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Waiting for Chryed to Get It On - Christian & Syed (Part 268)


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Old 06-11-2012, 23:20
elphaba7589
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To be fair, Amira didn't turn up and demand that Yasmin go with her. She came to Syed about the fact that she's getting married, that they plan to settle in Birmingham and that they want Yasmin to live with them. I didn't see anyone laying down the law, I saw someone broaching a very difficult issue as sensitively as she could, in the 20 seconds she was allowed.

Yes, Yasmin is happy and settled with Chryed, but up to the point that Amira went travelling (possibly just a month or so ago - Christian's postcard line, "First Paris, now Rome" suggests that the trip started with Paris, not that Amira had been gone for months on end), she would have been happy and settled with her mother. She has not forgotten Amira; yes, she'll be upset initially when she leaves Chryed but after a short period she'll be absolutely fine.

I don't see Amira's desire to have Yasmin move with her as selfish, or as evidence she doesn't care for her daughter, I just don't. Despite their history Amira tells Christian she wants/ hopes he will continue to play a role in Yasmin's life - if this isn't proof that she's grown and that actually she cares first and foremost about Yasmin, what is it? She has the chance to build a new life for them, to provide emotional and financial stability (not that Chryed can't, but this is about Amira as a mother) and of course she wants this, for her daughter and for herself. Having seen the scene tonight I don't think for a minute she's getting pleasure at the thought of separating Yasmin from Chryed, but her fiance's professional, financial, personal ties are elsewhere - this is the reality of the situation.

Re. the fiance: IMO at this late stage in the s/l the fact that Amira has become engaged quickly is neither here nor there. She's clearly happy, she's marrying him, that's it. From what I can remember we had a spoiler that the fiance actually appears on screen, so it sounds like he comes to collect Yasmin with Amira. I bet he's lovely, the ideal man. This isn't about Yasmin being wrenched from the arms of loving, decent parents and sentenced to a life of torment with people who don't have what it takes to love her or raise her well. This story is about Syed: fiance's going to be caring, charming, successful, keen to become the best stepfather he can to Yasmin, and it will just help to confirm in Syed's mind that he's made a mess of everything in his own life.
I can't accept her 'nice' behaviour though. After everything she did last year and never getting any comeuppance and never even apologising or realising how appallingly she behaved. She can't be redeemed just by coming back and appearing to be nice this time. Not after how appalling her behaviour was.

And I think this sends out a horrible message. Two men being dad's, suddenly the mother comes back and takes her away to live hundreds of miles away. It's so unfair. Imo Chryd are much better parents because they are loving, kind, generous, and can be selfless. Amira has none of these qualities. That being said Yasmin should have all 3 parents in her life. But Amira is severely restricting the time that Yasmin's dad's can spend with her by taking her away. For my own sanity I have to believe that after they leave they go and live near Brum and are a huge part of Yasmin's life.

Probably I would be much more accepting of Amira doing this did I not hate her so much. But after how she behaved last time, I can't not hate her, Amira :sleep:
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Old 06-11-2012, 23:20
Rhumbatugger
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After re-watching (yes again lol) I think Syed couldn't say ILY because he's worried it's not enough. It's his last, final, ultimate card that's always worked before (if you get what I mean) and he realises he's really ballsed it up, hates himself, and is guilt-ridden. It could be that they can't get over it. If he puts a foot wrong, if he says ILY and it changes nothing then he's truly lost Christian.

Of course what he needs to realise is that's what C needs to hear most!
Yep, he either just doesn't get it, which seems massively insensitive to Christian.

Or he can't put himself on the line and risk it, for Christian.
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Old 06-11-2012, 23:21
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Not Chryed related, but if you're watching election coverage:
http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/odd/news...ney-watch.html
LOL.

Katrina - I've got nothing I'm still grieving that we never got to see Christian in black outfit/quiff hair and Syed in grey tee at the same time

Oh, and no bloody joint TV interview!
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Old 06-11-2012, 23:21
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Yeah, this.

Gittins scripts are usually a mess. I found Sharon's speech about why she and Phil are not perfect parents to be totally cheesy. :sleep:
Cheesy and also very 'Sharon', at her most stagey and breathy.
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Old 06-11-2012, 23:24
PoppyMay
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And this is possibly the greatest thing I've ever seen. /no hype. :sleep:
You need to re-watch NYE kiss
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Old 06-11-2012, 23:27
KatrinaK
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And this is possibly the greatest thing I've ever seen. /no hype. :sleep:
HA HA HA!

