Jay is tough - he beat up Conner remember. This was bad and him, Phil and Ben should be locked up
Does anyone else feel sorry for Jay?
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Originally Posted by milmol:
“This is what i was going to post. But also wanted to say that this is often typical of people generally, especially the very next day or whatever. they don't analyse or look back on events, they just react, especially about something so raw. So in actual fact i think its probably quite a realistic initial reaction from the community. Us as viewers "should" feel sorry for him, i think, because we are the only ones who've seen what he's been going through”
“This is what i was going to post. But also wanted to say that this is often typical of people generally, especially the very next day or whatever. they don't analyse or look back on events, they just react, especially about something so raw. So in actual fact i think its probably quite a realistic initial reaction from the community. Us as viewers "should" feel sorry for him, i think, because we are the only ones who've seen what he's been going through”
I know but that offten shows that such people are (forgive me) not very educated. It's a bit like the way Fiz reacted in Coronation Street when John confessed to killing Charlotte and Joy;
"The Websters were right about him. I don't know who he is any more." etc when she saw just as the viewers did the way he couldn't sleep properly after Charlotte died and the way he had two mental breakdowns etc and he himself admitted he felt a lot of guilt and refused to take Joy's money on principle and she didn't know the full circumstances surrounding what he did either.
In the Fiz/John case though I'm glad she forgave him in the end. Of course that doesn't mean he is absolved of responsibility - if he didn't die he would have gone to prison/hospital and quite rightly (though in that case hospital would have been more appropriate) - but she should have forgiven him herself sooner. As a viewer who knew everything I forgave him earlier than Fiz did.
Back to this storyline though - at least Roxy noticed Ben hugged her on that night though we know that was because he had blood on his hand and didn't want to shake her hand though I am surprised she didn't twig that Phil knew and covered for Ben - it was obvious. She met Phil and Ben on their way back and Phil told her to lie about it.
Originally Posted by ray.ray.returns:
“Jay is tough - he beat up Conner remember. This was bad and him, Phil and Ben should be locked up”
“Jay is tough - he beat up Conner remember. This was bad and him, Phil and Ben should be locked up”
When was that? I don't remember.
I think that Roxy has twigged - she's not totally stupid. She knows that if Ben and Jay were both at the scene of the crime a brief time earlier and Phil was with them then there is a high chance he was involved. Plus, why be leaning on everyone to lie if there isn't more to come out - he can't even provide an explanation. She said it, we're just supposed to do what you say no questions asked or words to that effect and his one answer reply - yes. She knows he was involved and probably knows that he's been making Jay and Ben keep quiet aal this time.
I don't actually think hugging her was just because he didn't want to shake hands, would that be the normal way they'd greet each other usually? I think he was upset a bit and she was a friendly face who he has known since he was little - it was a comfort thing in my opinion.
I don't actually think hugging her was just because he didn't want to shake hands, would that be the normal way they'd greet each other usually? I think he was upset a bit and she was a friendly face who he has known since he was little - it was a comfort thing in my opinion.
Since when was Syed Masood so judgemental? You would think he would know better than anyone what it's like to be gossiped by the community.
Re: Jay he is not totally innocent as he did keep quiet but you could tell he felt genuine remorse and guilt over what happened unlike Ben. There was nothing Jay could have done to stop Ben killing Heather. He then fled the scene. Ben killed her and the cover up was Phil's idea. Jay, worried he'd lose everything, was manipulated into keeping the secret. So yes I feel sorry for him.
Re: Jay he is not totally innocent as he did keep quiet but you could tell he felt genuine remorse and guilt over what happened unlike Ben. There was nothing Jay could have done to stop Ben killing Heather. He then fled the scene. Ben killed her and the cover up was Phil's idea. Jay, worried he'd lose everything, was manipulated into keeping the secret. So yes I feel sorry for him.
