyone who thinks they will be in the home for a long while, would be well-advised to look at a long-term fixed rate, preferably one with good over-payment windows.

Obviously the concerns about rising interest rates apply mainly to people in their first few years of a mortgage. After that, you'd be unlucky not to have increased your income to compensate.

Finally, whilst local/temporary fluctuations in price are guaranteed, the long-term trend for an ownership period of, say, 50 years is positive. Probably by quite a large margin.

In 50 years? How do you know? Any number of events can occur in that time period.

Anyway, people like you originally bought in the property boom years but these times are over now. With globalisation, I can't see our property prices going up much in value at all.

[galaxy99]

Originally Posted by TigerBlood

I'd say it's pretty obvious, and I think the only reason people don't buy is because they can't afford the deposit, or lack the job security for a mortgage.

Why would you spend £1,000 a month on renting which goes straight into someone else's pocket, when you could pay the same yourself and eventually get the best part of 70% (or whatever it turns out to be following interest rates) back again.

Seems a complete no brainer to me!

Added to that you've got security, you know that you can't be thrown out of the house at a months notice. You can also make changes to a property you own, not to one which you rent.

Although if you want to keep on renting, please feel free

my rent is £280 a month for a 2 bedroom house from an association, not £1,000. If anything goes wrong then you get it fixed for free, boiler and radiators brand new, and who does have job security, I think this recession answered any questions about job security. Also we do not know what is around the corner and god forbid you should become ill in your old age they will sell your house for your care bill. The sad fact is that in my own experience I have seen so many children who do not give a hoot about their parents but if there is a whiff of a death coming they are their waiting and looking out for their own interests (the house) , i find there are too may things against buying,especially if you want to move,in this climate it could take for ever to sell your house

my brother bought his house and had the worst neighbours ever, but he couldn't move because when it came it was too late as the prices were crashing. So he ended up in a house that he hates and cannot sell, eventually renting it out..

[Moony]

Originally Posted by YoungAtHeart

With globalisation, I can't see our property prices going up much in value at all.

Even if property prices don't rise significantly - its still worth buying because over the term of a mortgage, its still cheaper than renting - and at the end you still own an asset.

There is nothing stopping you selling that asset at the end of your mortgage term and renting instead. You could be in the same position as somebody who has rented all their life - but have the additional bonus of a cash lump sum.

[galaxy99]

Originally Posted by irishguy

And theres no way I'd give it away to offspring when I get on... sell it, buy a campervan and go travelling is a much better idea

that sounds like a plan, another good idea I have heard is when you get to retirement you can sell it and get the money but rent it back off the same company. if the mortgage is paid off by the time of retirement I think people should who own the house should get the benefits and have a good retirement like a cruise or 2

[soulboy77]

Originally Posted by ganderpoke66

Some people love having a huge financial albatross around their necks for 20-25 years.

A house is an asset. Even if you found yourself in a position after a number of years where you could no longer afford the mortgage and had to sell up, you would still be better off than if you rented. Renting is only an advantage if you need to live in a particular area short term.

[YoungAtHeart]

Originally Posted by Moony

Even if property prices don't rise significantly - its still worth buying because over the term of a mortgage, its still cheaper than renting - and at the end you still own an asset.

There is nothing stopping you selling that asset at the end of your mortgage term and renting instead. You could be in the same position as somebody who has rented all their life - but have the additional bonus of a cash lump sum.

I do agree that the idea of not needing to pay anything for a few years to keep a roof over your head is an attractive one once the house has been paid off. However, there are still all the fees involved for buying property and on maintenance to take into account that renters don't have to deal with.

If you rent however, if you find ourself out of work later on life which seems normal these days, the government will help you out with your housing needs anyway.

You are also assuming that people will never loose their jobs and/or need to take another job in a different city or country and therefore need to move home too.

Finally, if house prices don't go up by much then you aren't going to make any money on it either.