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Old 06-11-2012, 23:28
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That shirt I wore that when the psychiatrist who
had to "cure" his homosexuality was at home.
Marc is more handsome every day
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Old 06-11-2012, 23:29
momentarything
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Yep, he either just doesn't get it, which seems massively insensitive to Christian.

Or he can't put himself on the line and risk it, for Christian.
It's definitely not the former. Christian made it very clear on Friday he could move past it all as long as he knew Syed loved him. And that looong pause between 'because' and 'Yasmin loves you' said he knew what he needed to say and couldn't, for whatever reason.

I'm not sure it's the latter either, though. I really hope we get a proper explanation of this and it's really not just 'pride' because that doesn't really make much sense to me personally. Why would you be too proud to say 'I love you' to your husband when you can beg them to come home?? What is it about those particular words? I'm not sure they can make me buy into this, though, tbh. I do hope it's more than 'I couldn't say it because I was too proud', though. Regardless, I really think they're oversimplifying it all by bringing it back to whether or not Syed can say 'I love you'. I don't think it should be about if he loves Christian- he clearly does- but how much and whether it's enough.
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Old 06-11-2012, 23:35
PoppyMay
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It's definitely not the former. Christian made it very clear on Friday he could move past it all as long as he knew Syed loved him. And that looong pause between 'because' and 'Yasmin loves you' said he knew what he needed to say and couldn't, for whatever reason.

I'm not sure it's the latter either, though. I really hope we get a proper explanation of this and it's really not just 'pride' because that doesn't really make much sense to me personally. Why would you be too proud to say 'I love you' to your husband when you can beg them to come home?? What is it about those particular words? I'm not sure they can make me buy into this, though, tbh. I do hope it's more than 'I couldn't say it because I was too proud', though. Regardless, I really think they're oversimplifying it all by bringing it back to whether or not Syed can say 'I love you'. I don't think it should be about if he loves Christian- he clearly does- but how much and whether it's enough.
You can love someone massively, more than you'll ever love any one else, but not be right for each other or find a way to be together, happily. For life stuff to get in the way.

NOT that this applies to Chryed.
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Old 06-11-2012, 23:38
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It's definitely not the former. Christian made it very clear on Friday he could move past it all as long as he knew Syed loved him. And that looong pause between 'because' and 'Yasmin loves you' said he knew what he needed to say and couldn't, for whatever reason.

I'm not sure it's the latter either, though. I really hope we get a proper explanation of this and it's really not just 'pride' because that doesn't really make much sense to me personally. Why would you be too proud to say 'I love you' to your husband when you can beg them to come home?? What is it about those particular words? I'm not sure they can make me buy into this, though, tbh. I do hope it's more than 'I couldn't say it because I was too proud', though. Regardless, I really think they're oversimplifying it all by bringing it back to whether or not Syed can say 'I love you'. I don't think it should be about if he loves Christian- he clearly does- but how much and whether it's enough.


The line tonight about wanting to stay in 'prison' and Syed's phonecall about how he'd been 'thinking' seems to indicate that actually although he loves Christian, he was not sure that he loves him enough to stay with him.

And yes, he knows how much Christian wants him to love him.

And yes, he's not witholding it out of pride, or fear.

He just didn't know ( I think he knows now) if he loved Christian enough - wanted to have adventure, took that even though it was a terrible betrayal, was dishonest to cover his back.

So, in short, I agree.

But it makes me feel so sad.

And makes his vows painfully half truths, and done with fake conviction.
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Old 06-11-2012, 23:42
PoppyMay
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I don't buy Syed not knowing if he loves Christian enough, I think it has much more to do with him feeling like he can't be enough for him. That 'I don't deserve you line' on Friday wasn't just a throw-away. guilt-ridden platitude. Syed feels terrible, disgusted that he cheated. He failed his family and at business again. He destroyed everything he wanted and loved. He just can't say it. It's a reflection of his self worth, to me, not how much he loves Christian. He left his family and risked hell for that man.

Stupid plot contrivance.
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Old 06-11-2012, 23:44
Rhumbatugger
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I don't buy Syed not knowing if he loves Christian enough, I think it has much more to do with him feeling like he can't be enough for him. That 'I don't deserve you line' on Friday wasn't just a throw-away. guilt-ridden platitude. Syed feels terrible, disgusted that he cheated. He failed his family and at business again. He destroyed everything he wanted and loved. He just can't say it. It's a reflection of his self worth, to me, not how much he loves Christian. He left his family and risked hell for that man.