I felt sorry for Jay in as much as that I seem to remember a scene last year some time when Ben I think it was said to Jay that Phil would have no qualms throwing him out of the 'family' if he did something Phil didn't like. Jay wouldn't believe it thinking as him and Phil were as thick as thieves there was no way that would ever happen and that he was solid when it came to being classed as one of the family. Sadly Ben's words have come true and now it's come to it Jay has found himself alone. So I feel sorry for Jay in that he's discovered he isn't the part of the family he thought he was and has discovered this in a very harsh way.
Originally Posted by Lizzie Brookes:
“When was that? I don't remember.”
“When was that? I don't remember.”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZuNR0-Qk6t8
I hated that stupid scene yesterday where Jay's walking slowly through the square and all the other residents are looking on and judging him...
. Such a stupid clichéd scene and Eastenders use it all the time.
Most of the people stood round gossiping and judging him are hardly angels themselves. I cringed at the fact that it was Syed of all people who said 'What did Heather ever do to you?'. Yes Syed, because you have never made a mistake and you and Heather were best mates, right?.
You'd think some of them would realise that that Jay was living with psycho Phil Mitchell and his equally psycho son and so going to the police might not have been the easiest thing to do!
Afterall, how many of them have been terrorised by Phil at some point themselves? And Jay is only young with no real family around to protect him.
However, having said that, I do think it was stupid of Jay to ever have gotten involved with Phil and Ben in the first place. Considering how Jase died, you would think that Jay would be keen to avoid men like Phil Mitchell.... instead he goes and lives with him and his psycho son!
Of course Jay could never have envisioned this happening but I think the writers should have kept him with Billy.
. Such a stupid clichéd scene and Eastenders use it all the time.Most of the people stood round gossiping and judging him are hardly angels themselves. I cringed at the fact that it was Syed of all people who said 'What did Heather ever do to you?'. Yes Syed, because you have never made a mistake and you and Heather were best mates, right?
.You'd think some of them would realise that that Jay was living with psycho Phil Mitchell and his equally psycho son and so going to the police might not have been the easiest thing to do!
Afterall, how many of them have been terrorised by Phil at some point themselves? And Jay is only young with no real family around to protect him.
However, having said that, I do think it was stupid of Jay to ever have gotten involved with Phil and Ben in the first place. Considering how Jase died, you would think that Jay would be keen to avoid men like Phil Mitchell.... instead he goes and lives with him and his psycho son!
Of course Jay could never have envisioned this happening but I think the writers should have kept him with Billy.
You would think they would be used to deranged psychos now anyway, and simply go "oh another murder dear dear. whats for lunch?"
Originally Posted by kitkat1971:
“I think that Roxy has twigged - she's not totally stupid. She knows that if Ben and Jay were both at the scene of the crime a brief time earlier and Phil was with them then there is a high chance he was involved. Plus, why be leaning on everyone to lie if there isn't more to come out - he can't even provide an explanation. She said it, we're just supposed to do what you say no questions asked or words to that effect and his one answer reply - yes. She knows he was involved and probably knows that he's been making Jay and Ben keep quiet aal this time.
I don't actually think hugging her was just because he didn't want to shake hands, would that be the normal way they'd greet each other usually? I think he was upset a bit and she was a friendly face who he has known since he was little - it was a comfort thing in my opinion.”
“I think that Roxy has twigged - she's not totally stupid. She knows that if Ben and Jay were both at the scene of the crime a brief time earlier and Phil was with them then there is a high chance he was involved. Plus, why be leaning on everyone to lie if there isn't more to come out - he can't even provide an explanation. She said it, we're just supposed to do what you say no questions asked or words to that effect and his one answer reply - yes. She knows he was involved and probably knows that he's been making Jay and Ben keep quiet aal this time.
I don't actually think hugging her was just because he didn't want to shake hands, would that be the normal way they'd greet each other usually? I think he was upset a bit and she was a friendly face who he has known since he was little - it was a comfort thing in my opinion.”
She really is completely stupid. Poor Amy
Max preaching poor Jay was laughable. Isn't he the one whose daughter run him over and had forgiven his bitch wife who tried to bury him alive and kept her secret? Also has countless affairs, defends his brother Derek who was a criminal. The list could go on..
