They all have to keep making headlines and that has always been the case when the show was huge or now when it's still huge but not as huge. Casting is the main way to do it - any TV producer would be delighted to find a "friend of Amy Winehouse" auditioning for them - they might even circulate this information to the media. The Voice wasn't short on hard working PR's hyping up the BGT battle or even stupid stuff like Will.i.am tweeting, Jessie J storming around bickering with Danny Cohen... and there were plenty more.

Why should it have people watching for the amazing talent on show? It's like saying people should only watch Top Gear to see cars or The Apprentice to see the awesome business talent (cough cough) on display or Strictly to see great dancing. People watch TV to be entertained by different personalities and stories - whether it's drama, comedy, entertainment or even sport. If it were just that people wanted to watch a show with musical talent then broadcasters would be scrambling to produce a TOTP revival and Jools Holland would get 10m viewers.


IIRC the definition they used in 2004 was that The X Factor is the elusive quality that makes a good singer a star. They cited Kylie, Robbie and Madonna quite a lot. It's basically about finding a potential popstar. It might be that writing their own songs or playing an instrument or performing a dance routine helps. But it's far from essential.

looks on wikipedia

Nothing's Real but Love rings a bell, however looking at where Glitter and Gold charted, I dont hold out much hope for her.

I think some are looking for 15 minutes (Rylan stands out for this). But the main draw is no doubt the potential to be the next Susan Boyle, One Direction, Kelly Clarkson. Most contestants do seem to take it quite seriously and a lot of them have industry background. Stacey and Jedward in 2009 were probably the first "famous for being famous" sorts to come out of the show. Generally they just disappear instantly unless they get a record deal.

Contestants might not get a pop career but they might land a job. Laya Manoochehri probably isn't a name that rings a bell but way back in 2008 she was the hot member of the week one eliminated group Girlband. Tonight she was back under the guise of "Syco TV Music Assistant".

I dont think many UK acts care about being the next Kelly Clarkson, she is far too country that. (Personally I like a little bit of country) however its fair to say she has gone from being an Idol winner to crave out a much more creative neiche.

As for Susan Boyle, ive said this before, yes she has a great voice, but thats it, to my knowledge her albums are long lists of covers, and the kind of thing you buy Mum for Christmas, she is not the creative success some would make her out to be.

I wouldn't call Kelly 'country' and she's done really well internationally - she's the only American Idol winner (to the best of my knowledge) to find success in this country.

I could have sworn she had won a CMA*, maybe im thinking of someone else. Also would not say she is highly successful over here.

* but not according to wikipedia.

In some cases these people live their whole lives wanting a career in music, the X Factor can be their last chance of making it. To simply say they should know what they're getting in for isn't really fair because some of these people are desperate and the show feeds off that and builds their hopes up and then crushes them, its a pretty shitty way to do it really.


Everything that happened tonight has been done before and done better. The "mystery producer" has been talking to judges just before the sing-off before, it's just repeating old storylines. This "controversy" will be forgotton about soon enough, there isn't really an angle they can continue with.


The XF producers know how to push the viewers buttons for sure but it's very much preeching to the converted. Twitter may have been on fire but it's always on fire to an extent, ITV don't get more ad revenue for extra tweets. I can't see it really doing anything ratings wise.

Well her last album went to number 5 here. Certainly nothing to stick your nose up at considering she won Idol years ago. She's doing fine.

this is news to me, have I not been getting my Kelly Clarkson memos?

Kelly Clarkson has been very successful both in the US and elsewhere as has Jordin Sparks to a degree, only one who been successful but not cracked other countries is Carrie Underwood but she's a Country singer and generally that doesn't sell well outside the US.

Whether someone is a creative success (or not) is unimportant IMO.Surely it's about whether they can sell records and/or sell concert tickets?

I agree with your views on Susan Boyle, but it's certainly not harmed her popularity. To be fair I guess over the years there will have been artists who will have tired of being pushed along a certain direction and decided to move record label and/or producer to express their "creative talent". And I guess after having made it big it's easier (financially) to do that.

They've got The Voice as well now.

Maybe I could have phrased it better. The X Factor has a nasty habit of burning the contestants; it did it before, it did it tonight and it'll do it again. People have to calculate whether they're willing to take the risk of getting burnt.

And actually, not just the contestants but the judges as well. Gary's reputation has been hurt by the show IMO; Louis will forever be seen as a clown. Cheryl's reputation was built that nearly shot down, Dannii got out ok but then Simon's book came out...the show is tinged in a way even Got Talent isn't but that's why it gets the press talking. Very much like Big Brother at it's peak.

I think Rebecca Ferguson is more of an album seller. I know she had more pre-orders than 1Direction, Cher LLoyd and Matt Cardle with much less syco hype. And Glitter and Gold was used in the promos for the latest series of Underbelly, so I wouldn't say it was a poor single.

In terms of the country singer you're probably thinking of Carrie Underwood? Don't think she has much presence at all in the UK.