Stupid plot contrivance.
So Syed is not saying it because he can't put himself on the line - even for the person he so loves and has wronged?

I don't bloody know, it's all horrendous.
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Old 06-11-2012, 23:45
momentarything
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The line tonight about wanting to stay in 'prison' and Syed's phonecall about how he'd been 'thinking' seems to indicate that actually although he loves Christian, he was not sure that he loves him enough to stay with him.

And yes, he knows how much Christian wants him to love him.

And yes, he's not witholding it out of pride, or fear.

He just didn't know ( I think he knows now) if he loved Christian enough.

So, in short, I agree.

But it makes me feel so sad.
I think his life had become all about debts and paying bills and pleasing everyone, which became even more intense as the wedding approached and he took over the AB. He's been with the same guy for 2.5 years, and he's the only person he's ever loved, or even properly dated, and he started to wonder if there was something else out there for him. At that point, it was just all about settling down and worrying about paying the bills and avoiding disappointing people. And I think, with everything else going on, Syed is questioning his own worthiness for the love Christian so freely gives him, and does feel like Christian loves him more than he can give, because he feels he can't offer him as much as Christian is willing to offer him. Very sad but realistic. He's realised, now, that what he has with Christian is as good as it gets- someone who is completely devoted to him- but it might be too late.

Still think the inability to say 'I love you' is crap, though. Massively simplistic and almost missing the point of their own story.
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Old 06-11-2012, 23:48
PoppyMay
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To say it and not mean it (and he's still in turmoil so he probably doesn't even trust himself to know what he means) would be another betrayal. He can't say it until it all clicks for him.
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Old 06-11-2012, 23:50
PoppyMay
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So Syed is not saying it because he can't put himself on the line - even for the person he so loves and has wronged?

I don't bloody know, it's all horrendous.
Because he would be wronging Christian again to say something he's not sure if he can follow through. When his self worth is that low he doesn't feel like he deserves it, so to say it means following through. He doesn't trust himself to commit to it. Not saying it, to me, shows how much he does love C because he won't say it unless he can back it up.

Plus, see Thursday for him saying it twice, with ease, and conviction
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Old 06-11-2012, 23:52
Rhumbatugger
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To say it and not mean it (and he's still in turmoil so he probably doesn't even trust himself to know what he means) would be another betrayal. He can't say it until it all clicks for him.
So, it hadn't 'clicked' for him at the wedding then? To be honest, I can live with that. The wedding actually cheesed me off.

He's been forced to face it now, and to decide what he wants. And mean it this time.
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Old 06-11-2012, 23:53
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Because he would be wronging Christian again to say something he's not sure if he can follow through. When his self worth is that low he doesn't feel like he deserves it, so to say it means following through. He doesn't trust himself to commit to it. Not saying it, to me, shows how much he does love C because he won't say it unless he can back it up.

Plus, see Thursday for him saying it twice, with ease, and conviction
Yes but it was just words - he's struggling to feel like he does love Christian enough to be with him now.
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Old 06-11-2012, 23:54
PoppyMay
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I think his life had become all about debts and paying bills and pleasing everyone, which became even more intense as the wedding approached and he took over the AB. He's been with the same guy for 2.5 years, and he's the only person he's ever loved, or even properly dated, and he started to wonder if there was something else out there for him. At that point, it was just all about settling down and worrying about paying the bills and avoiding disappointing people. And I think, with everything else going on, Syed is questioning his own worthiness for the love Christian so freely gives him, and does feel like Christian loves him more than he can give, because he feels he can't offer him as much as Christian is willing to offer him. Very sad but realistic. He's realised, now, that what he has with Christian is as good as it gets- someone who is completely devoted to him- but it might be too late.

Still think the inability to say 'I love you' is crap, though. Massively simplistic and almost missing the point of their own story.
That's what I'm trying to say!
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Old 06-11-2012, 23:54
momentarything
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Because he would be wronging Christian again to say something he's not sure if he can follow through. When his self worth is that low he doesn't feel like he deserves it, so to say it means following through. He doesn't trust himself to commit to it. Not saying it, to me, shows how much he does love C because he won't say it unless he can back it up.