Originally Posted by funcat650:
“Max preaching poor Jay was laughable. Isn't he the one whose daughter run him over and had forgiven his bitch wife who tried to bury him alive and kept her secret? Also has countless affairs, defends his brother Derek who was a criminal. The list could go on..”
“Max preaching poor Jay was laughable. Isn't he the one whose daughter run him over and had forgiven his bitch wife who tried to bury him alive and kept her secret? Also has countless affairs, defends his brother Derek who was a criminal. The list could go on..”
I was thinking the exact same thing, he also helped his brother drive david out the square and did some dodgy stuff in manchester. Tanya going to be preaching soon, another hypocrite. When she covered up what lauren did and buried max alive.
Everyone acting like saints and judging jay, it really gets on my nerves and they seem to be more angry at jay than ben.
Originally Posted by kitkat1971:
“I think that Roxy has twigged - she's not totally stupid. She knows that if Ben and Jay were both at the scene of the crime a brief time earlier and Phil was with them then there is a high chance he was involved. Plus, why be leaning on everyone to lie if there isn't more to come out - he can't even provide an explanation. She said it, we're just supposed to do what you say no questions asked or words to that effect and his one answer reply - yes. She knows he was involved and probably knows that he's been making Jay and Ben keep quiet aal this time.
I don't actually think hugging her was just because he didn't want to shake hands, would that be the normal way they'd greet each other usually? I think he was upset a bit and she was a friendly face who he has known since he was little - it was a comfort thing in my opinion.”
“I think that Roxy has twigged - she's not totally stupid. She knows that if Ben and Jay were both at the scene of the crime a brief time earlier and Phil was with them then there is a high chance he was involved. Plus, why be leaning on everyone to lie if there isn't more to come out - he can't even provide an explanation. She said it, we're just supposed to do what you say no questions asked or words to that effect and his one answer reply - yes. She knows he was involved and probably knows that he's been making Jay and Ben keep quiet aal this time.
I don't actually think hugging her was just because he didn't want to shake hands, would that be the normal way they'd greet each other usually? I think he was upset a bit and she was a friendly face who he has known since he was little - it was a comfort thing in my opinion.”
Yeah it could have been a comfort thing as well, showing that Ben is not completely bad but he did have blood on his hand as well because he got it on her coat and then was forced to put her coat in the washing machine, pretending she got curry on it.
Originally Posted by Lousiana:
“Since when was Syed Masood so judgemental? You would think he would know better than anyone what it's like to be gossiped by the community.
Re: Jay he is not totally innocent as he did keep quiet but you could tell he felt genuine remorse and guilt over what happened unlike Ben. There was nothing Jay could have done to stop Ben killing Heather. He then fled the scene. Ben killed her and the cover up was Phil's idea. Jay, worried he'd lose everything, was manipulated into keeping the secret. So yes I feel sorry for him.”
“Since when was Syed Masood so judgemental? You would think he would know better than anyone what it's like to be gossiped by the community.
Re: Jay he is not totally innocent as he did keep quiet but you could tell he felt genuine remorse and guilt over what happened unlike Ben. There was nothing Jay could have done to stop Ben killing Heather. He then fled the scene. Ben killed her and the cover up was Phil's idea. Jay, worried he'd lose everything, was manipulated into keeping the secret. So yes I feel sorry for him.”
We know that but the square doesn't know it because everyone who knew of Phil's involvement kept quiet about it.
It'll eventually come out that Phil was involved and the people will understand why Jay couldn't tell the truth earlier
Originally Posted by Jimmy Skitz:
“It'll eventually come out that Phil was involved and the people will understand why Jay couldn't tell the truth earlier”
“It'll eventually come out that Phil was involved and the people will understand why Jay couldn't tell the truth earlier”
I hope so. It's only fair.
Originally Posted by Lizzie Brookes:
“I hope so. It's only fair.”
“I hope so. It's only fair.”
isn't Phil; about to take a break from the show again? I'll bet Shirley reveals all in the Vic or something and Phil does a runner
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