And in terms of Susan Boyle and bringing this back to ratings, reading what people have said this weekend are strictly trying to make a susan boyle moment out of Lisa Riley? She is by far the least well known (in my opinion) and when I saw she was included my initial thought was that she is the sort of non-entity you'd associate with IAC or Big Brother not strictly. She is on the large side so people don't think she is going to be talented but then she goes and gets the highest score. At least strictly have a talented talking point, this rylan bloke sounds like some desperate talentless wannabe (haven't seen him perform so can't back this up)

I was just choosing singers from a selection of the shows. Kelly does well here, Stronger was a big hit for her earlier this year. Carrie Underwood is the country singer you're thinking of. As for SuBo, she's not a songwriter, but she makes a fortune for doing the occasional bit of singing. I suspect quite a few 50 year old women would take that if offered! So long as these shows always have at least one high profile name in the media then they'll get people auditioning and viewers will buy into the premise. And I don't even think The Voice needs to find a star - so long as X Factor continues to prove talent shows can launch careers (and last years winners of XF look on course to do very well).


Should they just not have eliminations then? Everyone is going to be disappointed when they're eliminated. Tonight they'll both be disappointed because even Rylan now knows he's on borrowed time as the public plainly aren't into him at all.

Looking at that Twitter link, very interesting to see the male/female ratios watching the show. Obviously Strictly watched by much more females, Soccor AM and MOTD by more males, but most interesting is Take Me Out. For such a glamoured up and sort of cheesy show, it's 50/50 so I guess that will be safe for a while as both genders watch. I thought it would be 70/30 female to male ratio. (and this is coming from a bloke that watched it), so interesting a lot of males watch.

Now with XF, still annoyed by what I have seen, but surely the ratings should be better, a lot of talk, maybe the +1 will be high.

If we get demos it'll be interesting to see TMO's gender skew. It may be that Strictly has pulled in the women - something thats not been concentrated on enough in discussions on here; it might do well with young women as well - making both shows pretty bad together; its just TMO doesn't have the big older viewers to make it look similar to Strictly.

Leaving the male viewers of TMO untouched; but the women elsewhere. Strictly was maybe just too big and far reaching for TMO to pull its usual solid 4m; the worst show for it to be against is maybe Strictly.

I'm just saying that if X Factor isn't just about the singing then why are they just singing?


A lot of people are so fed up with X Factor that they have been calling for TOTP to be revived.

The difference between the likes of Rylan/Jedward/Wagner and Kylie/Robbie/Madonna is that the latter lot can sing and don't have to rely on their 'background stories'.

And correct me if I'm wrong, but when a new artist brings out a single (and they haven't come from a talent show) then not much is known about them e.g. PSY - Gangnam Style. They don't need a sob story to sell a single. Real artists don't need to mention that someone in their family is in jail or someone they know has died just to put their album at the top of the charts.

To me The Voice is a closer representation of the music industry than X Factor. It doesn't have to alter a result for publicity. Tonight has proved how desperate TXF producers actually are.

You know full well what I mean, there's eliminating someone fairly and then there's employing certain tricks to keep the favoured ones. Its not a level playing field, if they want to keep one contestant over another they will try and engineer that to happen, whether that be by the order they sing on a Saturday, giving more generous praise and producers telling judges how to vote in the sing-off.

It looks like Itv has picked up the Celebrity Diving format which was a breakout hit in Netherlands last month:

...Oh hell. I could see it working for the BBC under the Sports Relief banner but I'm not sure how it's going to be a hit on ITV1. And shouldn't Tom be a judge instead of a presenter?

I didn't think you were in favour of the Beeb buying formats from abroad?

I laughed at the last quote saying that they hope its as big as Total Wipeout, which is hardly a big show is it. But I am a fan of the format, have been from day one. I think with some well known celebrities, a good range of them from the fit to the unfit, there is potential here to get viewers and create some headlines and buzz along the way. The format has a danger element which was popular with the Dancing on Ice format in its early years [until it got all samey] and this could be recreated here in a different field of sport. It also features celebrities stripped almost nude which is a popular aspect of Im a Celebrity when theres fit contestants [I wouldnt mind a bit of Myleene Klass in this ].

Not all formats; just singing ones when we already have a singing show. Well, it's supposed to be a singing show...maybe I should drop that argument?

I could see it working on the BBC. Or maybe Channel 4 or Channel 5 - The Games did ok for Channel 4.

ITV seem to have some kind of curse on entertainment formats at the moment though. I can't see how they're going to pull it off.

In regards to this show, it has similarities to a German format called 'TV Total Turmspringen'. The German original began back in 2004 and the company who own the distribution rights are suing;

http://tbivision.com/news/2012/10/17274/17274/

How they launch it (and where) is probably key. Most likely Staurday nights over the summer but whether that is wise or not is another matter. If that is where they want to place it, launching it during the BGT final inbetween the show and results is wise. Otherwise they could always put it on Wednesdays at 8pm if it will just be an hour a week.

I actually think it could work well, Tom Daley would be a must, but considering how much he likes the limelight I'm sure he wont say no.