[Nickelback]

Security, when the house is ours which is in six months time,we could pay it off now if we wanted...Knowing you've got a roof over your head for the rest of your life, we didn't buy for profit,but to live in it.

There was a bit of sacrifice in the begining no new cars, fancy holidays,we lived within our means, i think it was worth it....

[Punkchick]

I never even considered not buying a house. It is cheaper for us, we pay £1001 pm on the mortgage, however identical properties on my road rent out for £1400-1500 pm, so lets take the lowest one, that's £4800 per year saved, and believe me, it doesn't cost that much in upkeep. I will be mortgage free one month before my 40th Birthday so will have many years happily living rent/mortgage free. If I lost my job through no fault of my own, then my mortgage will be paid for upto two years through insurance, I also have the equivilant of 6 months worth of wages in savings, so no worries there. It also means I can retire at 50 as per my plan. I sold my last house after being made redundant and moving area, it was no big deal.
Everyone in my family buys property, nobody except those at uni have rented. Even my niece bought her first flat with her boyfriend earlier this year at the age of 20, and yes they saved up the deposit themselves.

[Moony]

Originally Posted by YoungAtHeart

Finally, if house prices don't go up by much then you aren't going to make any money on it either.

No - but the point is - you don't lose the money either - you still own the asset at the end of the term (or part of it mid term), so in a way, a large percentage (~30% at the start and 70% at the end) of your mortgage repayment is in effect being saved for you.

With rent - you lose 100% of your rent every month - and rents generally increase over time, whereas mortgage payments may go up or down.

[juliancarswell]

Originally Posted by galaxy99

my rent is £280 a month for a 2 bedroom house from an association, not £1,000. If anything goes wrong then you get it fixed for free, boiler and radiators brand new, and who does have job security, I think this recession answered any questions about job security. Also we do not know what is around the corner and god forbid you should become ill in your old age they will sell your house for your care bill. The sad fact is that in my own experience I have seen so many children who do not give a hoot about their parents but if there is a whiff of a death coming they are their waiting and looking out for their own interests (the house) , i find there are too may things against buying,especially if you want to move,in this climate it could take for ever to sell your house

my brother bought his house and had the worst neighbours ever, but he couldn't move because when it came it was too late as the prices were crashing. So he ended up in a house that he hates and cannot sell, eventually renting it out..

The village where we live still has a few council houses left that weren't bought up in the RTB under Thatcher.
A housing association took over from the council about10 years ago and the first thing to go was the right to transfer of tenancy. One person I know is in his 70s and looked after by his single 40yr old daughter. When he goes for the big sleep they will have her out of their nice 3 bedroom house and into a flat god knows where quicker than you could say flit.
As was pointed out by somebody else, the decision to not allow the money from the sale of council houses to be used to build more low cost/rental homes has led to a massive shortages especially in rural areas.
This single woman gave up a job and pension security to look after her dad at home and in doing so saved the state at least £30,000 a year for 10 years.
Her reward will be (if shes lucky) to be moved to a flat in a town miles from everybody she knows.

[Cowie]

Originally Posted by YoungAtHeart

Property prices don't always go up. They sometimes go down.

That they do. The house my friend bought the previous owners had paid $1000 more for it 10 years prior. We had a huge slump in my city due to a few industrial sites closing down and laying off people.

However had they rented it for 10 years and been paying say $70 a week they'd have wound up paying $36,400 and in the end walked away with not one cent so they didn't technically lose money. They had a roof over their heads for less than 36k. They'd made payments for 10 years off that debt so walked away with some money.

We bought our house in 2001 for 30,000 and it's now worth about 200,000 - 220,000. I'm 33 and a few times we've had our mortgage down to a grand. Our repayments are $50 a week. Rent in my street would be $250 a week.

Yeah my house is worth far far more than it was but it would also cost me that and more to get into another place, a bigger nicer place. It'd be false economy for me to cash in on the equity to buy bigger and better especially given property prices will never ever rise like that again in my lifetime.