Plus, see Thursday for him saying it twice, with ease, and conviction
BiB: But he says it on Friday, when he's letting Amira take Yasmin without consulting Christian, when even Amira has told him to talk to Christian? How does he not feel even more unworthy of it then, when he feels so crap about himself that he feels Amira can raise his baby with a stranger better than he can?

/hate this storyline.

edit: this sounds like I'm disagreeing with your post and I'm not. I think this is what EE are trying to get across but it's very confusing.
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Old 06-11-2012, 23:56
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BiB: But he says it on Friday, when he's letting Amira take Yasmin without consulting Christian, when even Amira has told him to talk to Christian? How does he not feel even more unworthy of it then, when he feels so crap about himself that he feels Amira can raise his baby with a stranger better than he can?

/hate this storyline.
He feels bad, but why didn't he talk to Christian? There may be deep psychological twisty reasons, but my goodness what a massive dick he's being.

And he's going to go bugeyedzainab on Christian and tell him to get lost soon as well.

Hate this storyline too. (And want to give Syed a series of smacks on the head, possibly with maracas.)
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Old 06-11-2012, 23:58
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A video about LGBT families that made me think of Chryed.
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Old 06-11-2012, 23:59
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Yes but it was just words - he's struggling to feel like he does love Christian enough to be with him now.
Yes, after Christian got beaten up by his sleazy, money-stealing ONS and Christian found out he cheated to him and lied on their wedding day. His head's not stuck in the sand anymore. Telling his soulmate, who now knows the extent of the lies and the cheating, that he loves him is a totally different ball game to Syed IMO. It's almost a cheek. He's probs thinking 'how can I say that to you, how can you want to hear it, after everything?'

That's why he told him Yasmin needs him and loves him. He was projecting what he wanted to say through her. IMO.

Self-esteem is a tricky thing. When you're depressed, insecure, lacking in self worth it manifests as selfish self-absorption and it can cause a lot of pain to those who love you, but to the sufferer (and I'm sure Syed must have some therapy-level issues after everything) it's torment. It's not intentional or knowing selfishness at all, and they can't see the affect they have or what is needed. They can't believe someone loves them enough to care.
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Old 06-11-2012, 23:59
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Er, hello :sleep: I got home from Brownies, watched the ep and then fell asleep during my catch up I shouldn't lie on my stomach with my head resting on my arm whilst on the laptop :sleep:

Anyway, congrats on the new part and MH on OP!

Tonight's ep, well...it was Gittins. I'll admit the prison line confused the hell out of me at first, but after my catchup I now understand what it means. It was still badly done though.

And as for Amira...:sleep: Maybe she'll have more to say on Thursday, that scene felt really rushed. And I don't think it's fair she's uprooting Yasmin so abruptly either, especially when this new guy's never met her and Amira's only known him a short while. Building the contact up gradually was a good idea from Syed, why didn't she listen to that? /plot purposes, I know :sleep:

Syed looked good tonight too. /shallow
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Old 07-11-2012, 00:01
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And he's going to go bugeyedzainab on Christian and tell him to get lost soon as well.

Hate this storyline too. (And want to give Syed a series of smacks on the head, possibly with maracas.)
I can actually believe that for his character, though. It's going to make me want to give him a slap but it's believable. Syed's always lashing out at people when they hit him where it hurts- and especially Christian. Not nice, but believable- which is all I need.

I do not believe that he wouldn't say he loves Christian when he desperately wants him home and has made it very clear.
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Old 07-11-2012, 00:02
PoppyMay
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BiB: But he says it on Friday, when he's letting Amira take Yasmin without consulting Christian, when even Amira has told him to talk to Christian? How does he not feel even more unworthy of it then, when he feels so crap about himself that he feels Amira can raise his baby with a stranger better than he can?

/hate this storyline.

edit: this sounds like I'm disagreeing with your post and I'm not. I think this is what EE are trying to get across but it's very confusing.
Because Syed can only deal with one thing at a time! He's really emotionally naive and immature IMO (cos the whole gay muslim / difficult family dynamic thing stunted him emotionally). He finally realises that he wants Christian and can back it up (maybe seeing Amira get her life together shifts something? Reminds him of how much they've all been through and acts as a catalyst). Then, he's so pleased he's figured it out and can tell him, he doesn't think 'but oh wait - Yasmin's off to her mum for the foreseeable'. Cue break up number 459.
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